New 5.56 "Brown" Tip ammo - DFWstangs Forums
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 16 (permalink) Old 05-20-2008, 08:27 PM Thread Starter
Rolling with the homies
 
evil jose's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: Oak Cliff... that's my hood...
Posts: 43,271
New 5.56 "Brown" Tip ammo

Thought this was pretty interesting. About time they started doing something to correct a long time problem with the ammo firing out of the M4's.

Quote:
5.56 Optimized/Brown-Tip Ammo: Enhanced Terminal Ballistics for SpecOps SBRs
Posted on Thursday, May 15 @ 05:20:38 PDT by davidc

Ammunition By David Crane
defrev at gmail.com

May 14, 2008

Modified on 5/15/08 -- Some information has been redacted/removed from this article by the author/editor (David Crane) for OPSEC.

A number of months ago, DefenseReview was informed by one of our contacts in the U.S. military Special Operations (SpecOps) community that our Special Operations Forces (SOF) assaulters/operators now have a new, specialized 5.56x45mm NATO (5.56mm NATO)/.223 Rem. round at their disposal that's been unofficially referred to as the "5.56 Optimized" (pronounced "Five Five Six Optimized") and/or "Brown Tip", because the round has, appropriately, a brown tip.

The "optimized" nomenclature apparently refers to the fact that the round is optimized for subcarbines/SBRs (Short Barreled Rifles) and carbines from 10.5-14.5 inches, in order to provide optimum terminal ballistics out of the shortened weapon platform. We don't know the maximum effective combat distance for the round out of a 10.3"-10.5" barrel, but we're guessing approx. 300-350 yards (unconfirmed/unverified). At present, we believe that the specific weapons for which the round was optimized are the...


10.5" HK416 gas-piston/op-rod-driven SBR and 14.5" SOPMOD Colt M4A1 Carbine, although the the 10.3" Mk18 CQBR (Close Quarters Battle Receiver) direct-gas-impingement-driven SBR may also have used as a testbed/platform-focus for the new round (but we don't know, at this point). We'll try to get confirmation/verification on this. Right now, it's just rumor.

Defense Review does not have all the facts about this ammo, yet, but we've been informed by one of our sources that the new round (the bullet, itself), rumored to be manufactured by [Redacted], is made of [Redacted] ([Redacted], all the way through) and weighs 70 grains, as opposed to the 62-grain M855 ball round. It's possible that the 5.56 Optimized/Brown-Tip bullet is a militarized offshoot of, and therefore benefits from, [Redacted] bullet a.k.a. [Redacted] bullet technology. However, we're not yet sure whether the 5.56 Optimized round is round nose a.k.a. solid point, open-tip, or hollow point. The limited information we have at present would lead us to believe that it's a solid-tip round, but we're not sure yet.



2008 Lincoln MKZ
1995 Mustang GT Convertible
2002 F-150 SuperCrew


1995 Ford Taurus SHO
2003 Yamaha R6

evil jose is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 16 (permalink) Old 05-21-2008, 12:32 AM
Factory Issue
 
Yale's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Shippensburg, PA
Posts: 12,295
Hmm... It's interesting that so much is redacted concerning the manufacturer's identity. I'm betting it's Black Hills, though. Black Hills makes the 77gr bullets cooked up especially for the SDMR's, but the Army wouldn't release them to the troops for a while. I think they were HP's, and that'd be a no-no. The Geneva convention limits us to FMJ's only.

Give me a dollar.
Yale is offline  
post #3 of 16 (permalink) Old 05-21-2008, 07:13 AM
The token Asian guy
 
propellerhead's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: SBRacing
Posts: 8,050
Had to look that one up...

re·dact·ed, re·dact·ing, re·dacts
1. To draw up or frame (a proclamation, for example).
2. To make ready for publication; edit or revise.

Well, I hope it somehow drives down regular .223/5.56 ammo.

propellerhead is offline  
 
post #4 of 16 (permalink) Old 05-21-2008, 09:49 AM
Lifer
 
futant's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: DFW, TX
Posts: 1,664
I was looking at keltec PLR-16 and it seemed like a nice cheap platform to make and SBR on .
I think they only cost 450$ +200$tax stamp+cost of making folding stock.

Seems like you would get the best of many worlds. Cheap , AR like but still PISTON DRIVEN, folding (unlike AR's), compact, powerful (unlike pistol SMG).

Anyone?
http://glocktalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=815530

79 K5 blazer, 6" lift 38x15" tires d44/12b lockers and chromoly axles ,6.2L GM diesel - Waste Vegetable Oil conversion - cross over steering,14"SAW nitrogen shocks, beefed shackles, shackle flip, winch/ bumpers, diff covers.

94 CBR 600 naked, handbraked, -1 +3 sprockets, one wheel operation mod

"I'm sorry, nothing quite says, "F- You, I'm from Texas" like an all-business, stripped-down K5."

Last edited by futant; 05-21-2008 at 09:58 AM.
futant is offline  
post #5 of 16 (permalink) Old 05-21-2008, 10:06 AM
Factory Issue
 
Yale's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Shippensburg, PA
Posts: 12,295
A folding stock shouldn't make it an SBR, should it? It'd be hard to imagine it being under 26.5" overall even with the stock folded.

EDIT: Wait, don't you already have a thread about an SU16 somewhere? Those rifles are pieces of shit.

Give me a dollar.

Last edited by Gimmeabeer; 05-21-2008 at 10:13 AM.
Yale is offline  
post #6 of 16 (permalink) Old 05-21-2008, 10:54 AM
Lifer
 
futant's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: DFW, TX
Posts: 1,664
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gimmeabeer
A folding stock shouldn't make it an SBR, should it? It'd be hard to imagine it being under 26.5" overall even with the stock folded.

