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post #1 of 38 (permalink) Old 06-19-2008, 12:10 PM Thread Starter
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Question CHL / Texas Gun Law question

With the new Motorist Protection Act HB 1815 that went into effect in 2007, how or why is it even necessary to waste 10 hours and $125 on a CHL?

The new law is so broad that I don't see any need to bother with getting a CHL, which is something I was considering at one point.

I can legally carry my handgun without a permit to and from my car, in my car, and on my premise. That is providing that it's out of plain sight and I'm not committing a crime. Where is the need for a CHL after Sept. 1, 2007?

Quote:
Originally Posted by MR EDD View Post
it was not a problem to bring money to his house at 10pm.so why is it a problem to call and bitch.it wasnt a problem when we were all sitting around smoking pot together.yes i said it we all were smoking pot together.what now stupid.
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post #2 of 38 (permalink) Old 06-19-2008, 12:11 PM
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Because I like to conceal carry my guns outside of my vehicle?
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post #3 of 38 (permalink) Old 06-19-2008, 12:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David
Because I like to conceal carry my guns outside of my vehicle?
If you want it "on your person", you need it. I carried my gun in my car for years before the CHL even became available. I wanted to carry it wherever I want.

CHL holder and Conservative...AKA "Domestic Terrorist"
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post #4 of 38 (permalink) Old 06-19-2008, 12:16 PM
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Assuming you're not walking from your house to your car or from your car to your house, you have to be inside your car for that law to apply.

If you are standing outside of your car with a pistol on you, without a CHL you are in violation of the law.

As we were told in our CHL class, even if you're right outside your car (without a CHL), say at a gas station, and get mugged... you'd better sit your ass down in the driver's seat before displaying your weapon.


For me:
(Time spent walking to/from my car + time spent in car) < (Time spent outside of my car + walking anywhere other than to/from my car)


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post #5 of 38 (permalink) Old 06-19-2008, 12:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mustangman_2000
Where is the need for a CHL after Sept. 1, 2007?

Answer to question at hand
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post #6 of 38 (permalink) Old 06-19-2008, 12:54 PM Thread Starter
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Interesting.

So, I guess this is just something for those who are interested in having it on their person at all times.

Aren't there quite a bit of places you can't take it with you though? Most daycare centers have signs, my doctors office does, hospitals, courts, etc..

What about restaurants that serve alcohol? What about liquor stores?

Quote:
Originally Posted by MR EDD View Post
it was not a problem to bring money to his house at 10pm.so why is it a problem to call and bitch.it wasnt a problem when we were all sitting around smoking pot together.yes i said it we all were smoking pot together.what now stupid.
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post #7 of 38 (permalink) Old 06-19-2008, 01:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mustangman_2000
Aren't there quite a bit of places you can't take it with you though? Most daycare centers have signs, my doctors office does, hospitals, courts, etc..

Quote:
Texas Firearm Prohibited Places
1. Public or private schools, school sponsored activities, school vehicles, unless permitted in writing or by written regulations.
2. Premises of public polling place on day of voting or early voting.
3. Government court or court offices, unless permitted in writing or by written regulations.
4. At a racetrack (and possibly on racetrack parking lot).
5. In a secured area of an airport (except when in checked baggage).
6. Within 1,000 feet of place of execution if you have received notice it is prohibited (except while driving on public road or while at home or work).

Texas CHL Prohibited Places
1. On premises of 51% establishments.
2. On premises of high school, collegiate or professional sporting event.
3. On premises of a correctional facility.
4. On premises of hospital or nursing home, without proper authorization, if proper notice is given.
5. In an amusement park, if proper notice is given.
6. On premises of established place of worship, if proper notice is given, or you have received actual verbal notice.
7. At any meeting of a government entity, if proper notice is given.
(“Proper Notice” means the 30.06 sign)
(Premises does not include parking area)


The "30.06" sign:

These MUST have the exact verbage of the statue, in 1" tall letters, in contrasting colors, etc, etc.

