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post #1 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-04-2009, 09:58 AM Thread Starter
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Outsourcing

Obama to tax business who outsource jobs overseas more.

I had heard that he had planned/wanted to do this during his campaign and really only liked that lone idea he had -- mainly because that really hit home.

What are your thoughts?

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post #2 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-04-2009, 10:00 AM
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Obama to tax business who outsource jobs overseas more.

I had heard that he had planned/wanted to do this during his campaign and really only liked that lone idea he had -- mainly because that really hit home.

What are your thoughts?
Yep. That's what they're going to do to GM, thus making the company pay more taxes. Gotta love how this conflict of interest works, huh?
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post #3 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-04-2009, 10:02 AM
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Yep. That's what they're going to do to GM, thus making the company pay more taxes. Gotta love how this conflict of interest works, huh?
When you're the "king of the free world", why not?

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post #4 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-04-2009, 10:03 AM
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post #5 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-04-2009, 10:04 AM Thread Starter
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Yep. That's what they're going to do to GM, thus making the company pay more taxes. Gotta love how this conflict of interest works, huh?
What, exactly, does GM outsource overseas?

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post #6 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-04-2009, 10:10 AM
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What, exactly, does GM outsource overseas?
Soon to be everything. Why do you think the government wants to run that show. "GM" will no longer be a company, but more like a product line. As of right now, it already has several components imported and some things assembled overseas. It'll eventually be more imported products/labor than domestic.

I wouldn't put it past the govt to set up under the table deals with China to receive money for them to bail these companies out, then for the govt to control their policies and processes, move their work to China and have China make all the real money while we still owe them for the initial bail-out of "our" companies.
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post #7 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-04-2009, 10:12 AM
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What, exactly, does GM outsource overseas?
If I recall correctly, about 30% of the parts in an American built car are of foreign origin. I'd bet this has something to do with using the same platform in several markets rather than any sort of cost savings initiative to save on labor. For example, the Holden platforms from Australia that they are using here in the US. Some of the parts of those cars are going to be foreign.
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post #8 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-04-2009, 10:13 AM
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What, exactly, does GM outsource overseas?
I guess it depends on the definition of outsourcing. If it is manufacturing, then they outsource a shitload of parts and cars. (Chevy Aveo comes to mind).

If we're talking about services, then you're talking about customer service, IT, HR, and other non manufacturing areas. But it isn't that simple. GM outsources ALL of its IT services. It outsources to IBM, HP, and EDS (or HP/EDS if you will). THOSE companies are the ones that outsource to India, not GM. So GM isn't paying any taxes on that, IBM and HP/EDS are. The question is, does their contracts allow them to pass those tax increases to their customer.
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post #9 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-04-2009, 10:14 AM
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What, exactly, does GM outsource overseas?
How about their Opel and Holden subsidiaries? Taken to a point, those could be perceived as outsourced labor, since parent company GM is an American entity.

What about all the parts manufactured in Mexico and Canada to be assembled in the US? That's outsourcing.

Any job performed outside the US that an American company pays for could be construed as outsourcing.


This is one of the few areas where I feel a moderate amount of government oversight is welcome. If we intend to keep a high standard of living in the United States, we have to offer some protection for our jobs.

I also feel there should be slightly more protection for non-professional investors in the stock market.

I don't have the first clue about how I would regulate either. I just see a need for the protection from unscrupulous individuals/companies.
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post #10 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-04-2009, 10:16 AM
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If I recall correctly, about 30% of the parts in an American built car are of foreign origin. I'd bet this has something to do with using the same platform in several markets rather than any sort of cost savings initiative to save on labor. For example, the Holden platforms from Australia that they are using here in the US. Some of the parts of those cars are going to be foreign.
Well, there are only two Holden platforms sold in the US. The Camaro and the G8. The G8 is flat out imported from Austrailia and not built in the US. The Camaro is built in Canada.

The Malibu's epsilonII platform is a better example. It is the basis for several cars around the world including the Opel Insignia, Saturn Aura, the 2010 Buick Lacross, and some others.
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post #11 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-04-2009, 10:18 AM Thread Starter
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How about their Opel and Holden subsidiaries? Taken to a point, those could be perceived as outsourced labor, since parent company GM is an American entity.

I don't really consider that to be outsourcing.
Your second point, however, is accurate. I forgot about the poor Mexican border towns where American companies setup shop and pay those poor people horrible wages.

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post #12 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-04-2009, 10:20 AM
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I don't really consider that to be outsourcing.
Well... YOU might not, but that doesn't mean Sam doesn't. It's their definition that matters.
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post #13 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-04-2009, 10:28 AM
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Well, there are only two Holden platforms sold in the US. The Camaro and the G8. The G8 is flat out imported from Austrailia and not built in the US. The Camaro is built in Canada.

The Malibu's epsilonII platform is a better example. It is the basis for several cars around the world including the Opel Insignia, Saturn Aura, the 2010 Buick Lacross, and some others.
And to take the idea even further, that epsilon platform probably gets its brake rotors (or whatever part) from one factory, maybe in Mexico or China or wherever. To a lot of people that is "outsourcing" but to me that is just economies of scale. I mean, it is not like GM should open a factory in Ohio just to make sure we make those parts here.
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post #14 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-04-2009, 11:04 AM
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And to take the idea even further, that epsilon platform probably gets its brake rotors (or whatever part) from one factory, maybe in Mexico or China or wherever. To a lot of people that is "outsourcing" but to me that is just economies of scale. I mean, it is not like GM should open a factory in Ohio just to make sure we make those parts here.
I agree with that. I haven't read about what will be/is proposed to be taxed. Taxing parts/components doesn't make sense at all. You're right, it is economies of scale. Taxing companies who assemble/build outside of our borders because they can get away with low wages, low or no health care, etc. should be taxed. We need to protect manufacturing and our jobs here in the states.

Now if an American company is making brake parts overseas, then they should have to pay the taxes on the outsourced labor. Just my .02.

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post #15 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-04-2009, 12:23 PM
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From an outsourcing IT standpoint, I think that this would be a good move. Time and again it has been shown that large companies outsource to shave costs, and as one go they all go. And they are in front of congress bitching about the "lack of skills" forcing them to look offshore which is complete and utter bullshit. I know of several very good programmers that have been looking for a very long time while I also know of some companies where the existing employees had to train their indian replacements shortly before they got kicked out the door. Putting a tax on this activity would encourage those jobs to come back on shore, and would put a lot of unemployed americans back to work again.
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post #16 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-04-2009, 03:03 PM
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And to take the idea even further, that epsilon platform probably gets its brake rotors (or whatever part) from one factory, maybe in Mexico or China or wherever. To a lot of people that is "outsourcing" but to me that is just economies of scale. I mean, it is not like GM should open a factory in Ohio just to make sure we make those parts here.
very true.

one other point though. I'm pretty damn sure that any tax on that kind of outsourcing to Mexico or Canada is going to violate NAFTA and cause some serious retaliation.
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post #17 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-04-2009, 08:52 PM
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This might be the first step of getting america back to being productive and actually making money by putting americans back to work manufacturing goods that we can sell to the world so we can start paying back that insane debt we have. Makes me fucking sick that this isnt issue number 1 in the country, america being on welfare to china, its a disgrace.

People are so concerned about being attacked, what happens when china just buys the damn country out from under us? I know the american people will tell them to go fuck themselves but they will have a legal right to it and that could lead down a very nasty road indeed.

This has to be reversed at all cost, its more damaging to the country than anything. The american car companies going under should be a wake up call. Everything that is "american" is being destroyed, Levis and Vice Grips arent even made here anymore and its sad. I feel like my country is circling the drain and no one is doing anything to stop it.

Outsourcing is a shit ass concept, sure its great for business profit, but what about all the people that get thrown out on their asses? Job security is a thing of the past it seems. They have outsourced every damn type of job possible with the exception of services, someones gotta work on the shit here.

