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post #1 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-07-2010, 06:08 AM Thread Starter
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Wow, impressed with the ole Don

http://money.cnn.com/video/news/2010...n_bin&hpt=Sbin

I like the part where he says in 10 years china will be number one because we are allowing them to be number one. Ive been asking WTF are we doing for several years now, maybe people will wake the fuck up.

The trouble with doing something right the first time is that nobody appreciates how difficult it was.
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post #2 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-07-2010, 08:22 AM
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Couldn't agree with him more.

Wal-Mart has a HUGH wake-up call coming soon - only not soon enough.


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post #3 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-07-2010, 09:40 AM
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I think he has it wrong, we are not allowing china to become number one, instead we are empowering them to become number one. its not like china is dumping product on our market, American companies and investors are going to china to find these products and bringing them to the US.

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post #4 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-07-2010, 10:45 AM
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I think he has it wrong, we are not allowing china to become number one, instead we are empowering them to become number one. its not like china is dumping product on our market, American companies and investors are going to china to find these products and bringing them to the US.
No kidding. I'm on a project at work where I'm quoting tooling for plastic parts. Sadly, the American companies are being beat by a HUGE margin. What's worse, even if the freight, carrying costs, and travel time are a detriment, the company is so focused on product cost they go with China's low ball quotes. In the end, it might cost us more in overhead and inventory, but the initial investment and piece part is lower.

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post #5 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-07-2010, 11:02 AM
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catch 22 here, on 1 hand you can give 15% of americans crappy $10 hour jobs, but raise the cost of living 30% or more on 80% of americans. Just a bad situation without a good answer. Just not sure it would do a whole lot of good for joe smoe to bring home $300 a week from his toy manufacturing job,while his grocery bill sky rockets and small business has to spend double on thier equipment and supplies, so most services would cost more. Standard of living would def drop in our country. main cure would be for our government to quit spending money we don't have(both parties).

its still "we the people"right?

"So this is how democracy dies, with thunderous applause"

"a lesson lived is a lesson learned, everyday is a lesson."

obama is a man made disaster

Last edited by mightyp; 04-07-2010 at 11:32 AM.
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post #6 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-07-2010, 12:16 PM Thread Starter
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Standard of living is going down anyways, losing decent paying jobs like crazy being replaced with mcdonalds and walmart jobs.

The path we are on now is a downward spiral, they have to make a change. I think everything will balance out just like it was before china. The whole high standard of living we have now isnt actually being paid for, its puting the whole country in unpayable debt. We are in a sense, subsidizing these cheap goods. They should put the real price on that shiney tv, for example $1499 plus 50 american jobs.

The old american companies were doing quite well employing "overpaid" americans, those people made those companies what they are today.

Sure prices will go up but people will either be able to get jobs or will get better paying jobs. I mean im sure you wont see anymore $1499 big screen tvs but if thats what it takes to save the country im ok with that. We could take people off welfare and get them back to working aswell.

China is not americas friend and im concerned what they will do once they have the big stick. America should not be any other countries bitch.

The trouble with doing something right the first time is that nobody appreciates how difficult it was.
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post #7 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-07-2010, 12:24 PM
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agree with most of that, don't really want to go back to the 50s and 60s when people didn't have squat though. No political party is going to doom themselves with doing this anyways, raising the cost of living 40% on all americans is a sure way to never get elected again. Imagine if the government proposed a 35-40% tax on everything, thats what this would equal.Most people on welfare on there because they want to be, not because of lack of jobs. There would be more jobs, not better ones though. Manufacturing isn't what it used to be either, I guess you could outlaw robots and computers, that would make people worth more.
I dunno, shitty situation without a realistic solution.

its still "we the people"right?

"So this is how democracy dies, with thunderous applause"

"a lesson lived is a lesson learned, everyday is a lesson."

obama is a man made disaster
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post #8 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-07-2010, 12:46 PM
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It is all about the bottom line.
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post #9 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-07-2010, 09:00 PM
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Donald is right on the fucking money. China is becoming an economic machine.

We make nothing here anymore. Now our technical & service jobs are going to India. There will be nothing left in the US other than fast food restaurants and fat asses
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post #10 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-07-2010, 09:22 PM
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No kidding. I'm on a project at work where I'm quoting tooling for plastic parts. Sadly, the American companies are being beat by a HUGE margin. What's worse, even if the freight, carrying costs, and travel time are a detriment, the company is so focused on product cost they go with China's low ball quotes. In the end, it might cost us more in overhead and inventory, but the initial investment and piece part is lower.
Sounds like the company I work for, they step over a dollar to pick up a dime.
I drive a truck, I ticked up a trailer the other day that had a tire that had a cut in the sidewall, called and told them I needed them to send some one out to replace it.
They wouldn't do it because it was still holding air. And they didn't want to spend $850.00 for a new tire. So I took it out and of coarse it blew and when a super single blows it almost always destroys the rim before you can get it stopped. So now they had to pay for a road repair charge and a new tire, rim and mud flap.
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post #11 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-07-2010, 09:41 PM
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Sounds like the company I work for, they step over a dollar to pick up a dime.
I drive a truck, I ticked up a trailer the other day that had a tire that had a cut in the sidewall, called and told them I needed them to send some one out to replace it.
They wouldn't do it because it was still holding air. And they didn't want to spend $850.00 for a new tire. So I took it out and of coarse it blew and when a super single blows it almost always destroys the rim before you can get it stopped. So now they had to pay for a road repair charge and a new tire, rim and mud flap.
That's par for the course these days.





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post #12 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-07-2010, 10:35 PM Thread Starter
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agree with most of that, don't really want to go back to the 50s and 60s when people didn't have squat though. No political party is going to doom themselves with doing this anyways, raising the cost of living 40% on all americans is a sure way to never get elected again. Imagine if the government proposed a 35-40% tax on everything, thats what this would equal.Most people on welfare on there because they want to be, not because of lack of jobs. There would be more jobs, not better ones though. Manufacturing isn't what it used to be either, I guess you could outlaw robots and computers, that would make people worth more.
I dunno, shitty situation without a realistic solution.
Everytime this discussion comes up you say people didnt have anything, what was it they didnt have? You cant fault them for stuff that wasnt invented yet. They had cars and houses and a higher standard of living than most countries. What time period did the phrase "The american dream" come to be? Back then having a diploma was enough, now if you dont have a degree you are screwed. College has went from being a perk to being a requirement. A loser used to be someone who just flat out wouldnt do shit, now it means someone who works at walmart or mcdonalds and hasnt been to college.

Europe has a tax like you are talking about and its called the VAT and its to protect their economies and encourage people to buy locally made goods. Europeans always bitch how we get american stuff cheaper cause they get nailed with the VAT.

I know you dont like welfare, most people dont. You dont think it would be great to get rid of it and tell people to go get a damn job and there actually being jobs that need people? Sure there are people who just wont do shit but if you could get half of them doing something productive thats less people you have to pay for through taxes right? Better than sitting there and just bitching about people on welfare without offering a solution. Its easy to say, go get a job when there are none and people tend to not be to motivated when theres no opportunity.

Manufacturing isnt what it used to be? Seems to be working pretty well for the chinese. They have enough money to take care of their country and loan us money aswell. Robots may make alot of the parts but the assembly is still usually done by hand. Alot of those robots also have human operators.

Technology is a job killer, even more reason to hang on to every single job we can get.

For an example of how this effects you, there arent many surverying jobs cause companies arent building new factories here and arent buying exsisting buildings. They are investing heavily in china though, building like crazy actually. Maybe we could go survery in china? lol

The trouble with doing something right the first time is that nobody appreciates how difficult it was.
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post #13 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-07-2010, 11:06 PM
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just don't think $10 hour jobs are going to save the US. Ask your mom or dad how great it used to be, they always say growing up they had nothing. If the current average person lived like they did back then they would have plenty of money. If I didn't have 2 cell phones, internet,3 cars,buy cds,eat out 5 times a week, go hunting every other weekend, play softball, buy guns, go see movies the week they come out, have the kids in baseball and kick ball and all the other crap I waste money on I would have plenty of money. Mom has been in manufactoring her whole life at 56 years old she brings home around $300 a week working for a defense contractor, imagine if she was on an assembly line building toys. I could go get a warehouse job right now making 10-12 bucks an hour...whoo..hoo, jobs are there, but nobody wants to work for that crappy pay. Please quit watching "why we fight", find another video to worship

its still "we the people"right?

"So this is how democracy dies, with thunderous applause"

"a lesson lived is a lesson learned, everyday is a lesson."

obama is a man made disaster
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post #14 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-07-2010, 11:36 PM Thread Starter
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just don't think $10 hour jobs are going to save the US. Ask your mom or dad how great it used to be, they always say growing up they had nothing. If the current average person lived like they did back then they would have plenty of money. If I didn't have 2 cell phones, internet,3 cars,buy cds,eat out 5 times a week, go hunting every other weekend, play softball, buy guns, go see movies the week they come out, have the kids in baseball and kick ball and all the other crap I waste money on I would have plenty of money. Mom has been in manufactoring her whole life at 56 years old she brings home around $300 a week working for a defense contractor, imagine if she was on an assembly line building toys. I could go get a warehouse job right now making 10-12 bucks an hour...whoo..hoo, jobs are there, but nobody wants to work for that crappy pay. Please quit watching "why we fight", find another video to worship
I guess Trump is an idiot then? I would expect a business man like himself to love china but when he starts saying we are stupid and need to make a change that should tell ya something. I think he realizes that things must change and sees what its doing to his own country.

They wont be $10 an hour jobs, there will be so many jobs and they will need people to do them therefor they will pay good money for decent people not to mention, the greater opporunities that will come with it. Back then we encouraged immigration because we had so much work to do and not enough people to do it. Supply and demand, this is how it used to work, this country was built on this, it worked before and it will work now.

You left out the fact the kinda money mom used to make before her job was outsourced, last one being Nokia where she made $18 an hour soldering cell phone BY HAND with all her benefits and 401k she had before the plant was shut down and moved to mexico.

How about the christmas bonuses she used to get that bought all of us gifts, and the fact she had a stable job with opporunity to move up which her own father had done and she would have if she had been allowed to keep her job? Both my granddads worked at the same job for 30+ years and retired with a decent pension and made decent money after they had worked up to it. Sounds pretty damn good to me, id love to have that chance!

I know the reason they had it so hard at first was just because they were lazy, not that they were working and not getting anywhere. Dad joined the marines after grandpa told him to get a job, join the corp or get out. The reason mom makes so little now is because she doesnt have a degree, defense contractors make VERY good money, ask you friend that worked at Lockheed. You know about that.

You couldnt live on 10-12 bucks an hour with 3 kids without being on food stamps and every kind of government aid you could get. So yea, you could get a job but if you still cant afford to live on your own what good is it?

The trouble with doing something right the first time is that nobody appreciates how difficult it was.

Last edited by Slammy; 04-08-2010 at 12:40 AM.
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post #15 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-08-2010, 11:28 AM
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Some of you have bought into the myth that we are getting cheap goods from China. I'm into big block Fords 427's 428's. Back in the 60's you could buy a new forged crank from Ford for under $50.00 now that crank from China is $750.00. That new cheap Chinese crank isn't as good as the cranks were 45 years ago, the Chinese labor is less than what someone at Ford was making in the 60's and the cost of materials isn't that much different to cost an extra $700.00. The truth is you can only charge so much for a given product based on what the masses make. If more was manufactured in the US the prices wouldn't change on toys and you would have to pay employees a certain amount or you wouldn't have anyone there working. You just wouldn't have CEO's making millions in salaries. Don't get me wrong I don't have a problem with a company making a profit and the owner should make more than the employees but to many have forgot about the people that are supporting them in the long run in the name of making more profit.
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post #16 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-08-2010, 11:34 AM
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Dont worry Obamanana will fix uverythang.
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post #17 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-08-2010, 11:38 AM
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just don't think $10 hour jobs are going to save the US. Ask your mom or dad how great it used to be, they always say growing up they had nothing. If the current average person lived like they did back then they would have plenty of money. If I didn't have 2 cell phones, internet,3 cars,buy cds,eat out 5 times a week, go hunting every other weekend, play softball, buy guns, go see movies the week they come out, have the kids in baseball and kick ball and all the other crap I waste money on I would have plenty of money. Mom has been in manufactoring her whole life at 56 years old she brings home around $300 a week working for a defense contractor, imagine if she was on an assembly line building toys. I could go get a warehouse job right now making 10-12 bucks an hour...whoo..hoo, jobs are there, but nobody wants to work for that crappy pay. Please quit watching "why we fight", find another video to worship
These situations have a way of correcting themselves if we let them.

No one wants to work for $10-12 an hour because the economy isn't bad enough. If we keep sending our money to China the economy WILL get bad enough for people to want to work those jobs. The Chinese standard of living will also improve and their workers will start demanding higher wages.

I am not, by any means, advocating that we keep sending our money to China. I'm just saying that equilibrium will come back at some point if the system is allowed to right itself.
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post #18 of 18 (permalink) Old 04-08-2010, 11:41 AM
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Some of you have bought into the myth that we are getting cheap goods from China. I'm into big block Fords 427's 428's. Back in the 60's you could buy a new forged crank from Ford for under $50.00 now that crank from China is $750.00. That new cheap Chinese crank isn't as good as the cranks were 45 years ago, the Chinese labor is less than what someone at Ford was making in the 60's and the cost of materials isn't that much different to cost an extra $700.00. The truth is you can only charge so much for a given product based on what the masses make. If more was manufactured in the US the prices wouldn't change on toys and you would have to pay employees a certain amount or you wouldn't have anyone there working. You just wouldn't have CEO's making millions in salaries. Don't get me wrong I don't have a problem with a company making a profit and the owner should make more than the employees but to many have forgot about the people that are supporting them in the long run in the name of making more profit.
Just a thought here .... I am pretty sure that cost of inflation is a factor in the higher prices. That "under $50" figure you threw out there is about $400 in todays moneys.

Just so you are aware, a 1965 Mustang priced at $3334 back in 1964 would cost $22815.28 today. Not far off from the V6 prices today.
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