Quote:
"Pursuant to Section 30.06, Penal Code (trespass by holder of license to carry a concealed handgun), a person licensed under Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code (concealed handgun law), may not enter this property with a concealed handgun;" or

(2) A sign posted on the property that:
(a) "includes" the above language in both English and Spanish;
(b) appears in contrasting colors with block letters at least one inch in height; and
(c) is displayed in a conspicuous manner clearly visible to the public.


Simple "no guns allowed" type signage does not apply to CHL holders.



Quote:
What about restaurants that serve alcohol? What about liquor stores?
Any establishment that makes 51% or more of its money from the sale of alcohol is off limits. They will have a big "51% sign" posted.


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post #8 of 38 (permalink) Old 06-19-2008, 01:10 PM
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Why not take the class? I bet some instructor somewhere will let you audit a class for a small fee. If you aren't owned by websense you can browse for texas chl study materials as well.

There is only one sign that is valid, it is designated by law. Your place of employment is exempt via written policy (ie: your HR manual or an email). Businesses which derive a certain percentage of total revenue (51%) are off limits as are certain institutions like federal buildings, but not necessarily the parking lots.

It is pretty lengthy in the details so like I say, if you really are curious and are making a decision based on that, why not go through the motions and find out for sure?

edit: 51%, I didn't know that. See, example of why the course itself would be a good place to learn.
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post #9 of 38 (permalink) Old 06-19-2008, 01:20 PM Thread Starter
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What all is required to pass the shooting range portion of the class?

Quote:
Originally Posted by MR EDD View Post
it was not a problem to bring money to his house at 10pm.so why is it a problem to call and bitch.it wasnt a problem when we were all sitting around smoking pot together.yes i said it we all were smoking pot together.what now stupid.
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post #10 of 38 (permalink) Old 06-19-2008, 01:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mustangman_2000
What all is required to pass the shooting range portion of the class?
Basically, you aim and shoot when commanded. If can follow instructions ("Fire..... Fire..... Fire...." etc) and hit paper then you should pass with ease.


3 yards, 20 rounds
1 shot, 2 seconds, 5 times
2 shots, 3 seconds, 5 times
5 shots, 10 seconds, 1 time

7 yards, 20 rounds
5 shots, 10 seconds, 1 time
2 shots, 4 seconds, 1 time
3 shots, 6 seconds, 1 time
1 shot, 3 seconds, 5 times
5 shots, 15 seconds, 1 time

15 yards, 10 rounds
2 shots, 6 seconds, 1 time
3 shots, 9 seconds, 1 time
5 shots, 15 seconds, 1 time


You have to score 75% (175/250 pts.) to pass.


Scoring
8,9 and 10 rings = 5 points
7 ring = 4 points
on target, outside rings = 3 points




NOT hard. I scored a 249 with a well used gun I had never seen before.


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post #11 of 38 (permalink) Old 06-19-2008, 02:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Strychnine
Any establishment that makes 51% or more of its money from the sale of alcohol is off limits. They will have a big "51% sign" posted.
Gotta correct you here...

It's any establishment that makes 51% or more of its money from the sale of alcohol for on premises consumption.

A liquor is a legal place to carry unless they have posted a 30.06 sign. You can also carry at your favorite restaurant and even in the bar area in said establishment as long as 51% of their money is not from on premises consumption of alcohol.

Honestly, in the 10 months I've been a CHL holder, I've only run into a handful of places I could NOT carry. The only places I have encountered the 30.06 sign is Taco Cabana, gun shows, Grapevine Mills Mall and a few hospitals. I carry everywhere I can, including at the bank.

Think about all of the violence that occurs in mall parking lots. Under HB 1815, you cannot legally carry in the mall without a CHL, so you are open to becoming a victim.

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post #12 of 38 (permalink) Old 06-19-2008, 03:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HOOCBB
Gotta correct you here...

It's any establishment that makes 51% or more of its money from the sale of alcohol for on premises consumption.
Noted.

Those 4 words are pretty important. Looks like everyone's learning a bit today.


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post #13 of 38 (permalink) Old 06-19-2008, 03:25 PM
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Good info..

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post #14 of 38 (permalink) Old 06-19-2008, 03:27 PM
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well according to my instructor the new law still does not allow you to carry the gun loaded without a chl so i think thats a pretty good reason


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post #15 of 38 (permalink) Old 06-19-2008, 03:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whitetrash
well according to my instructor the new law still does not allow you to carry the gun loaded without a chl so i think thats a pretty good reason
The word "loaded" is nowhere in HB 1815. No distinction made = carry loaded.




A gun without ammo isn't a weapon. It's just an expensive hammer.

Why would they go through the trouble if it was not to allow a person to defend themselves with the gun?


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post #16 of 38 (permalink) Old 06-19-2008, 03:40 PM
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CHL is for pussies!!!
whats the point of it anyways?
"oh look at me i have a gun in my pocket, i think im dirty fucking harry"
just my .02
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post #17 of 38 (permalink) Old 06-19-2008, 03:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whitetrash
well according to my instructor the new law still does not allow you to carry the gun loaded without a chl so i think thats a pretty good reason
Yes, it does.
Quote:
§ 46.02. UNLAWFUL CARRYING WEAPONS. (a) A person
commits an offense if the person intentionally, knowingly, or
recklessly carries on or about his or her person a handgun, illegal
knife, or club if the person is not:
(1) on the person's own premises or premises under the
person's control; or
(2) inside of or directly en route to a motor vehicle
that is owned by the person or under the person's control.
(a-1) A person commits an offense if the person
intentionally, knowingly, or recklessly carries on or about his or
her person a handgun in a motor vehicle that is owned by the person
or under the person's control at any time in which:
(1) the handgun is in plain view; or
(2) the person is:
(A) engaged in criminal activity, other than a
Class C misdemeanor that is a violation of a law or ordinance
regulating traffic;
(B) prohibited by law from possessing a firearm;
or
(C) a member of a criminal street gang, as
defined by Section 71.01.
(a-2) For purposes of this section, "premises" includes
real property and a recreational vehicle that is being used as
living quarters, regardless of whether that use is temporary or
permanent. In this subsection, "recreational vehicle" means a motor
vehicle primarily designed as temporary living quarters or a
vehicle that contains temporary living quarters and is designed to
be towed by a motor vehicle. The term includes a travel trailer,
camping trailer, truck camper, motor home, and horse trailer with
living quarters.
No mention of loaded or unloaded. You can carry a handgun concealed in your car as long as you're not breaking any laws (except Class C misdemeanor traffic laws/ordinances). Period.


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post #18 of 38 (permalink) Old 06-19-2008, 03:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cobraboy
CHL is for pussies!!!
whats the point of it anyways?
"oh look at me i have a gun in my pocket, i think im dirty fucking harry"
just my .02
Right, because that's exactly what "concealed" means.

What's the point of it? To be able to better defend yourself against an armed attacker if you have to.


Quote:
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post #19 of 38 (permalink) Old 06-19-2008, 03:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by That_Is_My_El_Camino
Right, because that's exactly what "concealed" means.

What's the point of it? To be able to better defend yourself against an armed attacker if you have to.
i have always been told dont but yourself in those situations.
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post #20 of 38 (permalink) Old 06-19-2008, 03:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cobraboy
CHL is for pussies!!!
whats the point of it anyways?
"oh look at me i have a gun in my pocket, i think im dirty fucking harry"
just my .02
And you're the stupidest fucker in this thread yet today. Since you know nothing about the reason for CHL and those who have the permits, STFU and step aside for those who actually know something about it or want to learn the facts.
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post #21 of 38 (permalink) Old 06-19-2008, 03:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Majestyk
And you're the stupidest fucker in this thread yet today. Since you know nothing about CHL and those who have them, STFU and step aside for those who actually know something about it or want to learn the facts.
ah fag yes i do have a fucking clue!!
i did the class and i decided against the CHL class after it was all said and done and yes i wasted the $90 back 2001.
i know the point to carry and my point was not to protect myself!!
so you, my gay friend, you would be the dumbest fuck ever!
what is your point of carrying a gun?????
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post #22 of 38 (permalink) Old 06-19-2008, 04:01 PM
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Pathetic job of sidestepping, with your tired old "fag" shit....go find something you're good at, it sure isn't this, fuckwad.

Why I carry, or don't carry, a gun is none of your fucking business. What part of "concealed' don't you understand?
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post #23 of 38 (permalink) Old 06-19-2008, 04:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Majestyk
Pathetic job of sidestepping, with your tired old "fag" shit....go find something you're good at, it sure isn't this, fuckwad.
your comments i yawn at!! so go fist fuck our self im done with you!
CHL does nothing for me!
you pull it you use it.
you use it you go to jail.
go to jail get a lawyer.
$$$$$$$
guilty or not, it still is going to cost you.
after all these bullshit you still have a CHL that did nothing for you
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post #24 of 38 (permalink) Old 06-19-2008, 04:10 PM
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Are you really as fucking stupid as you write?

Yes you are.......go read your yourself whining about electricity rates for a good example, fucktard.
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post #25 of 38 (permalink) Old 06-19-2008, 04:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cobraboy
your comments i yawn at!! so go fist fuck our self im done with you!
CHL does nothing for me!
you pull it you use it.
you use it you go to jail.
go to jail get a lawyer.
$$$$$$$
guilty or not, it still is going to cost you.
after all these bullshit you still have a CHL that did nothing for you
Guess you'll always be the statistical victim.
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post #26 of 38 (permalink) Old 06-19-2008, 04:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cobraboy
your comments i yawn at!! so go fist fuck our self im done with you!
CHL does nothing for me!
you pull it you use it.
you use it you go to jail.
go to jail get a lawyer.
$$$$$$$
guilty or not, it still is going to cost you.
after all these bullshit you still have a CHL that did nothing for you
I'd rather be judged by 12 than carried by 6.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cobraboy
i have always been told dont but yourself in those situations.
It is better to have it and not need it, than need it and not have it.

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post #27 of 38 (permalink) Old 06-19-2008, 04:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cobraboy
your comments i yawn at!! so go fist fuck our self im done with you!
CHL does nothing for me!
you pull it you use it.
you use it you go to jail.
go to jail get a lawyer.
$$$$$$$
guilty or not, it still is going to cost you.
after all these bullshit you still have a CHL that did nothing for you
If you don't like CHL then GTFO. It is OK with me if you don't like or agree with concealed carry, but don't come in here and insult me because I believe differently.

And by the way, just because you use it does not mean you are going to jail.

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post #28 of 38 (permalink) Old 06-19-2008, 04:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Majestyk
Are you really as fucking stupid as you write?

Yes you are.......go read your yourself whining about electricity rates for a good example, fucktard.
shhhhhh! you can have he last word here!!
sorry to
Mustangman_2000.
for this topic to get way off subject.
but "Mr Majestyk"
thinks its ok to sleep with his mamma too.
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post #29 of 38 (permalink) Old 06-19-2008, 04:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cobraboy
ah fag yes i do have a fucking clue!!
i did the class and i decided against the CHL class after it was all said and done and yes i wasted the $90 back 2001.
i know the point to carry and my point was not to protect myself!!
so you, my gay friend, you would be the dumbest fuck ever!
what is your point of carrying a gun?????
I'm not trying to be a smart ass, but there were 3 situations that changed my mind about carrying. I never really thought it was needed either until I was put in the following situations:
1. I had a guy with a really bad case of road rage. He pulled a handgun on me in traffic after we exchanged a few choice words. I was completely helpless and boxed in at the time so I was a sitting duck. If this guy would have been anymore off his rocker, I would have been shot sitting at a red light in Arlington.

2. I was at a birthday party for a buddy of mine when a guy in the front yard got into an altercation with another party goer. This drunk fuck went to his car and came back in the yard with a handgun. No one knew it at the time, but it was a CO2 powered BB gun. That doesn't excuse the fact as it can still cause plenty of damage. He just wanted to show everyone how badass he was.

3. One late night I was at the shop working on my car and come out around 1:30AM to find a guy walking though the parking lot with a 2X4 in his hand. I called to him from the door of the shop and told him to leave because he was trespassing and that the police have already been called. This set him off and next thing I know he is charging me coming straight for the door. I was lucky enough to get my keys out of my pocket in time to get the door locked right his he grabbed the door. What would I have done if I would have dropped my keys? I would have been at the mercy for this guy and left him a shop with $50k+ of tools not to mention customers' cars!

This is why I carry concealed and have my CHL. There has only been one time that I pulled my gun and it was chasing after a guy that had just stolen from a Tom Thumb by my house (at the time I didn't know if it had been robbed or not). The manager wasn't sure what he had and as he ran across the lot I pulled my weapon and started to chase after him. Once I realized he had 2 qts. of beer I stopped chasing him b/c to me it wasn't worth the headache of talking to the police. It was an interesting conversation with the manager after that. She still looks at me funny everytime I see her at the store lol.
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post #30 of 38 (permalink) Old 06-19-2008, 05:27 PM Thread Starter
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Well, I appreciate all of the good info on the subject. Again, getting a CHL was something I've considered but never really felt necessary. I was just looking more into the "traveling" laws and found HB 1815. It seems to grant a lot of privilege to an unlicensed carrier. Therefore, I found it somewhat confusing at first glance.

I'm still ambivalent about always carrying my handgun on my person. Anything can happen at anytime, but statistically it's unlikely that you will find yourself in a gun battle. Well, at least not the environment I live and work in. What I'm more focused on is just legally being armed while traveling, vacationing, or camping in remote areas. If HB 1815 means you have to be confined to your car or your property, then I can see the need for CHL. Prior to HB 1815, the "traveling" laws were very vague and could still easily get you arrested if you didn't know what to say and how to say it. It's nice to see that has been fixed with this new measure.

I do think that there are legitimate concerns in always carrying, but there is also a pinch of paranoia. I worry about getting into a habit of feeling the need to be constantly armed. I've spent my whole life not being armed and have never really had a major problem other than the occasional fist fight. I've never hung around a rough crowd. I guess I've been lucky.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MR EDD View Post
it was not a problem to bring money to his house at 10pm.so why is it a problem to call and bitch.it wasnt a problem when we were all sitting around smoking pot together.yes i said it we all were smoking pot together.what now stupid.

Last edited by Mustangman_2000; 06-19-2008 at 07:15 PM.
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post #31 of 38 (permalink) Old 06-19-2008, 05:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mustangman_2000
Interesting.

So, I guess this is just something for those who are interested in having it on their person at all times.

Aren't there quite a bit of places you can't take it with you though? Most daycare centers have signs, my doctors office does, hospitals, courts, etc..

What about restaurants that serve alcohol? What about liquor stores?
Only places I don't carry are courthouses and airports, my office (federal) and bars. If the sign is displayed, I don't care. If you are carrying correctly, they will never know you have it unless you need to use it and FUCK Taco Cabana.

Any place willfully preventing you from carrying is just asking for a criminal to walk in with a gun and cause trouble with little risk. Again, FUCK Taco Cabana.

As for the CHL is for pussies BS...get real. I actually needed the right to have it outside my car at the RaceTrack on Mockingbird near love field a few weeks ago. An indigent homeboy thug doorag nigger was "shopping" for a mark checking out EVERY car/driver at the pumps. For some dumb reason he approached me in a manner that put me on alert. I asked him to stop and back away. He got hostile, made a few threatening hand gestures and kept approaching. I drew but held it at my side and told him again to back away. He didn't see it at first but damn near shit himself when he realized he was about to get shot. Had I not been armed, I am certain he was looking for someone who had money to rob.

You want another reason, go to Dallaspolice.net and look at the graphical crime statistics for violent crime, murder, rape, assault and burglary and you will change your mind about being a victim....



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post #32 of 38 (permalink) Old 06-19-2008, 05:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mustangman_2000
Well, I appreciate all of the good info on the subject. Again, getting a CHL was something I've considered but really really felt necessary. I was just looking more into the "traveling" laws and found HB 1815. It seems to grant a lot of privilege to an unlicensed carrier. Therefore, I found it somewhat confusing at first glance.

I'm still ambivalent about always carrying my handgun on my person. Anything can happen at anytime, but statistically it's unlikely that you will find yourself in a gun battle. Well, at least not the environment I live and work in. What I'm more focused on is just legally being armed while traveling, vacationing, or camping in remote areas. If HB 1815 means you have to be confined to your car or your property, then I can see the need for CHL. Prior to HB 1815, the "traveling" laws were very vague and could still easily get you arrested if you didn't know what to say and how to say it. It's nice to see that has been fixed with this new measure.

I do think that there are legitimate concerns in always carrying, but there is also a pinch of paranoia. I worry about getting into a habit of feeling the need to be constantly armed. I've spent my whole life not being armed and have never really had a major problem other than the occasional fist fight. I've never hung around a rough crowd. I guess I've been lucky.
It only takes one time and hindsight sucks, that is if you live through the experience...........
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post #33 of 38 (permalink) Old 06-19-2008, 05:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Strychnine
The word "loaded" is nowhere in HB 1815. No distinction made = carry loaded.




A gun without ammo isn't a weapon. It's just an expensive hammer.

Why would they go through the trouble if it was not to allow a person to defend themselves with the gun?
this is just what my instructer told the class, i am still waiting on my liscence to come in but i carry my gun loaded in the car.


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post #34 of 38 (permalink) Old 06-19-2008, 07:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cobraboy
shhhhhh! you can have he last word here!!
sorry to
Mustangman_2000.
for this topic to get way off subject.
but "Mr Majestyk"
thinks its ok to sleep with his mamma too.
Thought you were done here dickhead, to use your own words....do us all a favor and STFU like you said you would.
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post #35 of 38 (permalink) Old 06-20-2008, 11:47 PM
GE
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When I was still driving limos part time, I had stopped off to get some ice at the liquor store in front of the Kroger on Centennial in Richardson. I was wearing my Glock on the hip in a Kydex holster, and I had a suit coat covering it. If you knew what you were looking for, you could tell I was carrying. The security guard pulled me aside and asked if I was carrying and if I had my CHL. I showed him my CHL, and he called what appeared to be some head security guy over. That guy just told him I was carrying concealed, had a CHL, and wasn't doing anything wrong.

As an aside, if you get pulled over by DPS, be prepared to keep your hands on the steering wheel the entire time during the traffic stop. They will re-iterate this to you several times. heh.
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post #36 of 38 (permalink) Old 06-21-2008, 05:35 AM
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Here's one thing most people don't realize.... You get a CHL and you do not have to carry on you all the time. If you are not comfortable carrying at church, then don't. If you are visiting your sister's family in Arlington and you don't feel like carrying there, then don't. Just because you have a CHL doesn't mean you have to carry 24/7. You're not obligated to carry. However, there are places you go that you may feel the odds are stacked against you. A late night trip to the grocery, walking the dog, meeting someone on DFWstangs for a sale or purchase, etc. With a CHL, you'll have the option to carry.

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post #37 of 38 (permalink) Old 06-21-2008, 06:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by propellerhead
... meeting someone on DFWstangs for a sale or purchase, etc. With a CHL, you'll have the option to carry.

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post #38 of 38 (permalink) Old 06-21-2008, 10:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 03trubluGT
I always carry when meeting up with someone.

93 Teal/Gray Cobra
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