Texas Republican Governor Debate - DFWstangs Forums
View Poll Results: Who won the Debate?
Perry 12 23.08%
Hutchison 5 9.62%
Medina 35 67.31%
Voters: 52. You may not vote on this poll

 
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post #1 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-15-2010, 09:26 AM Thread Starter
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Texas Republican Governor Debate

DENTON – Taxes and testiness dominated the first debate between the Republican candidates for governor, as Gov. Rick Perry and U.S. Sen. Kay Bailey Hutchison each suggested the other had lost contact with the truth.

"I know the truth is sometimes hard to recognize when you've been in Washington for 16 years," Perry said. "The truth is that we have the second-lowest tax burden in America as a state."

Hutchison countered that the state is facing a huge deficit, made larger by the $12 billion in federal economic stimulus funding that Perry accepted and the Legislature relied on to balance the state budget. "The buck stops at your desk," she said.

The pair was joined by Debra Medina, a state-sovereignty advocate who has suggested eliminating property taxes, gun restrictions and many drug laws. And she helped Hutchison put Perry on the defensive. But the night was dominated by the open warfare between Perry and Hutchison, two titans of Texas Republican politics who have battled for months in advance of their March 2 primary.

Much of the hourlong debate, sponsored by Dallas public television station KERA and other news organizations, focused on federal issues and tax and budget matters. Questions also delved into two topics that drive Republican voters: abortion and illegal immigration. But the candidates scarcely discussed education, transportation, college tuition or other key issues facing the next governor.

Perry strove to stick to his main themes: that Texas is the envy of other states because of its relatively strong economy and that Washington regulations will drag the state down.

"While America was losing 3 million jobs because of the Washington type of spend-it-all, spend-it-now approach, Texas was creating almost 100,000 jobs," Perry said.

Hutchison argued that the state may lose its luster quickly with looming deficits, high dropout rates, rising taxes on businesses and cronyism creeping into Austin.

"We lost 300,000 jobs in Texas alone this year. That is not a record to be proud of," she said.

She added: "If we don't deal with the problems of this, we will not remain the best state in America. And hiding from them is not the way to make it better."

The governor became particularly testy when he was questioned about job-creation numbers, which relied on statistics from two years ago. When asked if Texas hadn't lost jobs this year, Perry retorted: "I don't know how to explain this to you any simpler."

He said people were voting with their feet and moving to Texas.

"It really wears me out that we have two people on stage here that want to tear Texas down, when the fact is that everyone understands this is the state you want to live in," he said.

Perry and Hutchison also interrupted and questioned each other on the $700 billion federal bailout. She voted for the first part of the spending under the Bush administration, which Perry has taken to paint her as a Washington insider.

She pointed out that the governor wrote a letter to Congress urging it to pass a bill to save the national and global economy. He contends that he didn't necessarily mean the TARP bailout that Congress eventually approved.

"We thought you were smart enough to understand [it meant] to stop the spending and cut the taxes," Perry said. "Maybe I should have made it a little clearer for you."

The TARP bill was the only proposal before Congress when he wrote the letter, she shot back, saying he was being disingenuous on the issue.

"Governor, you asked for it, too; you were for it before you were against it," she said, harking to back to the criticism of John Kerry when he ran for president.

The other issue that divided the two sharply was the $16 billion property tax cut that was swapped for broader taxes on businesses, smokers and used-car sales.

The senator said property owners never saw a decrease because appraisals kept rising. The business tax, Hutchison contended, has burdened small shops and amounted to the largest tax in state history.

"You have permanently increased taxes on business," she said. "That's not conservative."

Medina was even harsher, saying Texas would become California and saying the governor was "painting a rosy picture that doesn't exist."

But Perry held firm, touting the cut in the tax he signed last year that benefited 44,000 small businesses.

"We have a state that's rolling. People are leaving their states to come here," he said. "They wouldn't be coming to Texas, senator, if it was the kind of place you've painted it the last six months."

Hutchison said the future under Perry looks grim.

"You are presiding over a budget that's getting ready to go into a $17 billion deficit," Hutchison said.

Perry responded: "We will cut it. Just like we did in 200

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post #2 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-15-2010, 10:00 AM
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I think they each had good points. Medina stuck to her guns, I think she would be a good governor but I don't believe she'll get anywhere.

Hutchison, at times, hit me like an old, elitist hag. She has also been in D.C. long enough to get tainted and I'm afraid she'd bring some of that back here. I do like that she wants to cut property taxes. In a lot of situations, they fall under confiscatory due to levels. Here's an example. My parents had a 102 acre 'ranch' in Colorado, with a 6000sq ft custom log home in a desirable area. 1996 price was $635,000. They spent $635 in taxes (non-ag). Granted, Colorado has state income, but you also have the ability to itemize deductions and get the burden as low as possible. That same $635,000 place down here in a place like Mckinney would carry a tax burden of almost $20,000/yr.

In theory, a family making $108,000 could swing that house (based on 40% income model). With the property tax coming into play, the escrow payment jumps by $1600/month and now takes up nearly 60% of that families income. Not to mention, that over a 30 year span, over $600,000 are paid in as taxes, and removed from that families spending/savings/net worth, etc.

Perry was confident, as usual. He did a fair amount of dodging or swaying facts, but I like the guy. The economy in Texas is arguably the best in the world right now. People are moving in, and more importantly, companies are moving in. I really hope he has the balls to follow up on what he says in regards to the 10th amendment. I'd like to see a state bill that gives every Texan immunity from Obamacare and allows us to choose what WE want, or if we want anything at all.

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post #3 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-15-2010, 10:33 AM
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I agree property taxes are way to high most of it goes to schools. In Oklahoma they don't have school tax, but they do pay more in sales tax and have a state income tax, much like Colorado.

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post #4 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-15-2010, 10:50 AM
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I agree property taxes are way to high most of it goes to schools. In Oklahoma they don't have school tax, but they do pay more in sales tax and have a state income tax, much like Colorado.
What are the rates? 8.25% isn't exactly light.

1/19/09, the last day of Free America.
Pericles "Freedom is the sure possession of those alone who have the courage to defend it. "

"[T]he people alone have an incontestable, unalienable, and indefeasible right to institute government and to reform, alter, or totally change the same when their protection, safety, prosperity, and happiness require it." --Samuel Adams


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post #5 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-15-2010, 10:55 AM
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What are the rates? 8.25% isn't exactly light.
The tax rate for Oklahoma City (73120) is 8.375%.

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post #6 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-15-2010, 11:08 AM
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The tax rate for Oklahoma City (73120) is 8.375%.
They also pay it on ALL items purchased, in Texas you do get a break on "groceries".

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post #7 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-15-2010, 11:11 AM
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didnt see anything about the real debate, when we gonna see something real done about all these damn illegals we have? Solution is simple, fine businesses that hire them, no need for millions of dollars for a worthless fence. Time to put some value in what it means in being an amercan citizen!

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post #8 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-15-2010, 11:13 AM Thread Starter
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I am not sure perry knew what he was doing up there, the only stats he seemed to have were from 2007, he offered nothing in terms of dealing with the illegals, when asked about the tax increase that he signed all he mentioned was how good the economy was, when he was asked about Texas forcing hospitals to pull the plug on people Perry gave a dumbfounded look and then mentioned that he was prolife. I was leaning towards Perry, but his performance last night reminded me of a saturday night live skit.

Hutchinson did good, her only real problem came when she was asked about overturning roe v wade, she appeared to stand behind its decision. she came to the debate very prepared, and took plenty of shots at Perry. though she found herself under attack from Medina on her record voting for the bail out.

Medina came out of this debate the strongest, and probably gained some momentum. she was the only candidate that wanted to provide gun owners with more rights, she was bold in stating that she would use the texas national guard to patrol the border, the other candidates were quiet on these subjects.

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post #9 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-15-2010, 11:18 AM
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Hutchison needs to resign as senator and Medina needs to take her spot.
I think she’d make a better senator than governor at least.

I’m just not a big Hutchison fan, she’s burned too many bridges with me over the years.
Perry has done a good enough job and when he’s passionate about an issue he’s right on.

just my opinion...
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post #10 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-15-2010, 11:24 AM
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Perry did not answer any questions directly and then tried to use 2007-8 numbers for job creation as well as jobs in the state govt being created rather than private sector. He just smiled and tried to brush off everything with no substance. Medina made the most sense to me.
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post #11 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-15-2010, 11:32 AM
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I like Medina also but I don't know if she is ready to run this state. Kinda like letting a Junior Senator, Voting present, Community organizer into the white house. I would like to see her run for lieutenant governor first. Once elected and has proven herself then let her take over for Perry.

I would never vote for Kay in the primary. I would vote for her if she won the ticket.

