$109K a year not enough - DFWstangs Forums
 
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post #1 of 40 (permalink) Old 04-05-2010, 03:21 PM Thread Starter
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$109K a year not enough

http://www.komonews.com/news/local/89813027.html

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SEATTLE -- The Teamsters Local 174 says it has chosen not to accept Waste Management's 'best, last, final offer."
I hope they strike. 1,600 people have applied to be replacement workers and they need a job.
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post #2 of 40 (permalink) Old 04-05-2010, 03:31 PM
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I could hang off the back of a garbage truck for that money. Easy.

Give me a dollar.
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post #3 of 40 (permalink) Old 04-05-2010, 03:33 PM
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I think I could deal with the smell for a little while for that kind of money.
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post #4 of 40 (permalink) Old 04-05-2010, 03:34 PM
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I don't believe that 109k bs for one minute. The same thing is said about Railroaders anytime there is a contract issue. The media puts it out there that we all make 150k a year and it's a damn lie. Granted there might be a handful of guys that make that much but on average its about 70k to 80k depending on what job you work. They are doing the same thing here.

Hell just do the math from the article. At $27 bucks an hour and a 40hr work week you will make about 57k a year. Thats a far cry from 109k. Also you have to remember they are in seatle and the cost of living is high up there.

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post #5 of 40 (permalink) Old 04-05-2010, 03:36 PM
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By the last year of the contract, the average driver's annual compensation will reach $109,553, Waste Management said, and the company will contribute more than $15,000 per year to each employee's pension fund. (View the full proposal)

That there is the key word. It doesn't necessarily mean salary.
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post #6 of 40 (permalink) Old 04-05-2010, 03:36 PM
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That is just fucking insane.

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post #7 of 40 (permalink) Old 04-05-2010, 03:49 PM
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so thats salary + benefits + expenses ?
I can see benefits totaling up to $30-40K a year, but of course insurance pays that

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post #8 of 40 (permalink) Old 04-05-2010, 03:50 PM
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so thats salary + benefits + expenses ?
I can see benefits totaling up to $30-40K a year, but of course insurance pays that
+ time and a half overtime + double time Sundays and triple time holidays.
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post #9 of 40 (permalink) Old 04-05-2010, 03:52 PM Thread Starter
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$109k is total compensation. If you think that the city does not figure in total cost in to their books, then you no nothing about doing business.

My company supplies all of employees with our benefit costs, which is about $13k above my salary, not $50k+ like the trash men.
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post #10 of 40 (permalink) Old 04-05-2010, 03:52 PM
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so thats salary + benefits + expenses ?
I can see benefits totaling up to $30-40K a year, but of course insurance pays that
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+ time and a half overtime + double time Sundays and triple time holidays.
Don't forget the 15k a year in pension.
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post #11 of 40 (permalink) Old 04-05-2010, 03:53 PM
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By the last year of the contract, the average driver's annual compensation will reach $109,553, Waste Management said, and the company will contribute more than $15,000 per year to each employee's pension fund. (View the full proposal)

That there is the key word. It doesn't necessarily mean salary.


It's still all bullshit trust me. The company is supplying the numbers. They don't tell you what group of driver's they averaged to get to 109k. I'd bet money its the guys that have 30 plus years and are at the top of the pay scale. This is the oldest play in the book in contract disputes that are headed towards a strike.

A strike only works if you can get the general public to take up your cause and feel sorry for you. Of course Waste Management is going to say their drivers make 109k a year so the general public thinks all their workers are greedy bastards and don't deserve shit. And by the looks of this thread it's working.

TRAIN TRASH it's like WHITE TRASH but with money.

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post #12 of 40 (permalink) Old 04-05-2010, 03:56 PM
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It's still all bullshit trust me. The company is supplying the numbers. They don't tell you what group of driver's they averaged to get to 109k. I'd bet money its the guys that have 30 plus years and are at the top of the pay scale. This is the oldest play in the book in contract disputes that are headed towards a strike.

A strike only works if you can get the general public to take up your cause and feel sorry for you. Of course Waste Management is going to say their drivers make 109k a year so the general public thinks all their workers are greedy bastards and don't deserve shit. And by the looks of this thread it's working.
I understand your view on it, and I don't go to either extreme myself. But it is hard to get past a 15k pension a year, and $27 an hour to drive a trash truck. That is a pretty high pay scale.
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post #13 of 40 (permalink) Old 04-05-2010, 03:56 PM
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Getting paid $57K to drive a garbage truck is part of what is wrong with this fucking country. I see people cry about CEOs and companies making too much money all the time. Meanwhile they forget about these assholes who think they should make six figures for picking up garbage.
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post #14 of 40 (permalink) Old 04-05-2010, 04:08 PM
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It's still all bullshit trust me. The company is supplying the numbers. They don't tell you what group of driver's they averaged to get to 109k. I'd bet money its the guys that have 30 plus years and are at the top of the pay scale. This is the oldest play in the book in contract disputes that are headed towards a strike.

A strike only works if you can get the general public to take up your cause and feel sorry for you. Of course Waste Management is going to say their drivers make 109k a year so the general public thinks all their workers are greedy bastards and don't deserve shit. And by the looks of this thread it's working.
So $50k after taxes, with no worry about retirement ($15k a year in investment principle is a lot), and health care isn't enough? Go to school. No one's making them work that job.

Give me a dollar.
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post #15 of 40 (permalink) Old 04-05-2010, 04:15 PM
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I cant believe with all the financial wizards on this site, that you guys fall fro the same propganda over and over. It was the same with every union contract. They add up every small thing and throw a crazy anual number out there to turn the population again the union.

What is the difference in one of your jobs getting paid $26/hour and a union job as far as money goes? Are you telling me even though you gross less than $50k/year, you cost your company $109k/year? If not, then would these guys?
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post #16 of 40 (permalink) Old 04-05-2010, 04:21 PM
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I understand your view on it, and I don't go to either extreme myself. But it is hard to get past a 15k pension a year, and $27 an hour to drive a trash truck. That is a pretty high pay scale.

I agree they are paid pretty damn good, but you also have to take into account where they live. It's not cheap to live in Seattle and alot of times folks just look at the numbers and don't think to cosider the difference of cost of living. Here is a link to show the folks that don't think about cost of living.

http://www.bestplaces.net/COL/?salar...city2=55363000



In my opinion without seeing the actual contract and just going by the money side of it I think they should take the deal. They get a 3.7% raise the first year and a 1k signing bonus. In this economy alot of folks would like to get that. Of course I don't know what work rules will be changed or if the company wants to cut their benefits.

TRAIN TRASH it's like WHITE TRASH but with money.

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post #17 of 40 (permalink) Old 04-05-2010, 04:33 PM
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Getting paid $57K to drive a garbage truck is part of what is wrong with this fucking country. I see people cry about CEOs and companies making too much money all the time. Meanwhile they forget about these assholes who think they should make six figures for picking up garbage.
What's been said.

You're paid nearly $60K to drive a garbage truck!!! Plus medical, pension, and 401K fully funded (my guess based on the $109K). Not too mention I'm sure there's job bank BS and other union niceties.

There's a ton of college degree-d, white collar, technical-skilled people that don't get paid that much!

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post #18 of 40 (permalink) Old 04-05-2010, 04:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Lason View Post
I cant believe with all the financial wizards on this site, that you guys fall fro the same propganda over and over. It was the same with every union contract. They add up every small thing and throw a crazy anual number out there to turn the population again the union.

What is the difference in one of your jobs getting paid $26/hour and a union job as far as money goes? Are you telling me even though you gross less than $50k/year, you cost your company $109k/year? If not, then would these guys?
There are guys at work making $20/hr that bust ass and gross $85k a year. $100+ is way possible with $26/hr.

Give me a dollar.
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post #19 of 40 (permalink) Old 04-05-2010, 04:44 PM
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In my opinion without seeing the actual contract and just going by the money side of it I think they should take the deal. They get a 3.7% raise the first year and a 1k signing bonus. In this economy alot of folks would like to get that. Of course I don't know what work rules will be changed or if the company wants to cut their benefits.
of course they should take the deal - that's gonna be a large part of the public's anger toward them if they don't, because there are so many people out there that do not have a job, and would jump at a chance to take the deal that the union is turning down.

Instead, we'll have to go thru a rail strike now

But then again, i'm probably biased. After all, I liked ronald regans strategy when the union would not negotiate and the air traffic controllers went on strike.
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post #20 of 40 (permalink) Old 04-05-2010, 04:45 PM
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What's been said.

You're paid nearly $60K to drive a garbage truck!!! Plus medical, pension, and 401K fully funded (my guess based on the $109K). Not too mention I'm sure there's job bank BS and other union niceties.

There's a ton of college degree-d, white collar, technical-skilled people that don't get paid that much!
And no one is stopping those white collar college educated folks from picking up trash either. Thats the problem with this site and our elitist society. You hate to see someone that didn't go to school make a decent living. Alot of Americans think their fellow country men should work in sweat shops for $3 an hour because they wear a shirt that has their name on the front.

I got news for yall if you think a garbage man shouldn't make 30k a year your going to shit when you find out what an electrician, plumber, or mechanic make. I have a buddy that works for a kawasaki dealership and his flag rate is over $30 an hour. These days it pays to get your hands dirty.

TRAIN TRASH it's like WHITE TRASH but with money.

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post #21 of 40 (permalink) Old 04-05-2010, 04:48 PM
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And no one is stopping those white collar college educated folks from picking up trash either. Thats the problem with this site and our elitist society. You hate to see someone that didn't go to school make a decent living. Alot of Americans think their fellow country men should work in sweat shops for $3 an hour because they wear a shirt that has their name on the front.

I got news for yall if you think a garbage man shouldn't make 30k a year your going to shit when you find out what an electrician, plumber, or mechanic make. I have a buddy that works for a kawasaki dealership and his flag rate is over $30 an hour. These days it pays to get your hands dirty.
An electrician, plumber, and mechanic are professions. You can't just walk off the street, take a class and be an electirician. They are a skilled workforce. Anyone can get a license and be a garbage truck driver.
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post #22 of 40 (permalink) Old 04-05-2010, 04:48 PM
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I cant believe with all the financial wizards on this site, that you guys fall fro the same propganda over and over. It was the same with every union contract. They add up every small thing and throw a crazy anual number out there to turn the population again the union.

What is the difference in one of your jobs getting paid $26/hour and a union job as far as money goes? Are you telling me even though you gross less than $50k/year, you cost your company $109k/year? If not, then would these guys?
I don't need anything crazy to turn me against the union when the guy driving a garbage truck complains about making $26 an hour. He's a fucking garbage man!

I don't care where he lives...he's a garbage man!

Are some of the people in this thread now going to proceed to convince me that being a garbage man is "skilled labor"? That is usually the next place we go to in these union discussions....

"Well, you can't just hire someone off the street to blah blah blah....."
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post #23 of 40 (permalink) Old 04-05-2010, 04:49 PM
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I don't need anything crazy to turn me against the union when the guy driving a garbage truck complains about making $26 an hour. He's a fucking garbage man!

I don't care where he lives...he's a garbage man!

Are some of the people in this thread now going to proceed to convince me that being a garbage man is "skilled labor"? That is usually the next place we go to in these union discussions....

"Well, you can't just hire someone off the street to blah blah blah....."
I lol'ed we just went this route.
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post #24 of 40 (permalink) Old 04-05-2010, 04:58 PM
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Union labor is bad! Remember if the job calls for one man (non union) it will require one plus .35 men if you use union labor for the same job. Ask me how I know! Again UNION LABOR IS BAD!

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post #25 of 40 (permalink) Old 04-05-2010, 04:58 PM
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I got news for you freighttrain. Until guys like you and I (skilled labor) work our way past our current station, we're the, "help." We're, "the other half." Do we deserve a living wage? Yes. If they can't live on $26/hr, I don't know what their problem is. I could live in Manhattan at that wage. You could, too. If I'm not satisfied, I am allowed to work my way up. The only person stopping me is me.

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post #26 of 40 (permalink) Old 04-05-2010, 05:04 PM
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I got news for yall if you think a garbage man shouldn't make 30k a year your going to shit when you find out what an electrician, plumber, or mechanic make.
fucking plumber charged me $1k to fix a leak in my water supply line. His helper did all of the digging. He just stood around and glued in the replacement pieces once the line was dug up. If i had known what the charge was going to be i'd have dug it up myself and fixed it, but i was working on a project with a hard deadline and i really didn't have the time at that moment. He had me at a disadvantage when he quoted me the price since my water line had just been dug up. Pissed me off royally.

It's not rocket science for the most part. And electricians are in the same boat.
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post #27 of 40 (permalink) Old 04-05-2010, 05:08 PM
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And no one is stopping those white collar college educated folks from picking up trash either. Thats the problem with this site and our elitist society. You hate to see someone that didn't go to school make a decent living. Alot of Americans think their fellow country men should work in sweat shops for $3 an hour because they wear a shirt that has their name on the front.

I got news for yall if you think a garbage man shouldn't make 30k a year your going to shit when you find out what an electrician, plumber, or mechanic make. I have a buddy that works for a kawasaki dealership and his flag rate is over $30 an hour. These days it pays to get your hands dirty.
Nobody has a problem with them making a decent living, the problem is they are bitching about the decent living they are making.

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post #28 of 40 (permalink) Old 04-05-2010, 05:08 PM
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fucking plumber charged me $1k to fix a leak in my water supply line. His helper did all of the digging. He just stood around and glued in the replacement pieces once the line was dug up. If i had known what the charge was going to be i'd have dug it up myself and fixed it, but i was working on a project with a hard deadline and i really didn't have the time at that moment. He had me at a disadvantage when he quoted me the price since my water line had just been dug up. Pissed me off royally.

It's not rocket science for the most part. And electricians are in the same boat.
Hope he used some KY on ya...
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post #29 of 40 (permalink) Old 04-05-2010, 05:10 PM
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If I'm not satisfied, I am allowed to work my way up. The only person stopping me is me.
x2

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post #30 of 40 (permalink) Old 04-05-2010, 05:16 PM
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then you no nothing about doing business.
Lmao...
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post #31 of 40 (permalink) Old 04-05-2010, 05:17 PM
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What's really funny, is that the same people who defend garbage men making $60k a year, will also bitch about US companies shipping jobs overseas.
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post #32 of 40 (permalink) Old 04-05-2010, 05:39 PM
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An electrician, plumber, and mechanic are professions. You can't just walk off the street, take a class and be an electirician. They are a skilled workforce. Anyone can get a license and be a garbage truck driver.
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Are some of the people in this thread now going to proceed to convince me that being a garbage man is "skilled labor"? That is usually the next place we go to in these union discussions....

"Well, you can't just hire someone off the street to blah blah blah....."
My point exactly. Do you even need a CDL to drive a garbage truck? In house training to run the damn thing and you're off. It's equivalent to being on an assembly line or flipping burgers, IMO. There's inherent "skill", but in-house training covers that. It's not like you have to calculate wire loads or water pressure in a system before hand.

Drive truck. Stop at trash can. Make automatic arm grab trash can. Dump trash. Move on to next trash can. FFS, any high school grad could do that.

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post #33 of 40 (permalink) Old 04-06-2010, 06:20 PM Thread Starter
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post #34 of 40 (permalink) Old 04-06-2010, 06:24 PM
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What's really funny, is that the same people who defend garbage men making $60k a year, will also bitch about US companies shipping jobs overseas.
LMAO! I had yet to make that connection, but this is all the more hysterical now.

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post #35 of 40 (permalink) Old 04-06-2010, 06:28 PM
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We need some people willing to work for a living... They said no to 15K added to their pension? What the fuck is wrong with these assholes?! 95% of the country would KILL to have an annual pension equal to 1/4 of their salary funded SOLELY by their company!

Seriously... they ride around on a motherfucking garbage truck.

People wonder why illegals take up all the lower paying 'yobs'... because it costs too much to hire someone who's 'legal' and wants $20 an hour to fry a taco at On The Border.

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post #36 of 40 (permalink) Old 04-06-2010, 07:38 PM
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Unions are far past their times. If there is someone willing to do the job for less, the company should be able to hire them and flip off the unions. Screw them. Work for what the business is willing to pay and if you don't like it, someone else will. Especially in this economy
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post #37 of 40 (permalink) Old 04-06-2010, 07:58 PM
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while my job is union, i feel certain lines of work certainly dont need to be paid what they are getting.



then again all I hear is bitching about how these people shouldnt be making this money, and they would do the job. Stop fuckin kidding your self, if you would then you already would be there doing it.

Simple fact is most the people who say they will do a job, wont wake up at 2-3am every day of the week M-F (my job is MANDATORY 7 DAYS A WEEK RIGHT NOW) to go drive a trash truck around for 8hrs a day or most any job honestly. Like most americans they are to lazy to do it. I couldnt tell you how many pussies I have seen talk that shit about being able to get up and work the hours my job and coworkers and I do, only to quit because they cant handle the hours. And the whole time at work all they do is fucking cry about having to work 6-7 days a week for 10-12hrs a day. Thank god for a 90 day evaluation period or they couldnt fire losers like that.


My hire in group was 20 strong the first day, a year later there was 5 of us left.........




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post #38 of 40 (permalink) Old 04-06-2010, 08:01 PM
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I'd get to sleep in until 3AM and only work 10-12 hours for 109k? Sign me up! lol
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post #39 of 40 (permalink) Old 04-06-2010, 08:08 PM
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I'd get to sleep in until 3AM and only work 10-12 hours for 109k? Sign me up! lol


its not 109k...... its their salary plus benifits (medical, dental, vision, life insureance, workmans comp coverage, ect.)


Their base pay is probably around 45k a year before taxes. For a top paid employee

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post #40 of 40 (permalink) Old 04-06-2010, 09:11 PM
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while my job is union, i feel certain lines of work certainly dont need to be paid what they are getting.



then again all I hear is bitching about how these people shouldnt be making this money, and they would do the job. Stop fuckin kidding your self, if you would then you already would be there doing it.

Simple fact is most the people who say they will do a job, wont wake up at 2-3am every day of the week M-F (my job is MANDATORY 7 DAYS A WEEK RIGHT NOW) to go drive a trash truck around for 8hrs a day or most any job honestly. Like most americans they are to lazy to do it. I couldnt tell you how many pussies I have seen talk that shit about being able to get up and work the hours my job and coworkers and I do, only to quit because they cant handle the hours. And the whole time at work all they do is fucking cry about having to work 6-7 days a week for 10-12hrs a day. Thank god for a 90 day evaluation period or they couldnt fire losers like that.


My hire in group was 20 strong the first day, a year later there was 5 of us left.........




Remember " If it was easy, everyone would be doing it. "
A lot of unionized jobs have a lot of people quit because of the hours, mainly because low seniority gets the shitty shift. To me that argument makes little sense if it is completely unskilled labor. That is because you just get another batch of 20 people to do the job. The qualifications aren't high. Eventually you will have 20 that will stick around or you will have a reasonable rate of turnover.

I had a Teamsters job that was like that, 10pm to 7am on the freight dock. I told them to shove it up their ass when I got called back to my nice cushy job at GM on the assembly line. The Teamsters never had any problem getting new batches of people at $14 an hour and many of them didn't make it a week. They'd just bring in the next batch and keep right on truckin' (pun intended).
AL P is offline  
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