Government Agents Seize Oath Keeper's New Born From Hospital - DFWstangs Forums
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 25 (permalink) Old 10-07-2010, 11:34 PM Thread Starter
Bullet Sponge
 
forever_frost's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Cooper, Tx
Posts: 3,142
Government Agents Seize Oath Keeper's New Born From Hospital

Kid stolen by government http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OvZRM-P46rI

Government Agents Seize Oath Keeper's New Born From Hospital
Concord Hospital, NH, Wed. Oct. 7th, 2010

Last Night John Irish & Stephanie Janvrin had their new born baby girl taken away by government officials because of their involvement with Oath Keepers, a non violent constitutional organization. According to Irish, The Director of Security and the Head Nurse of the Hospital said "we want the pediatrician to check the baby in the nursery so that you can go home." The baby was wheeled out in the bassinet under the protest of Irish. Irish followed them out and took note of 3-4 men wearing suits with detective badges as well as 3 police officers.

The Division of Family Child Services proceeded to pat down John and inform the parents they would be taking the daughter. "They Stole our Child" says John Irish. An Affidavit was produced that claimed an affiliation with a militia called Oath Keepers. Irish claims Oath Keepers is a non violent organization. John and Stephanie were able to spend a few minutes with their daughter and were forced to leave. A security officer escorted the two out of the hospital.

George Hemminger
george4title(AT)yahoo.com
forever_frost is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 25 (permalink) Old 10-08-2010, 12:06 AM
Lifer
 
samuel642000's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 1,372
They'd have to kill me before they took away my child.
samuel642000 is offline  
post #3 of 25 (permalink) Old 10-08-2010, 12:11 AM
Time Served
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 184
Quote:
Originally Posted by samuel642000 View Post
They'd have to kill me before they took away my child.
But a few of them would die first. If they think that I couldn't pop the heads off of 3 or 4 of those agents from a fair distance away, they'd have to learn the hard way I guess. They'd call it "the baby theft massacre" lol
92Gt5liter is offline  
 
post #4 of 25 (permalink) Old 10-08-2010, 12:48 AM
Lifer
 
slow06's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Arlington
Posts: 2,075
They are trying to find out if this is real or not...
Edit, I clicked on the link and it looks real.

http://oathkeepers.org/oath/

Quote:
UPDATE : 10/07/2010 10.53PM PST -- We have confirmed that the affidavit in support of the order to take the child from her parents states ,along with a long list of other assertions against both parents, that “The Division became aware and confirmed that Mr. Irish associated with a militia known as the Oath Keepers.” Yes, there are other, very serious allegations. Out of respect for the privacy of the parents, we will not publish the affidavit. We will leave that to Mr. Irish. But please do remember that allegations do not equal facts -- they are merely allegations (and in my experience as a criminal defense lawyer in small town Montana I saw many allegations that proved to be false).

But an even more fundamental point is that regardless of the other allegations, it is utterly unconstitutional for government agencies to list Mr. Irish’s association with Oath Keepers in an affidavit in support of a child abuse order to remove his daughter from his custody. Talk about chilling speech! If this is allowed to continue, it will chill the speech of not just Mr. Irish, but all Oath Keepers and it will serve as the camel under the tent for other associations being considered too risky for parents to dare. Thus, it serves to chill the speech of all of us, in any group we belong to that “officials” may not approve of. Don’t you dare associate with such and such group, or you could be on “the list” and then child protective services might come take your kids.

Note that there is no allegation that Oath Keepers is a criminal organization or that Mr. Irish, in the context of his association with Oath Keepers, is committing any crime. We are not advocating or planning imminent violence, which is the established line where free speech ends and criminal behavior begins (See Brandenburg v. Ohio, 395 U.S. 444 (1969), which, as Wikipedia notes, “held that government cannot punish inflammatory speech unless it is directed to inciting and likely to incite imminent lawless action. In particular, it overruled Ohio’s criminal syndicalism statute, because that statute broadly prohibited the mere advocacy of violence.” We don’t even advocate that the current serving use violence of any kind, let alone imminent violence. We ask them to merely stand down.