EDIT: Wait, don't you already have a thread about an SU16 somewhere? Those rifles are pieces of shit.
What is shitty about them ? I have heard some various reports online, mostly good. Stock looks too flimsy to me though.
And the point of this project is short/foldable. I just hate paying the government taxes for any reason . BS.
yes the PLR-16 would easily be under 26" when folded ! (9.25" barrel)
the su16 is 16" barrel.

79 K5 blazer, 6" lift 38x15" tires d44/12b lockers and chromoly axles ,6.2L GM diesel - Waste Vegetable Oil conversion - cross over steering,14"SAW nitrogen shocks, beefed shackles, shackle flip, winch/ bumpers, diff covers.

94 CBR 600 naked, handbraked, -1 +3 sprockets, one wheel operation mod

"I'm sorry, nothing quite says, "F- You, I'm from Texas" like an all-business, stripped-down K5."
futant is offline  
post #7 of 16 (permalink) Old 05-21-2008, 12:13 PM
Factory Issue
 
Yale's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Shippensburg, PA
Posts: 12,295
There have been some complaints about barrel obstructions being hard to diagnose, being that it's hard to see into the chamber as easily as with an AR or an AK (without disassembly), and the cotter pin used (that should be a serious red flag) to hold the stock in the extended position isn't an easily available size, possibly complicating field repairs. Just get a remanned bushmaster from cmmg for under $600 if you're worried about cheap. It'll be more accurate, and assuming you clean it, the direct impingement will hurt it a lot less than you think. If it really bothers you, save up and buy a gas piston upper from Bushmaster or Lauer Custom Weaponry. Sorry for the hi-jack, Jose.

EDIT: It amazes me that you're willing to pay more for the SBR transfer stamp and gun altogether than you would for a higher quality gun by itself. If you need a shorter barrel, buy a pistol. I'm going to work, peace out, kids! Jose, I guess I owe you another drink.

Give me a dollar.

Last edited by Gimmeabeer; 05-21-2008 at 12:50 PM.
Yale is offline  
post #8 of 16 (permalink) Old 05-21-2008, 12:29 PM Thread Starter
Rolling with the homies
 
evil jose's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: Oak Cliff... that's my hood...
Posts: 43,271
Actually futant hijacked my thread. WTF?!




2008 Lincoln MKZ
1995 Mustang GT Convertible
2002 F-150 SuperCrew


1995 Ford Taurus SHO
2003 Yamaha R6

evil jose is offline  
post #9 of 16 (permalink) Old 05-21-2008, 12:36 PM
Lifer
 
futant's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: DFW, TX
Posts: 1,664
Quote:
Originally Posted by evil jose
Actually futant hijacked my thread. WTF?!
In all seriousness , what are we supposed to talk about? it's all 'top secret' I guess.
Probably blended metal technology , supposedly the next big 'bullet thing'.

79 K5 blazer, 6" lift 38x15" tires d44/12b lockers and chromoly axles ,6.2L GM diesel - Waste Vegetable Oil conversion - cross over steering,14"SAW nitrogen shocks, beefed shackles, shackle flip, winch/ bumpers, diff covers.

94 CBR 600 naked, handbraked, -1 +3 sprockets, one wheel operation mod

"I'm sorry, nothing quite says, "F- You, I'm from Texas" like an all-business, stripped-down K5."
futant is offline  
post #10 of 16 (permalink) Old 05-21-2008, 12:55 PM Thread Starter
Rolling with the homies
 
evil jose's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: Oak Cliff... that's my hood...
Posts: 43,271
Quote:
Originally Posted by futant
In all seriousness , what are we supposed to talk about? it's all 'top secret' I guess.
Probably blended metal technology , supposedly the next big 'bullet thing'.
Why not post it back in your SU-16 thread? This is a completely different topic discussing the inadequacies of military ammo out of short barrel M4's and what they are doing to correct it.




2008 Lincoln MKZ
1995 Mustang GT Convertible
2002 F-150 SuperCrew


1995 Ford Taurus SHO
2003 Yamaha R6

evil jose is offline  
post #11 of 16 (permalink) Old 05-22-2008, 12:18 AM
Factory Issue
 
Yale's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Shippensburg, PA
Posts: 12,295
I'm going to guess they went with a faster burning powder mostly.

Give me a dollar.
Yale is offline  
post #12 of 16 (permalink) Old 06-06-2008, 02:20 PM
Musician for the deaf
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Euless, TX
Posts: 9,656
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gimmeabeer
I'm going to guess they went with a faster burning powder mostly.
With higher nitroglycerin content too I bet. And a bronze bullet.
Casper is offline  
post #13 of 16 (permalink) Old 06-06-2008, 11:12 PM
Time Served
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Posts: 531
Nosler makes the bullet. I have the NSN number around here somewhere. It is showing to be a nice performer.

93 Black Mustang GT

post #14 of 16 (permalink) Old 06-07-2008, 07:57 AM
Old Fart
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Forney, TX, USA
Posts: 1,359
AR15 says it is a Barnes round.

http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=16&t=380385

"Don't taze me, bro."
GT98SVO is offline  
post #15 of 16 (permalink) Old 06-08-2008, 09:04 AM
Time Served
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Posts: 531
That is what I meant, it had been a few days since reading that on AR15.com and I was pulling from memory, which is not that good.

93 Black Mustang GT

post #16 of 16 (permalink) Old 06-08-2008, 02:06 PM
Factory Issue
 
Yale's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Shippensburg, PA
Posts: 12,295
So it's just Barnes TSX? Lol, why the hype?

Give me a dollar.
Yale is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Bookmarks

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the DFWstangs Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome