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post #1 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-07-2009, 07:34 PM Thread Starter
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Rewriting Miranda

Famous Miranda rights warning could get rewrite
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U.S. court to hear religious group barring gays case Reuters – The U.S. Supreme Court building seen in Washington in this May 20, 2009 file photo. The top court said …

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By JESSE J. HOLLAND, Associated Press Writer Jesse J. Holland, Associated Press Writer – 2 hrs 31 mins ago

WASHINGTON – The Supreme Court on Monday seemed headed toward telling police they must explicitly advise criminal suspects that their lawyer can be present during any interrogation.

The arguments in front of the justices were the latest over how explicit the Miranda warning rights have to be, as justices debated whether the warnings police gave Kevin Dwayne Powell made clear to him that he could have a lawyer present while being interrogated by police.

Powell was convicted of illegally possessing a firearm after telling police he bought the weapon "off the street" for $150 for his protection. Before his confession, Powell signed a Miranda statement that included the statements "You have the right to talk to a lawyer before answering any of our questions. If you cannot afford to hire a lawyer, one will be appointed for you without cost and before any questioning. You have the right to use any of these rights at any time you want during this interview."

The Florida Supreme Court overturned the conviction on grounds the Tampa police didn't adequately convey to Powell that he was allowed to have a lawyer with him during questioning.

Joseph W. Jacquot, Florida deputy attorney general, argued that the warning given Powell "expresses all the rights required under Miranda."

Justice Stephen Breyer clearly disagreed.

"Aren't you supposed to tell this person, that unlike a grand jury, you have a right to have the lawyer with you during interrogation?" Breyer said. "I mean, it isn't as if that was said in passing in Miranda. They wrote eight paragraphs about it. And I just wonder, where does it say in this warning, you have the right to have the lawyer with you during the interrogation?"

Different courts have came down on different sides on what exactly should be said, Justice Sonia Sotomayor said.

"We've got a split of circuit courts and state courts on whether this reasonably conveys or not. Shouldn't that be enough of an ambiguity for us to conclude it can't reasonably convey, if there's this many courts holding that it doesn't?" Justice Sonia Sotomayor said.

Powell's lawyer, Deborah K. Brueckheimer, said that the warning Powell was given from Tampa, Fla., police gave him the impression that "once questioning starts, that he has no right to consult with a lawyer anymore, and it certainly doesn't tell him that he has the right to the presence of an attorney with him in an interrogation room, where the coercion takes on a highly new meaning."

Justice Scalia called Brueckheimer's argument "angels dancing on the head of a pin."

"You are saying, 'Oh, if he had only known. Oh, if I knew that I could have an attorney present during the interview, well, that would have been a different kettle of fish and I would never have confessed,'" Scalia said. "I mean, doesn't that seem to you quite fantastic?"

Miranda rights have been litigated since they first came into being in 1966. The courts require police to tell suspects they have the right to remain silent and the right to have a lawyer represent them, even if they can't afford one. But those requirements likely will continue to be parsed by lawyers and judges.

For example, Justice Samuel Alito pointed out that most police start off Miranda rights by saying "You have the right to remain silent." But, Alito said, what happens if someone begins talking to the police and then decides that they want to be silent?

"Once you break your silence, there is nothing in there that says you have the right to resume your silence," Alito said.

"We could write that down. It could be the next case," Justice Anthony Kennedy said to laughter.

This is the third Miranda case the court has heard this year. The justices heard arguments earlier over whether officers can interrogate a suspect who said he understood his rights but didn't invoke them, and whether a request for a lawyer during interrogation can expire after a lengthy period of time.

Decisions in all three cases are expected next year.

The case argued Monday is Florida v. Powell, 08-1175.
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post #2 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-07-2009, 07:39 PM
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The Miranda we read has pretty clear instructions and syas that "You have the right to have a lawyer present before and during any questioning". I wonder why Florida has theirs somewhat vague.

I have a feeling this will only affect a few states/jursidictions that have vague Miranda warnings. I don't understand why you would do that since most of the suspects who are willing to talk don't care what the warning says and those who won't talk don't care either.

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post #3 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-07-2009, 07:41 PM
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The Mirnada we read has pretty clear instructions and syas that "You have the right to have a lawyer present before and during any questioning". I wonder why Florida has theirs somewhat vagur.
Don, based on the way you're typing tonight I'm gonna have to ask you to follow this pen with your eyes...
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post #4 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-07-2009, 07:44 PM
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Don, based on the way you're typing tonight I'm gonna have to ask you to follow this pen with your eyes...
I posted without editing it properly. I am a terrible typer.

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post #5 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-07-2009, 08:19 PM
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The Miranda we read has pretty clear instructions and syas that "You have the right to have a lawyer present before and during any questioning". I wonder why Florida has theirs somewhat vague.

I have a feeling this will only affect a few states/jursidictions that have vague Miranda warnings. I don't understand why you would do that since most of the suspects who are willing to talk don't care what the warning says and those who won't talk don't care either.
Honestly a lot of people just don't know that you don't have to talk to the police and it's largely because of officers that abuse their power and put civilians in corners that they think they can't get out of.

I don't doubt at all that your department sees very little of this kind of action from its officers, but it's rampant in smaller municipalities. Here are some one-liners that the Coppell Police Department needs to get trademarked:

"Help me help you."
"I'm not here to ruin your day."
"The more you tell me now the less problems we'll have later."
and my personal favorite "Come on man, talk to me. Let's work this out."

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post #6 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-07-2009, 08:29 PM
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Honestly a lot of people just don't know that you don't have to talk to the police and it's largely because of officers that abuse their power and put civilians in corners that they think they can't get out of.

I don't doubt at all that your department sees very little of this kind of action from its officers, but it's rampant in smaller municipalities. Here are some one-liners that the Coppell Police Department needs to get trademarked:

"Help me help you."
"I'm not here to ruin your day."
"The more you tell me now the less problems we'll have later."
and my personal favorite "Come on man, talk to me. Let's work this out."
Sorry, but those are all legitimate sayings that would get a guilty person to confess their involvement in a crime and would not get a false confession from an innocent person. I guess if you are looking at it from a criminals standpoint you might not like it, but if you or your family was the victim and the police did not do everything they could legally to get a confession from the criminal you would be pissed.

I have said those things many times.

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post #7 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-07-2009, 08:41 PM
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"Help me help you." = Help us dig your grave
"I'm not here to ruin your day." = We're here to ruin your life
"The more you tell me now the less problems we'll have later."= admit you're guilty so we can put you in jail and I can go home.
and my personal favorite "Come on man, talk to me. Let's work this out." =We don't have any evidence against you, could you help us convict yourself.

There's only 4 words you should ever say if you get read Miranda rights. I WANT MY LAWYER, followed by a long silence until your lawyer arrives.

Our government needs our help, they have an addiction. Our government is addicted to our money. Since they always have our best interest at heart it's time we return the favor. We need to have an intervention, for the governments own good of course. It's just irresponsible for us to let people with a known money addiction continue to handle our money. Lets have an intervention now so we can help these sick individuals.
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post #8 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-07-2009, 08:58 PM
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Sorry, but those are all legitimate sayings that would get a guilty person to confess their involvement in a crime and would not get a false confession from an innocent person. I guess if you are looking at it from a criminals standpoint you might not like it, but if you or your family was the victim and the police did not do everything they could legally to get a confession from the criminal you would be pissed.

I have said those things many times.
I see your point, but they're outright lies and that just doesn't sit well with me.

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"Help me help you." = Help us dig your grave
"I'm not here to ruin your day." = We're here to ruin your life
"The more you tell me now the less problems we'll have later."= admit you're guilty so we can put you in jail and I can go home.
and my personal favorite "Come on man, talk to me. Let's work this out." =We don't have any evidence against you, could you help us convict yourself.

There's only 4 words you should ever say if you get read Miranda rights. I WANT MY LAWYER, followed by a long silence until your lawyer arrives.
I'm not sure I'd go to that extent. Cops have a job to do and that's to enforce the law; my problem with them saying those things is that it's complete bullshit.

No cop wants to help you. He wants to enforce the law.

They don't exist to ruin your day, but that also implies that he feels some sympathy for you, which he doesn't.

You're spot on with the 3rd one.

And you're spot on with the 4th one.

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post #9 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-07-2009, 08:59 PM
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Originally Posted by MR TINFOIL HAT View Post
"Help me help you." = Help us dig your grave
"I'm not here to ruin your day." = We're here to ruin your life
"The more you tell me now the less problems we'll have later."= admit you're guilty so we can put you in jail and I can go home.
and my personal favorite "Come on man, talk to me. Let's work this out." =We don't have any evidence against you, could you help us convict yourself.

There's only 4 words you should ever say if you get read Miranda rights. I WANT MY LAWYER, followed by a long silence until your lawyer arrives.
There are alot more. I am curious, but why and what circumstances have you guys heard these sayings? I mean, they usually don't get used except on people who have committed (or are alleged to have committed) serious crimes.

< --- was a Sex Crimes detective and used them and others alot.

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post #10 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-07-2009, 09:11 PM
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There are alot more. I am curious, but why and what circumstances have you guys heard these sayings? I mean, they usually don't get used except on people who have committed (or are alleged to have committed) serious crimes.

< --- was a Sex Crimes detective and used them and others alot.
First 48 You guys give away all your secrets with these shows. The true ignorance of criminals usually comes shinning through anyways though, and they usually end up singing like canaries.

Our government needs our help, they have an addiction. Our government is addicted to our money. Since they always have our best interest at heart it's time we return the favor. We need to have an intervention, for the governments own good of course. It's just irresponsible for us to let people with a known money addiction continue to handle our money. Lets have an intervention now so we can help these sick individuals.
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post #11 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-07-2009, 09:22 PM
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There are alot more. I am curious, but why and what circumstances have you guys heard these sayings? I mean, they usually don't get used except on people who have committed (or are alleged to have committed) serious crimes.

< --- was a Sex Crimes detective and used them and others alot.
Is suspected possession of misdemeanor quantities of marijuana that, after a thorough search that should have been denied on principle alone, were found to be completely imaginary reason enough to use questions like this?

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post #12 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-07-2009, 09:28 PM
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post #13 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-07-2009, 09:45 PM
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I see your point, but they're outright lies and that just doesn't sit well with me.



I'm not sure I'd go to that extent. Cops have a job to do and that's to enforce the law; my problem with them saying those things is that it's complete bullshit.

No cop wants to help you. He wants to enforce the law.

They don't exist to ruin your day, but that also implies that he feels some sympathy for you, which he doesn't.

You're spot on with the 3rd one.

And you're spot on with the 4th one.
Anyone who thinks the police can't lie to you is naive. The lie has 1 standard that it must meet: It cannot induce an innocent person to confess to a crime they did not commit.

The clasic lie that is not allowed is saying "If you will just tell me you did it you can go home."

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post #14 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-07-2009, 10:04 PM
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First 48 You guys give away all your secrets with these shows. The true ignorance of criminals usually comes shinning through anyways though, and they usually end up singing like canaries.
Yeah it is no big secret really.

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Is suspected possession of misdemeanor quantities of marijuana that, after a thorough search that should have been denied on principle alone, were found to be completely imaginary reason enough to use questions like this?
What department went all out for a freaking marijuana charge? If they have more than 100 people in that department they really need to find something else to do. LMAO

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post #15 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-07-2009, 10:10 PM
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I don't have 27 minutes. Summary please.

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post #16 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-07-2009, 10:21 PM
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Yeah it is no big secret really.



What department went all out for a freaking marijuana charge? If they have more than 100 people in that department they really need to find something else to do. LMAO
I'll take a wild guess, Plano Police? I've had an un-pleasant encounter where my car according to them "smelled like marijuana" and bam they were ripping my car apart. Granted it was 1 a.m. and I was white on a Friday night, but last time I checked it wasn't illegal to drive at that hour being Caucasian. When they found nothing I never even got a "we're sorry" or even a "good bye", they just rolled out after leaving my car and personal belongings scattered everywhere. I know there's good and bad Leo's, but Plano seems to have the monopoly on the bad Leo's.

Our government needs our help, they have an addiction. Our government is addicted to our money. Since they always have our best interest at heart it's time we return the favor. We need to have an intervention, for the governments own good of course. It's just irresponsible for us to let people with a known money addiction continue to handle our money. Lets have an intervention now so we can help these sick individuals.
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post #17 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-07-2009, 10:24 PM Thread Starter
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There needs to be a recourse for citizens who have their cars ripped apart and nothing found. Like fining the officers and giving the money to the citizens.
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post #18 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-07-2009, 10:25 PM
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I don't have 27 minutes. Summary please.
You should spend 27 minutes on this one because he covers the "if you have nothing to hide" subject. It's one of the best and most informative posts in this forum. Excellent post Fox!

Our government needs our help, they have an addiction. Our government is addicted to our money. Since they always have our best interest at heart it's time we return the favor. We need to have an intervention, for the governments own good of course. It's just irresponsible for us to let people with a known money addiction continue to handle our money. Lets have an intervention now so we can help these sick individuals.
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post #19 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-07-2009, 10:25 PM
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What department went all out for a freaking marijuana charge? If they have more than 100 people in that department they really need to find something else to do. LMAO
Coppell. This was before I had even begun to think about smoking pot and I was really caught off guard by it. Come to think of it I'm pretty sure that event is at least 50% responsible for me smoking pot now.

I wouldn't put that kind of shit past State Troopers either. They're probing little fucks.

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post #20 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-07-2009, 10:27 PM
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A+ post, would watch again and again and again and again and again. And again.

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post #21 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-07-2009, 10:38 PM
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Coppell. This was before I had even begun to think about smoking pot and I was really caught off guard by it. Come to think of it I'm pretty sure that event is at least 50% responsible for me smoking pot now.

I wouldn't put that kind of shit past State Troopers either. They're probing little fucks.
The Texas State troopers I've come across were courteous in my two encounters, and both times I was let go with a warning.

Our government needs our help, they have an addiction. Our government is addicted to our money. Since they always have our best interest at heart it's time we return the favor. We need to have an intervention, for the governments own good of course. It's just irresponsible for us to let people with a known money addiction continue to handle our money. Lets have an intervention now so we can help these sick individuals.
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post #22 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-07-2009, 10:43 PM
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You should spend 27 minutes on this one because he covers the "if you have nothing to hide" subject. It's one of the best and most informative posts in this forum. Excellent post Fox!
I have seen lots of "don't ever talk to the police" videos and was wondering if that is what he said.

If he is saying that, I will just laugh at him. He is either a liberal professor of law or a defense attorney. If you are guilty you should probably not talk to the police, but if innocent you probably should.

I have gone over this many times.

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post #23 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-07-2009, 10:50 PM
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I have seen lots of "don't ever talk to the police" videos and was wondering if that is what he said.

If he is saying that, I will just laugh at him. He is either a liberal professor of law or a defense attorney. If you are guilty you should probably not talk to the police, but if innocent you probably should.

I have gone over this many times.
Yes you're correct he was a defense Attorney. He brings up very good reasons even if you have nothing to hide and are innocent not to talk to the police. I've watched several of the "don't talk to police" vids also that were a waste of time, but this one is worth the time.

Our government needs our help, they have an addiction. Our government is addicted to our money. Since they always have our best interest at heart it's time we return the favor. We need to have an intervention, for the governments own good of course. It's just irresponsible for us to let people with a known money addiction continue to handle our money. Lets have an intervention now so we can help these sick individuals.
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post #24 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-07-2009, 10:51 PM
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Coppell. This was before I had even begun to think about smoking pot and I was really caught off guard by it. Come to think of it I'm pretty sure that event is at least 50% responsible for me smoking pot now.

I wouldn't put that kind of shit past State Troopers either. They're probing little fucks.
They used those lines on a traffic stop and only had the smell of marijuana? Damn, that is hardcore!

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post #25 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-07-2009, 10:53 PM
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Yes you're correct he was a defense Attorney. He brings up very good reasons even if you have nothing to hide and are innocent not to talk to the police. I've watched several of the "don't talk to police" vids also that were a waste of time, but this one is worth the time.
Yep, if people talked to the police, especially innocent ones, he would not have all of his expensive cars, boats, and vacation houses. I bet he wants everyone to get an attorney! LMAO!

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post #26 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-07-2009, 10:58 PM
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Yep, if people talked to the police, especially innocent ones, he would not have all of his expensive cars, boats, and vacation houses. I bet he wants everyone to get an attorney! LMAO!
I think you have a conflict of interest on this subject, just saying.

Our government needs our help, they have an addiction. Our government is addicted to our money. Since they always have our best interest at heart it's time we return the favor. We need to have an intervention, for the governments own good of course. It's just irresponsible for us to let people with a known money addiction continue to handle our money. Lets have an intervention now so we can help these sick individuals.
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post #27 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-07-2009, 11:09 PM
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They used those lines on a traffic stop and only had the smell of marijuana? Damn, that is hardcore!
I thought it was a bit absurd and there was no way in hell at that point in my life that my car even thought about smelling like pot. I've got numerous stories of Coppell Police abusing their power that I could tell but I don't really believe that their actions accurately reflect upon on all police.

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post #28 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-08-2009, 03:57 PM
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Originally Posted by MR TINFOIL HAT View Post
I think you have a conflict of interest on this subject, just saying.
I get paid whether or not a person gets charged. I only care about justice for the victim and the criminal. What is your interest in this, it sure isn't the victims of criminals, now is it?

I sure hope no one that commits a crime against you, especially a violent crime, takes your advice and does not talk to the police.

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post #29 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-08-2009, 03:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Slowhand View Post
I thought it was a bit absurd and there was no way in hell at that point in my life that my car even thought about smelling like pot. I've got numerous stories of Coppell Police abusing their power that I could tell but I don't really believe that their actions accurately reflect upon on all police.
I know that stuff happens, but it is foreign to everything I have seen or allowed to happen around me.

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If you like the IRS, DMV and the Post Office, you will love Obamacare!

“An armed society is a polite society. Manners are good when one may have to back up his acts with his life.”
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I have to agree with a quote from former Treasury Secretary William E. Simon: "Bad politicians are sent to Washington by good people who don't vote."
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post #30 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-08-2009, 04:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Paladin View Post
I sure hope no one that commits a crime against you, especially a violent crime, takes your advice and does not talk to the police.
I hope that no innocent person that talks to the police says the wrong thing and costs themselves thousands of dollars, a job, their spouse or whatever else. Yet, unless you think that humans can be infallible in their judgement, that happens all the time.
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post #31 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-08-2009, 04:35 PM
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I hope that no innocent person that talks to the police says the wrong thing and costs themselves thousands of dollars, a job, their spouse or whatever else. Yet, unless you think that humans can be infallible in their judgement, that happens all the time.
Yep, but it still doesn't discount my point. I have personally seen more innocent people cleared by coming in than innocent people coming in and getting framed. I have also seen many innocent people go to jail when they could have come in and cleared up the case by giving an alibi, answering a few questions and giving us the evidence to prove the victim was lying.

I have also seen alot of guilty people NOT go to jail because there was not enough evidence to prove the case and they refused to speak with LE. It cuts both ways, that is my point.

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If you like the IRS, DMV and the Post Office, you will love Obamacare!

“An armed society is a polite society. Manners are good when one may have to back up his acts with his life.”
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post #32 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-08-2009, 04:49 PM
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Originally Posted by Paladin View Post
Yep, but it still doesn't discount my point. I have personally seen more innocent people cleared by coming in than innocent people coming in and getting framed. I have also seen many innocent people go to jail when they could have come in and cleared up the case by giving an alibi, answering a few questions and giving us the evidence to prove the victim was lying.

I have also seen alot of guilty people NOT go to jail because there was not enough evidence to prove the case and they refused to speak with LE. It cuts both ways, that is my point.
Good point but at the end of the day you are relying on your own judgement about who is innocent and who is guilty. Do you think your record is 100%? Fact is, some of those people you thought were innocent were actually guilty and some of the ones who were guilty were actually innocent. I think I'd let an attorney decide what questions, if any, should be answered.

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post #33 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-08-2009, 05:13 PM
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looking at the 5th amendment, why even allow an investigator to talk to a suspect with out a lawyer? the case law is full of instances where judges have thrown out this kind of testimony. and its the first move any court appointed attorney is going to bring up in a pretrial hearing. it ends up costing the court time and money.

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post #34 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-08-2009, 05:29 PM
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Results 1-10 of approximately 137,000 hits on wrongfully convicted and released. The first one is a guy who lost 20 years of his life for talking to the police when he was innocent of murder. The second lost 14 years. The third 15 years.


Not by any means attacking you guys, just saying you aren't always our friends...
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post #35 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-08-2009, 05:41 PM
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Not by any means attacking you guys, just saying you aren't always our friends...
I've come to the conclusion that a cop in uniform is never my friend/on my side. They are doing a job which generally benefits me, but I'm not going to think they are going to cut me a break over a repeat offender/regular scumbag.

If I f'up and get arrested, I will wait on a lawyer.

I have nothing against cops per se, but I'm going to be about as friendly to them as they've been to my friends and I. All are cool out of uniform so far though, the few I know. I just realize that cops have a job to do and/or are dickheads and are probably not interested in a thing I have to say, unless it'll screw it in deeper. Or it's just black and white, that's it.

Take care

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post #36 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-08-2009, 05:54 PM
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Originally Posted by AL P View Post
Good point but at the end of the day you are relying on your own judgement about who is innocent and who is guilty. Do you think your record is 100%? Fact is, some of those people you thought were innocent were actually guilty and some of the ones who were guilty were actually innocent. I think I'd let an attorney decide what questions, if any, should be answered.
I don't decide who is innocent or guilty and I don't decide who is prosecuted. I collect evidence, facts, and everything possibly related to the case and present it to the DA.

BTW, it is my opinion that if a police officer or prosecutor deliberately withholds evidence and a person is wrongly convicted becuase of that, they should be arrested and charged with a crime.

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If you like the IRS, DMV and the Post Office, you will love Obamacare!

“An armed society is a polite society. Manners are good when one may have to back up his acts with his life.”
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post #37 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-08-2009, 06:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fox466 View Post
Results 1-10 of approximately 137,000 hits on wrongfully convicted and released. The first one is a guy who lost 20 years of his life for talking to the police when he was innocent of murder. The second lost 14 years. The third 15 years.


Not by any means attacking you guys, just saying you aren't always our friends...
I never said people aren't wrongfully convicted. I doubt the majority of those cases is becuase someone wnet into the police. I bet it is because of police or DA misconduct. I would have no problem putting detectives/police who deliberately withhold evidence or DA's who do the same being charged with a crime.

If you only concentrate on the wrongfully convicted, you don't see the whole picture.

What would you do if the police had to let a guilty person go who had committed a crime against your family because they listened to advice like this and didn't talk to the police?

One
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America

If you like the IRS, DMV and the Post Office, you will love Obamacare!

“An armed society is a polite society. Manners are good when one may have to back up his acts with his life.”
Robert A. Heinlein

I have to agree with a quote from former Treasury Secretary William E. Simon: "Bad politicians are sent to Washington by good people who don't vote."
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post #38 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-08-2009, 06:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ceyko View Post
I've come to the conclusion that a cop in uniform is never my friend/on my side. They are doing a job which generally benefits me, but I'm not going to think they are going to cut me a break over a repeat offender/regular scumbag.

If I f'up and get arrested, I will wait on a lawyer.

I have nothing against cops per se, but I'm going to be about as friendly to them as they've been to my friends and I. All are cool out of uniform so far though, the few I know. I just realize that cops have a job to do and/or are dickheads and are probably not interested in a thing I have to say, unless it'll screw it in deeper. Or it's just black and white, that's it.

Take care
There are probably numerous people who feel the same way about me from confronatatipons while I was in uniform and I would say they started it and got what they deserved. Without video evidence it is hard to say who started it, but I would hold my long history of confrontations being handled professionally and without complaint as proof that I don't start the trouble, I just deal with it.

I just think too many people think the police have to put up with attitude, and that just isn't the case.

One
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America

If you like the IRS, DMV and the Post Office, you will love Obamacare!

“An armed society is a polite society. Manners are good when one may have to back up his acts with his life.”
Robert A. Heinlein

I have to agree with a quote from former Treasury Secretary William E. Simon: "Bad politicians are sent to Washington by good people who don't vote."
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post #39 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-08-2009, 06:46 PM
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What would you do if the police had to let a guilty person go who had committed a crime against your family because they listened to advice like this and didn't talk to the police?

Smile, say thank you and forget we ever had this conversation, then go about finding a nice secluded place way the hell out in the middle of nowhere in which I could handle my business...
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post #40 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-08-2009, 06:51 PM
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Smile, say thank you and forget we ever had this conversation, then go about finding a nice secluded place way the hell out in the middle of nowhere in which I could handle my business...
I am witcha brotha!

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America

If you like the IRS, DMV and the Post Office, you will love Obamacare!

“An armed society is a polite society. Manners are good when one may have to back up his acts with his life.”
Robert A. Heinlein

I have to agree with a quote from former Treasury Secretary William E. Simon: "Bad politicians are sent to Washington by good people who don't vote."
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post #41 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-08-2009, 09:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Paladin View Post
I just think too many people think the police have to put up with attitude, and that just isn't the case.
Yeah, we're all perfect little angels too. Thankfully I don't have a record...etc...etc so never had to deal with the dirty details. Just the traffic cops seem to throw a serious attitude for no good reason - other than hating their jobs or something.

Made it easy to quit donating to police things. I only donated cause at one time I thought all cops make like 25K a year. I found out later I was dead wrong on that and was like "Well, who the hell is going to donate for my family? "

My '03 Sold.
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post #42 of 42 (permalink) Old 12-08-2009, 10:26 PM
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Originally Posted by ceyko View Post
Yeah, we're all perfect little angels too. Thankfully I don't have a record...etc...etc so never had to deal with the dirty details. Just the traffic cops seem to throw a serious attitude for no good reason - other than hating their jobs or something.

Made it easy to quit donating to police things. I only donated cause at one time I thought all cops make like 25K a year. I found out later I was dead wrong on that and was like "Well, who the hell is going to donate for my family? "
There are two reasons why I never became a traffic cop:

1. They always seem to have to write the decent people because they mostly write speeding tickets.

2. People are always pissed of when they get pulled over even if they are guilty.

I hated wriitng tickets to people unless they were a criminal.

One
Big
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America

If you like the IRS, DMV and the Post Office, you will love Obamacare!

“An armed society is a polite society. Manners are good when one may have to back up his acts with his life.”
Robert A. Heinlein

I have to agree with a quote from former Treasury Secretary William E. Simon: "Bad politicians are sent to Washington by good people who don't vote."
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