Neither is Oath Keepers a militia, for that matter. However, EVEN IF WE WERE, that also would not be a valid reason to take someone’s child away. PRIVATE MILITIAS, JUST LIKE OTHER VOLUNTARY ASSOCIATIONS, ARE NOT ILLEGAL, and it is not a crime to associate with them. To the contrary, we have an absolute right, won by the blood of patriots, and protected by our First Amendment, to freely associate with each other as we damn well please so long as we are not advocating or planning imminent violence or directly harming our children (and no, teaching them “thought crime” like “All men are created equal and are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights,” or that those who swear an oath should keep it, does not count -- at least not yet). A parent associating with a militia is not engaged in child endangerment and is not evidence of child endangerment (despite the shrill screeching of people such as Mark Potock of the SPLC, who desperately wants it to be so). Just recently a Time Magazine article described how the reporter visited the happy home of a militia member and his family -- and those kids are still at home, where they belong, as is the case with many th0usands of children across this country who have parents who “associate” with private militias and all manner of other non-criminal groups. You had damn well better defend the rights of those parents to freely associate in their militias and keep their kids while doing so. You can bet that if you let such an association be listed as grounds for taking children from their parents that it won’t only be militia folks who have their rights violated. Homeschoolers, evangelical Christians, gun owners, etc. will also be on the hit list. Just wait. Remember Pastor Niemöller’s timeless warning:

They came first for the Communists,
and I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a Communist.

Then they came for the trade unionists,
and I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a trade unionist.

Then they came for the Jews,
and I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a Jew.

Then they came for me
and by that time no one was left to speak up.

A modern version might read like this:

They came first for the militia members,
and I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a militia member.

Then they came for the three percenters,
and I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a three percenter.

Then they came for the Oath Keepers,
and I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t an Oath Keeper.

Then they came for me
and by that time no one was left to speak up.

So, defend the right of even the most hardcore militia members to freely associate without that right being chilled and suppressed by means of the threat of taking their kids.

But this particular listing of an association with Oath Keepers as one of the reasons for taking a child from her parents is all the more absurd, taking it to a whole other level of Alice in Wonderland “down is up” and up is down,” when you consider that a significant percentage of the members of Oath Keepers are current serving police, fire-fighters, and military personnel. Three of our state chapter presidents are current serving police officers. How can “associating” with such fine men and women who are daily trusted with tremendous power and responsibility constitute evidence of child endangerment? How can it be that a New Hampshire police department can consider someone associating with other current serving police officers as evidence of child abuse and endangerment? Only in the bizzaro world of the SPLC are public servants who commit to simply following the law, keeping their oaths by refusing to violate your rights ,considered “extreme” and “dangerous.”

This is the camel’s nose under the tent. We need to fight even this one instance of such a violation of the right to associate and to peaceably assemble, and we need to push back against the new world of thought crime that is being relentlessly pushed upon us. If this listing of mere association with Oath Keepers is allowed to be used in this case to justify, even in part, removing a newborn from the custody of her parents, with nothing else alleged about Oath Keepers except that the father “is associated” with this organization, that will have a sweeping chilling effect on the First Amendment protected rights of freedom of speech, peaceable assembly, association, and petition for redress of grievances for all of us -- and it will only be the beginning.

OK, now it is TIME TO PUSH BACK -- peaceably, of course, using our voices and pens. Let the officials in question know that you strongly oppose their listing of an association with Oath Keepers as one of the reasons for taking this child. Let them know you insist that they remove that “reason” from the affidavit and issue a public retraction, and until they do so, they will hear from all of us, and also from our legal counsel. And we won’t relent until they respect our First Amendment protected rights of free speech and association and cease and desist this chilling of those rights. Be professional, but firm. Make them hear you.

Stewart Rhodes

"A government big enough to give you everything you want, is strong enough to take everything you have."
-Gerald Ford/Thomas Jefferson

"A Republic, if you can keep it"
- Benjamin Franklin

The way to peaceably remove elected officials who deviate from the constitution of the United States of America...
www.blowoutcongress.com

Last edited by slow06; 10-08-2010 at 12:54 AM.
slow06 is offline  
post #5 of 25 (permalink) Old 10-08-2010, 04:57 AM
Lifer
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Dallas, Texas
Posts: 1,163
These liberal asshats in charge, are just trying their best to start shit. Every thing they do divides people. This is not what the founding fathers intended.



All men should know Honor first, above all else!

Honor is not holding your hand out for something you did not earn.
Honor is not forcing your ideas, or belief on others.
Honor is not something given to you by way of job, or title.

Honor is learned, earned, practiced and respected by all decent men and women.
tazz007 is offline  
post #6 of 25 (permalink) Old 10-08-2010, 06:11 AM
Lifer
 
davbrucas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Houston
Posts: 8,841
I highly doubt that govt JBT's came and take their child solely because he is in a militia...use your heads people. There are other allegations that arent listed...what if one of them are child abuse/molestation? The govt just doesnt take away a person's kid for no reason.
davbrucas is offline  
post #7 of 25 (permalink) Old 10-08-2010, 06:34 AM Thread Starter
Bullet Sponge
 
forever_frost's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Cooper, Tx
Posts: 3,142
The fact that Oath Keepers were even mentioned is an outrage. Yes there were other allegations, however, OK were mentioned as additional reasons.
forever_frost is offline  
post #8 of 25 (permalink) Old 10-08-2010, 06:41 AM
Lifer
 
davbrucas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Houston
Posts: 8,841
Mentioned by whom? His OK friends? The media? Consider the source.
davbrucas is offline  
post #9 of 25 (permalink) Old 10-08-2010, 06:56 AM
WE ARE THE CHAMPIONS!
 
Sgt Beavis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Lake Dallas, TX
Posts: 10,859
I'm not buying it yet. I highly suspect we're not getting the whole story.

We're Adopting. Contact us through our website.

http://www.theboyetts.com

You can also LIKE us on Facebook
Sgt Beavis is offline  
post #10 of 25 (permalink) Old 10-08-2010, 07:31 AM
duh...duh....duh
 
ceyko's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: ES BEER
Posts: 9,543
So what is the fucking truth and why are people only posting up the side they want people to see? I'd expect better out of DFWS. Yeah right, no better then the media.

Edit: Concur though, being an Oath Keeper and mentioning it is counter-productive to any legit issues there may or may not be in this scenario. If I were honestly not guilty I'm not sure what I do if someone were taking my baby. The reality is you have to be careful, or the baby could get hurt/killed.

My '03 Sold.

Last edited by ceyko; 10-08-2010 at 08:02 AM.
ceyko is offline  
post #11 of 25 (permalink) Old 10-08-2010, 07:54 AM
No Cerveza... No Trabajo
 
01WhiteCobra's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Where's my beer?
Posts: 21,924
LOL. Some things on this site never change.

Funny how the government singled out this single Oath Keeper family. Or is this the first baby Oath Keeper born in the US?

My 401K is now a 400K (was 301K)
01WhiteCobra is offline  
post #12 of 25 (permalink) Old 10-08-2010, 08:21 AM
BP
Keep your unicorns
 
BP's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: At the Dexter Lake Club
Posts: 12,422
I doubt Obama sent a department of the interior swat team to intercept their baby. All they said is that it was "men in suits", which could be CPS, other doctors, local police, etc... I need more info before developing an opinion.

Now if the federal government seized their baby solely because they were members of a group and that group doesn't practice some illegal activity that might endanger the child and there is no history of drug abuse or family violence then the gloves need to come off.

Buell 1125R
Raptor 700R
No fast cars though
BP is offline  
post #13 of 25 (permalink) Old 10-08-2010, 09:23 AM
Lifer
 
MR TINFOIL HAT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: NAU
Posts: 4,982
Here's a copy of the affidavit.

http://www.prisonplanet.com/governme...f-parents.html

Our government needs our help, they have an addiction. Our government is addicted to our money. Since they always have our best interest at heart it's time we return the favor. We need to have an intervention, for the governments own good of course. It's just irresponsible for us to let people with a known money addiction continue to handle our money. Lets have an intervention now so we can help these sick individuals.
MR TINFOIL HAT is offline  
post #14 of 25 (permalink) Old 10-08-2010, 09:34 AM
duh...duh....duh
 
ceyko's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: ES BEER
Posts: 9,543
Quote:
Originally Posted by MR TINFOIL HAT View Post
Seems like there should be more to it. Also seems like he has some outstanding issues.

Neglect (of two other children)
Carrying w/o permit
multiple calls involving firearms (To me "calls" means someone is calling out the police, which could be anything - combined with the other stuff though...)

I don't know, seems like there still is more information to be had. That was just a part of it and was highlighted to try and ignore the other parts - as if they are not important.

My '03 Sold.
ceyko is offline  
post #15 of 25 (permalink) Old 10-08-2010, 09:42 AM
Lifer
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 1,089
Quote:
Originally Posted by MR TINFOIL HAT View Post
looks like there was a previous case where they abused and neglected 2 of their other kids and the court took them away.

cannonball996 is offline  
post #16 of 25 (permalink) Old 10-08-2010, 09:42 AM
No Cerveza... No Trabajo
 
01WhiteCobra's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Where's my beer?
Posts: 21,924
Quote:
Originally Posted by MR TINFOIL HAT View Post
Item 5 stands out more for me than Item 7.

While I'm not a forensic investigator there seems to be a very evident change in font for item 7 as well. As a matter of fact... what a fucking poor cut and paste job. I downloaded it and increased the size a little. You will see a very pronounced downward slant to EVERYTHING on that page except for the text in Item 7 which goes straight across the page.

My guess is everything in item 7 was correct and part of the affidavit except for the last sentence.

What a bunch of fucking idiots. They should have also blacked out Cheyenne's name from the top of the report. The idiots blacked it out in number one but forget the RE: at the top.

My 401K is now a 400K (was 301K)
01WhiteCobra is offline  
post #17 of 25 (permalink) Old 10-08-2010, 09:48 AM
Lifer
 
slow06's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Arlington
Posts: 2,075
Quote:
Originally Posted by 01WhiteCobra View Post
Item 5 stands out more for me than Item 7.

While I'm not a forensic investigator there seems to be a very evident change in font for item 7 as well. As a matter of fact... what a fucking poor cut and paste job. I downloaded it and increased the size a little. You will see a very pronounced downward slant to EVERYTHING on that page except for the text in Item 7 which goes straight across the page.

My guess is everything in item 7 was correct and part of the affidavit except for the last sentence.

What a bunch of fucking idiots. They should have also blacked out Cheyenne's name from the top of the report. The idiots blacked it out in number one but forget the RE: at the top.
It also looks like a smaller/bolded font. (Number 7, not 5)

"A government big enough to give you everything you want, is strong enough to take everything you have."
-Gerald Ford/Thomas Jefferson

"A Republic, if you can keep it"
- Benjamin Franklin

The way to peaceably remove elected officials who deviate from the constitution of the United States of America...
www.blowoutcongress.com

Last edited by slow06; 10-08-2010 at 10:13 AM.
slow06 is offline  
post #18 of 25 (permalink) Old 10-08-2010, 07:20 PM
Lifer
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Dallas, Texas
Posts: 1,163
http://www.thelibertyvoice.com/the-n...ng-state-goons



All men should know Honor first, above all else!

Honor is not holding your hand out for something you did not earn.
Honor is not forcing your ideas, or belief on others.
Honor is not something given to you by way of job, or title.

Honor is learned, earned, practiced and respected by all decent men and women.
tazz007 is offline  
post #19 of 25 (permalink) Old 10-09-2010, 06:56 AM
duh...duh....duh
 
ceyko's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: ES BEER
Posts: 9,543
Seems like a rehash of the last link?

My '03 Sold.
ceyko is offline  
post #20 of 25 (permalink) Old 10-09-2010, 06:36 PM
Lifer
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Dallas, Texas
Posts: 1,163
Quote:
Originally Posted by ceyko View Post
Seems like a rehash of the last link?

I know, but everything was on the same page, including the affidavit.



All men should know Honor first, above all else!

Honor is not holding your hand out for something you did not earn.
Honor is not forcing your ideas, or belief on others.
Honor is not something given to you by way of job, or title.

Honor is learned, earned, practiced and respected by all decent men and women.
tazz007 is offline  
post #21 of 25 (permalink) Old 10-14-2010, 05:42 PM
Lifer
 
MR TINFOIL HAT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: NAU
Posts: 4,982
John Irish and his wife just got their baby back today. It was "another John Irish" they were looking for allegedly.
MR TINFOIL HAT is offline  
post #22 of 25 (permalink) Old 10-14-2010, 05:47 PM
Lifer
 
line-em-up's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Somewhere south of here.
Posts: 5,810
...

Quote:
Originally Posted by MR TINFOIL HAT View Post
John Irish and his wife just got their baby back today. It was "another John Irish" they were looking for allegedly.
Now that they've implanted tracking and listening devices into it.
line-em-up is offline  
post #23 of 25 (permalink) Old 10-14-2010, 05:50 PM
Lifer
 
MR TINFOIL HAT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: NAU
Posts: 4,982
Quote:
Originally Posted by line-em-up View Post
Now that they've implanted tracking and listening devices into it.
Turns out the father was never arrested for domestic violence and the other shit they claimed.
MR TINFOIL HAT is offline  
post #24 of 25 (permalink) Old 10-14-2010, 05:58 PM
Canada is welcome here.
 
justinsn95's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: ft worth
Posts: 4,039
I call bullshit on this one. They can't just take someone's kid for absolutely no reason like that. Being a member of a group isn't a reason. An abduction like that would bring them nothing but trouble. I agree with the others here, he probly did something to deserve it and is just using this to raise a stink.

Quote:
Originally Posted by aksthem1 View Post
i think thedark1337 is a pretty cool guy. eh plays the game and doesnt afraid of anything


Quote:
Originally Posted by Chillaxed View Post
- later on when i was about 16 i suddenly came to the realization that i had zero appeal to women and i said "i'm going to say i'm gay from now on"
justinsn95 is offline  
post #25 of 25 (permalink) Old 10-14-2010, 06:29 PM
Lifer
 
MR TINFOIL HAT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: NAU
Posts: 4,982
Quote:
Originally Posted by justinsn95 View Post
I call bullshit on this one. They can't just take someone's kid for absolutely no reason like that. Being a member of a group isn't a reason. An abduction like that would bring them nothing but trouble. I agree with the others here, he probly did something to deserve it and is just using this to raise a stink.
He just got his child back, It'll be in the news tomorrow. It just shows you they CAN take someones kid for absolutely no reason. If they are going to go around snatching kids they damn well better have the fucking facts straight about the parents in question.
MR TINFOIL HAT is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Bookmarks

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the DFWstangs Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome