Heath Care Bill is all but dead..... - DFWstangs Forums
 
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post #1 of 19 (permalink) Old 01-21-2010, 07:22 PM Thread Starter
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Heath Care Bill is all but dead.....

Well, Brown's election has started driving that final nail into the health care bill coffin...

I'm pretty sure we can say the same for Cap and Trade.


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WASHINGTON (AP) -- Though reeling from a political body blow, House Democrats rejected the quickest fix to their health care dilemma Thursday and signaled that any agreement on President Barack Obama's signature issue will come slowly, if at all.

Democrats weighed a handful of difficult options as they continued to absorb Republican Scott Brown's election to the Massachusetts Senate seat long held by Edward M. Kennedy. Several said Obama must forcefully help them find a way to avoid the humiliation of enacting no bill, and they urged him to do so quickly, to put the painful process behind them.

House leaders said they could not pass a Senate-approved bill, standing by itself, because of objections from liberals and moderates alike. Such a move could have settled the matter, because it would not have required further Senate action. Brown's stunning victory restored the GOP's power to block bills with Senate filibusters.

Democratic leaders weighed two main options, both problematic. The first would require congressional Democrats to muscle their way past stiff GOP objections despite warning signs from Massachusetts voters and worries about next November's elections.

The other would pare down the original health care legislation in hopes of gaining some Republican support. But the compromise process is more difficult than many lawmakers suggest.

Democrats' hopes of settling on a strategy by the weekend seemed to fade, as lawmakers struggled to comprehend the drawbacks of every option.

"We have to get a bill passed," said House Speaker Nancy Pelosi, D-Calif., because her party would have no excuse for failing to revamp health care when it controls Congress and the White House.

Some lawmakers said it will take time for congressional Democrats, who huddled repeatedly Thursday, to realize how limited their options are. "People are at various levels of the seven stages of grief," said Rep. Anthony Weiner, D-N.Y.

The first chief option would require House Democrats to approve the Senate-passed bill along with a guarantee that the Senate would make several simultaneous changes to health law desired by the House. Senate Democrats presumably would do so with a tactic called "budget reconciliation." It requires only a simple-majority vote for certain budget-related matters, but it cannot be used for every issue. Both parties have used the tactic at times.

When Brown is sworn in, Democrats will control 59 of the Senate's 100 seats. They need 60 to block GOP filibusters.

The second option calls for drafting a new, compromise bill more palatable to moderates, including some Republicans. But numerous officials said it's far easier said than done.

For instance, a widely popular goal is to bar health insurers from refusing coverage to people already suffering medical problems. But without requiring most people to buy coverage, millions might wait until they have a serious problem before buying a policy, driving coverage costs to unsustainable levels.

Moreover, "individual mandates" to buy insurance would almost certainly require government subsidies for low-income people. And that in turn would require new government revenues, such as taxes.

Many of these interconnected features drew strong objections, especially from Republicans, when the House and Senate passed competing versions of health care revisions last month.

Pelosi cited the dilemma Thursday.

"I don't think anybody disagrees with 'Let's pass the popular part of the bill,'" she told reporters. "But some of the popular parts of the bill is the engine that drives some of the rest of it," which is far less popular, she said.

Outside groups were more blunt.

"You can't do it," said Ron Pollack of the liberal-leaning Families USA. Enacting popular "insurance reforms" won't work without the more controversial and expensive steps of expanding coverage to the uninsured, he said.

Some lawmakers talked of placing partial limits on insurance companies' ability to deny coverage to those with pre-existing medical conditions. Companies might be required to cover sick children, or to keep covering customers who become sick and failed to disclose every detail of their medical histories when first buying their policies.

Such compromises could leave Obama well short of the universal coverage he touted during his 2008 campaign.

House Democrats cite many objections to the Senate-passed bill, which make them wary of adopting it without some type of ironclad guarantee of improvements by the newly configured Senate.

But budget reconciliation is one of Congress's most complex and controversial exercises, and it's not clear how many House objections can be remedied with the process.

A widely criticized feature of the Senate bill made special Medicaid concessions to Nebraska, demanded by Democratic Sen. Ben Nelson. Senators promised to expand the help to all 50 states, but Brown's election cut that negotiation process short.

Congressional budget referees said Thursday it would cost $35 billion over 10 years to extend the so-called "Cornhusker Kickback" to every state.

Some Democrats said Obama must lead his dispirited party to a resolution.

"He has got to bring the Senate and the House together," said Rep. Elijah Cummings, D-Md. "He has got to help all of us pave a way to get it done."

White House spokesman Robert Gibbs said Obama thinks the best path is "giving this some time, by letting the dust settle, if you will, and looking for the best path forward." He said Obama does not believe a major health care revision is dead.

Asked what is next for the legislation, Sen. Debbie Stabenow, D-Mich., shaped her hand like a gun and pointed to her head. "We're looking to see what there's support to do," she said.


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post #2 of 19 (permalink) Old 01-21-2010, 07:44 PM
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thank god! (the one mentioned in the BIBLE)

but watch for it to cme in another form.we have not seen the end of this kind of stuff.watch for better advertising technics to get the people wrapped around the new ideas.

RON PAUL '08
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post #3 of 19 (permalink) Old 01-21-2010, 07:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sgt Beavis View Post
"We have to get a bill passed," said House Speaker Nancy Pelosi, D-Calif., because her party would have no excuse for failing to revamp health care when it controls Congress and the White House.
Fuck her!!! Too late Bitch!! HAHA

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post #4 of 19 (permalink) Old 01-21-2010, 08:04 PM
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It's not dead yet.... they'll cajole a vote or 2 from some RHINOs.

The leftists know its now or never.

They'll pull out every stop.... bribe anyone, sue anyone, say anything, threaten anyone to get it... you watch....

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post #5 of 19 (permalink) Old 01-21-2010, 08:09 PM Thread Starter
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I do think we need some sort of Heath Care reform but not that socialized medicine shit. Unfortunately the Democrats are the only ones that can pass a bill and they don't believe that there is any sort of solution without government intervention.

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post #6 of 19 (permalink) Old 01-21-2010, 08:17 PM
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I find it deliciously ironic that the liberal health care champion died, and his replacement put the kibosh on the dem's plans
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post #7 of 19 (permalink) Old 01-21-2010, 08:20 PM Thread Starter
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It's not dead yet.... they'll cajole a vote or 2 from some RHINOs.

The leftists know its now or never.

They'll pull out every stop.... bribe anyone, sue anyone, say anything, threaten anyone to get it... you watch....
Actually it is RINO.

And no, they can't. Not with THIS bill. The Senate version is done. The only way to make a real change to it is in conference committee. The House version of this bill has no chance in hell of passage. The Republican's wouldn't even need a filibuster. The Senate version has no chance in hell in passing the House (where there is no filibuster). Any compromise of the Senate version is going to cost Senate votes and will result in a successful filibuster.

The ONLY way they can hope to get RINO support is to start all over with a new bill. They might be able to do that in the Senate but any compromises won there will die in the House version.

Gotta love gridlock..

IMO there is only one way they can pass meaningful reform. That is to attack this through multiple bills that go at the problem one bit at a time. IMO that is actually the right way to do it anyways. The problem is that Pelosi and Reid don't want to do it that way. They believe in all or nothing. It also doesn't help that those morons have alienated House and Senate Republican to the point that they are polarized on the issue at hand..

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post #8 of 19 (permalink) Old 01-21-2010, 08:27 PM
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I'm just ecstatic!

I really feel like the American people have finally won. We are being heard.

Damn I can't wait until November.

Throw them sorry fuckers out on their asses!

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(thats right, in a fucking duel with guns, Jackson allowed his oppenent to fucking shoot at him before shooting back). Now we have Obama, who is a little bitch. God damn the presidency of the US is just not the same as it used to be.
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post #9 of 19 (permalink) Old 01-21-2010, 08:41 PM
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The whole health care bill is nothing compared to the Cap & Trade clusterfu*k.... let's hope and pray, for the sake of our economy and future, that both are dead in the water.

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post #10 of 19 (permalink) Old 01-21-2010, 09:03 PM
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Maybe I'm nieve about it, but I think health care as the Democrats want to see it is DOA. Cap and Trade is probably dead as well at this point. Democrats are scattering like roaches with the lights just turned on. If the Republicans think they have the control, they'd better prepare for a loss in November. They'd better stick to conservative ideals and show Americans that they want to stop spending and get the economy back on track instead of gloating about stopping the Dems themself.
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post #11 of 19 (permalink) Old 01-21-2010, 09:12 PM
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IF they were to push this through after what happened, they will have a Revolution on their hands. The American people have spoken, and they are pissed off.

CANADIANS = DOUCHERS

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post #12 of 19 (permalink) Old 01-21-2010, 09:17 PM
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It's a trap!

1/19/09, the last day of Free America.
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post #13 of 19 (permalink) Old 01-21-2010, 10:27 PM
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IF they were to push this through after what happened, they will have a Revolution on their hands. The American people have spoken, and they are pissed off.
+1.

We have done this the right way so far. We (those of us that have had elections lately) have made a revolution at the polls.

If this doesn't work, things could get very very messy.

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Originally Posted by DOHCTR View Post
(thats right, in a fucking duel with guns, Jackson allowed his oppenent to fucking shoot at him before shooting back). Now we have Obama, who is a little bitch. God damn the presidency of the US is just not the same as it used to be.
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post #14 of 19 (permalink) Old 01-21-2010, 10:32 PM
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Lol. There will never be a revolution. They could send the JBTs into every living room in America and not a damned thing would happen save people still bitching...
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post #15 of 19 (permalink) Old 01-21-2010, 10:44 PM
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It's a trap!
LMAO

i still can't believe massachussetts didn't fuck this up.

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post #16 of 19 (permalink) Old 01-21-2010, 11:29 PM
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Actually it is RINO.
Of course, You are correct: Republican In Name Only....

That's what happens when I type before I think....

Anyway, let's hope you are right....

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post #17 of 19 (permalink) Old 01-22-2010, 08:28 AM
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I dont believe its dead, before the election the dems didn't have 60 votes and it got as far as it did. there is going to be some deal making, and some changes, there is still a good chance of it passing.

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post #18 of 19 (permalink) Old 01-22-2010, 08:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sgt Beavis View Post
I do think we need some sort of Heath Care reform but not that socialized medicine shit. Unfortunately the Democrats are the only ones that can pass a bill and they don't believe that there is any sort of solution without government intervention.
Dems aren't the only ones that can pass a bill...FFS...Republicans can do it too.

The problem is, our health care is FINE, but what the politicians are missing is that its the COSTS that the people want wrestled, not the availability, not the quality of care. Republicans did have some plans on the plate that attempted to do that (ergo allowing plans across states lines), but the Dems wanted no part of that. They just wanted socialized control.

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post #19 of 19 (permalink) Old 01-22-2010, 11:26 AM Thread Starter
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Dems aren't the only ones that can pass a bill...FFS...Republicans can do it too.

The problem is, our health care is FINE, but what the politicians are missing is that its the COSTS that the people want wrestled, not the availability, not the quality of care. Republicans did have some plans on the plate that attempted to do that (ergo allowing plans across states lines), but the Dems wanted no part of that. They just wanted socialized control.
We are in agreement... We just want to address the costs..

I do think there are a lot of other things that need to be done but most of those can be done in the market place. Any government regulation should only encourage the marketplace to reduce cost and improve services.

The closest thing I think the government "might" (hard emphasis on might) want to do is offer a reinsurance program for higher risk coverage. This is similar to what the government already does with the National Flood Insurance program. IMO, this would be the sort of program that covers folks that are normally un-insurable due to pre-existing condition. Again, emphasis on MIGHT.

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