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post #12 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-15-2010, 11:51 AM
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they need to get off their ass and get the burden of schools off our ass. my bride is a teacher and i can assure you most of you would quit. they got no chrismas bonus this year of any kind. the states mandates summer school but the district may not have the money. the way they get it is to pass a bond or increase property taxes. every lying son of a bitch one of our governors has promised to help education. but all the bastards have done is fuck up the class room , add paper work, and insist on test the teachers think are bullshit. Hutchinson will be a disaster . she's a career politician now and is dumb as a tree stump. she'll accept all the washington hand outs and then we'll have those dumb asses running the state. it's serious wake up time in texas.

i dont remember which one of the governors did it but a teachers salary is frozen at 20 years. wonderful job huh. unless the district gives them a raise they are screwed.

i dont know enough about medina yet but i know enough about the other two

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post #13 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-15-2010, 11:52 AM
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Medina seems to have a decent head on her. Hutchison and Perry are so full of shit that they don't know their left from their right.

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post #14 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-15-2010, 12:06 PM
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perry was so so but now he wants to go to washington . the only way he'll get to do that is to kiss washingtons butt and do it their way. but kay b is already one of them. give me a texan for governor. i dont care if they're dumb as a tree stump as long as they take care of texas first. put the guard on the border . it's what they are for right ?

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post #15 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-15-2010, 02:06 PM
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My vote: Go Medina
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post #16 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-15-2010, 03:31 PM
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My vote: Go Medina
I'm going to have to agree on Medina



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post #17 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-15-2010, 03:41 PM
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I didnt watch the debate but I have been looking at the three and here are my quick thoughts...

Hutchinson has been in washington too long and although she talks a big game, I see her as part of the current problem (ie current govt)

Perry also has some good points but my biggest issue with him are toll roads. I hate toll roads.

Medina has alot of great points and I agree with her views on just about all of it. Her biggest hurdle will be her lack of expirience.

My vote would go to Medina
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post #18 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-15-2010, 03:50 PM
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My vote would go to Medina.


I like what Perry has been talking about, with invoking the 10th amendment. Too bad it's all water cooler chit chat due to the upcoming election. When it comes down to it, he doesn't have the sack to stand up to anyone.

Fuck Kay Bailey Hutchinson. Her voting for the bailout was the nail in her coffin, as far as I'm concerned.
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post #19 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-15-2010, 03:51 PM
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Perry also has some good points but my biggest issue with him are toll roads. I hate toll roads.
Of all the stupid shit Perry has done/said, toll roads are your biggest issue?

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post #20 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-15-2010, 03:54 PM
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Of all the stupid shit Perry has done/said, toll roads are your biggest issue?
I can't speak for him, but I can speak for me - Toll roads aren't my biggest issue, but it's right up there with the rest.
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post #21 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-15-2010, 04:02 PM
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I can't speak for him, but I can speak for me - Toll roads aren't my biggest issue, but it's right up there with the rest.
Yep, pretty much my thought too. Toll roads arent the biggest issue but its the tip of the iceberg with him. IMO, toll roads are a crutch for improper use of state funds. We already pay for roads with other taxes yet we still have to pay tolls? It just kind of snowballs from there with me.
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post #22 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-15-2010, 04:03 PM
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Medina will get my vote, but Perry will win it, hands down. The perception is that he has done a good job for Texas, and overall, I can't dispute it. No state income tax, 8% unemployment, and invoking the 10th amendment, don't hurt his odds. Medina reminds me of what folks were saying about Palin...she's not quite ready.

Kay Bailey looked like she farted at the dinner table...uncomfortable to say the least. She does a lot more good right where she is.

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post #23 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-15-2010, 04:07 PM
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I can't speak for him, but I can speak for me - Toll roads aren't my biggest issue, but it's right up there with the rest.
The biggest issue tends to be whatever affects a person the most. So yes, I can see it being toll roads.

Our choices fucking suck:

Hutchinson is a career Washington politician, a liar and a fucking snake. I wouldn't let her run a god damn taco stand. She is part of the problem in this country.

Perry is a gutless turd who will say anything. He needs to close the god damn border and fix the road situation and he has my vote. Only because he sucks less than the other two.

Medina....who is this asshole? Fucking waste of time!
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post #24 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-15-2010, 04:22 PM Thread Starter
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I really didnt care for Medina until last night, but she whipped both their asses, and she had some good ideas.

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post #25 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-15-2010, 04:25 PM
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I really didnt care for Medina until last night, but she whipped both their asses, and she had some good ideas.
I'm shocked we agree, but I feel the same. She would be best for Texas, but she's just not well known enough yet to make a big splash.

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post #26 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-15-2010, 05:01 PM
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She'd be great for Texas. No property taxes, no regulation of firearms, personal responsibility and freedom...

I youtube'd the videos from last night
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post #27 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-15-2010, 05:23 PM
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She'd be great for Texas. No property taxes, no regulation of firearms, personal responsibility and freedom...

I youtube'd the videos from last night

That did it for me! I will be voting for her.

And for those that would say they like her, but it would be wasting my vote.
Well if you agree with what she promotes, and you don't vote for her. YOU WASTED YOUR VOTE.



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post #28 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-15-2010, 05:42 PM
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They asked her straight out "So you don't favor ANY laws against firearms?"

Her answer? "It's up to the people, not the federal government. The power belongs to the people of the State of Texas."
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post #29 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-15-2010, 05:51 PM
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This Medina lady was just blowing smoke up asses.

No regulation of firearms? Think of how popular the idea of restricting access to felons is. That is very popular. You mean to tell me she is against that? Absurd!

As for no property taxes...great idea until you realize that is where schools get a lot their money. What? Are we going to just not pay for schools? You going to tax cigarettes at $5 a pack? That money has to come from somewhere, what else are they going to tax? Guess what guys, you want it to come out of the taxes on your home because it is a write off to you. You are saving 15-40% by writing it off.

Some of you guys really need to stop and think about the lies.
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post #30 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-15-2010, 06:05 PM
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This Medina lady was just blowing smoke up asses.

No regulation of firearms? Think of how popular the idea of restricting access to felons is. That is very popular. You mean to tell me she is against that? Absurd!

As for no property taxes...great idea until you realize that is where schools get a lot their money. What? Are we going to just not pay for schools? You going to tax cigarettes at $5 a pack? That money has to come from somewhere, what else are they going to tax? Guess what guys, you want it to come out of the taxes on your home because it is a write off to you. You are saving 15-40% by writing it off.

Some of you guys really need to stop and think about the lies.

As far as the firearms, Im sure everyone will agree felons dont need firearms. I know its an assumption but I dont think she meant "no gun laws at all". Federal firearm laws would still be there.

As far as the property tax thing, think about it. Why not raise the state tax another fraction (?) of a percent so instead of just homeowners taking the hit on supporting schools and everything else that money is supposed to be used for, everyone across the board will pay for it with state taxes on goods. I dont have any numbers to support that but it sounds feasible to me. And those taxes are also allowed to be written off arent they?
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post #31 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-15-2010, 06:05 PM
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Actually, she said it'd be paid for by sales tax. Personally? I don't care if that part passes, I'm already property tax exempt. But firearms? I want my constitutionally protected rights
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post #32 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-15-2010, 06:24 PM
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As far as the firearms, Im sure everyone will agree felons dont need firearms.

Don't be so sure about that. There is a very large crowd that agrees with the 2A.
2A does not limit any one. And I happen to agree with it.



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post #33 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-15-2010, 06:32 PM
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I didn't get to catch it. Does anyone know if there is a video of it on the net?

So far I'm liking what I've been hearing about Medina.

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post #34 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-15-2010, 06:46 PM
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post #35 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-15-2010, 07:05 PM
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Medina has gone on the record stating "The 2nd amendment protects us against a tyrranous government. We should have arms that would repel such a force and citizens should be as well armed as the military." I agree with that whole heartedly.
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post #36 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-15-2010, 07:49 PM
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Medina has gone on the record stating "The 2nd amendment protects us against a tyrranous government. We should have arms that would repel such a force and citizens should be as well armed as the military." I agree with that whole heartedly.
Does she own guns? I know Perry does. She can talk all she wants, but if she ain't practicing shooting or down at the range, it's just talk.
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post #37 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-15-2010, 07:54 PM
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Does she own guns? I know Perry does. She can talk all she wants, but if she ain't practicing shooting or down at the range, it's just talk.
She carries one in her vehicle at all times, and has never had a CHL.

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post #38 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-15-2010, 08:10 PM
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Thanks!

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(thats right, in a fucking duel with guns, Jackson allowed his oppenent to fucking shoot at him before shooting back). Now we have Obama, who is a little bitch. God damn the presidency of the US is just not the same as it used to be.
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post #39 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-15-2010, 08:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Lason View Post
As far as the property tax thing, think about it. Why not raise the state tax another fraction (?) of a percent so instead of just homeowners taking the hit on supporting schools and everything else that money is supposed to be used for, everyone across the board will pay for it with state taxes on goods. I dont have any numbers to support that but it sounds feasible to me. And those taxes are also allowed to be written off arent they?
Do you realize how much money you are talking about? Your average office building with 10 stories will pay over $200,000 a year to the local school district. The budget for DISD alone is over a billion dollars a year last time I checked. You would be talking about an increase of a couple of percentage points. The problem with that is it would disadvantage any business selling anything in this state. Everything from cars to pencils. If someone was buying a $2000 TV they would drive to Oklahoma to do it rather than do it here because the savings would be significant if our taxes were a few points higher.
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post #40 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-15-2010, 09:16 PM
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Actually, she said it'd be paid for by sales tax. Personally? I don't care if that part passes, I'm already property tax exempt. But firearms? I want my constitutionally protected rights
But, how high would she have to raise the state portion of the sales tax to pay for the programs that are already running?

Rates are as follows:
State - 6.25%
City - 1/4% - 2%
County - 1/2% - 1.5%
Transit - 1/4% - 1%
Special Purpose Districts - 1/8% - 2%

http://www.window.state.tx.us/taxinfo/sales/

We all know that the basic rate around the state is 8.25%. Some areas may be higher, some lower, based on the other factors. In order to fund the existing state programs, the sales tax will have to be raised. Also take into consideration the county, city and school taxes that are part of your property taxes. The money has to come from somewhere to fund these as well. Will the city and county sales tax rates climb because of that, too?

I like just about everything that Debra Medina said. The elimination of property taxes just doesn't make logical sense to me right now. If she could provide an answer to my funding question that makes fiscal and logical sense, I could see myself voting for her. I don't believe that raising the sales tax to 20% is the right answer.

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post #41 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-16-2010, 06:39 AM
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a state income tax sounds shitty until you retire and are stuck paying out the ass just to live in your paid for home. our property taxes have got to go. it is a stupid way to fund anything. i'd rather see higher sales tax and even a state income tax. some of you guys are paying close to 3 grand a year in property tax. dont sound like much until you figure it's 250 a month. most of the people i know who live in states that use income tax instead would much rather do it their way than ours. why do you think they keep jacking up our appraisals ? so they can surpass the 10% cap. my land has gone from 60k to over 250k in only 12 years . nice if you want to sell but i aint going anywhere.

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post #42 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-16-2010, 02:02 PM
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I didn't see the debate since I was out of state, so I can't comment on the debate itself.

Perry is governor good hair. He's a slick talking guy who has his eyes on bigger things (presidency). He is not above taking a quick solution (toll roads), especially if there is something in it for him (kick backs). The way he went aggressively after toll roads tells me that he does not have the best interest of texans in mind. And NOW, with the election looming, you start to see promises of action on various topics. Why hasn't he been working on that all along? It's because he knows he is running against someone that is gonna be a bit tough to beat, and he needs to promise action on things that are important to texans.

Hutchinson - might have done some good things for texans but I can't think of anything that really stands out. She has been in DC long enough that she has been indoctrinated into that cesspool, and like someone else said she would probably be beholden to DC beliefs and ways, even as governor of texas.

Mediana? Most everyone is impressed with her, but she also lacks experience. She reminds me of palin, with a lot more intelligence. After all, she was prepared for the debate and apparently avoided saying dumbass things.

So there are there choices - a self absorbed liar, a career DC politician, or a newb.

I think out of the 3 i'd probably vote for the newb. I doubt she has a chance in hell of winning the election (perry will probably take it again).
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post #43 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-16-2010, 02:36 PM
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Perry came off as a smug, arrogant, typical politician... I think it's time for him to go. Medina has some decent ideas, but not much of a chance to be taken seriously... Not sure about KBH... she should probably stay in the Senate.

Not sure the democratic side might not have something better to offer this time.

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post #44 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-16-2010, 02:55 PM
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Originally Posted by mardyn View Post
Perry came off as a smug, arrogant, typical politician... I think it's time for him to go. Medina has some decent ideas, but not much of a chance to be taken seriously... Not sure about KBH... she should probably stay in the Senate.

Not sure the democratic side might not have something better to offer this time.

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Ummm...no.

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post #45 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-17-2010, 11:20 AM
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Okay, after watching that, I'm going to have to say my vote will go to Medina.

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(thats right, in a fucking duel with guns, Jackson allowed his oppenent to fucking shoot at him before shooting back). Now we have Obama, who is a little bitch. God damn the presidency of the US is just not the same as it used to be.
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post #46 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-17-2010, 02:26 PM
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Fuck Kay Bailey. I'll never vote for her ever. Gov. Perry on the other hand, helped a co-worker of mine get in the reserves. He had a felony conviction as a minor, but was tried as an adult. Perry's word got him in, and he's a different person now.

Give me a dollar.
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