Ive been saying for years that we have to keep those jobs here. If some company wants to expand to asia, go build a plant over there and employ the people there. That way you can sell the goods you make cheaper there so they can afford it but this taking jobs from america and then wondering why people cant afford their houses and cars is asinine.

Ive always found business tax breaks hillarous. The idea that if they are allowed to keep more of their money in hopes they will create jobs heres, like maybe build a factory here. HAHAH yea right, they are going to go where they can make the most money and it aint here! They will build a new factory alright, in fucking china where they dont have to pay shit for wages or healthcare or any damn thing compared to here. Thats why i say the chinese have a brilllant plan to destroy america, they are appealing to peoples greed and its working.

American companies used to compete on innovations, features, quality and lastly price but it was all relative. Since they were all in the same market their expenses were comparable. Americans would pay alittle more for a product if it was made better or had features they liked. Then china enters and forces everyone to focus on price which they simply cannot do unless they also outsource to china, that or go out of business.

Do you think that if you went to the store and saw a chinese product for only a few dollars less than an american one you would be inclined to purchase it? Fuck no, 99% of americans would buy american made everytime. That option has been removed in almost all cases however, most "american" companies are in name only as they products are all made overseas.

Its def time to reverse this trend even if it means doing shit like this tax stuff to make it happen. They say alot of companies will leave the US, i say fuck'em. They probably didnt give a shit about the country in the first place. Alot of these companies have gotten too big, its time to let the smaller companies move up. I have no doubt that any hole left in the market when a company leaves will be filled by a new one, hopefully a more patriotic one that understands that employing americans means protecting americas furure prosperity.

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post #18 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-04-2009, 09:22 PM
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post #19 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-04-2009, 09:42 PM
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Careful or you'll be accused of being a bleeding heart liberal around here.
Thats funny cause i consider myself a hardcore republican and american. Hell i LOVED what ron paul had to say during the elections and i still like his views on what the country needs to do. I dont see anything wrong with my country going back to taking care of itself and if the people want to hand out ALITTLE money thru charity then its their choice but this ass raping of the US to help the poor pitiful chinese or the arabs...who gives a shit about them?

If the chinese are so unhappy, maybe they should throw that piece of shit communist government out. I dont get how alot of people on here are against obamas idea of "spreading the wealth" to those less fortunate, i am too but then they act like they need to help the iraqis? If the iraqis wanted peace and freedom they would have done it centuries ago. Maybe they need to actually do something about it for themselves but they are too busy killing each other over religon when they both follow the same religion....... yeah......Anyways its kinda like how people supposedly need to get an education to avoid mooching, its double standard thinking i say.

Thats what made america great, we didnt have that kinda stupid bullshit going on here and when we did we fought over it and got it settled. Now we feel like we have some need to walk right into somebody elses shit storm while our home is going down the toliet.

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post #20 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-04-2009, 09:45 PM
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From an outsourcing IT standpoint, I think that this would be a good move. Time and again it has been shown that large companies outsource to shave costs, and as one go they all go. And they are in front of congress bitching about the "lack of skills" forcing them to look offshore which is complete and utter bullshit. I know of several very good programmers that have been looking for a very long time while I also know of some companies where the existing employees had to train their indian replacements shortly before they got kicked out the door. Putting a tax on this activity would encourage those jobs to come back on shore, and would put a lot of unemployed americans back to work again.
Hows the H1B visa make ya feel? Fuckers. (Them not us.)

To the topic, I like the concept...stick it to the fuckers. I just don't see it helping, they'll just pass that cost to us, go tits up or otherwise leave the US and discourage other companies from being US based.

I hate that it happens though.

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post #21 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-04-2009, 09:58 PM
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From an outsourcing IT standpoint, I think that this would be a good move. Time and again it has been shown that large companies outsource to shave costs, and as one go they all go. And they are in front of congress bitching about the "lack of skills" forcing them to look offshore which is complete and utter bullshit. I know of several very good programmers that have been looking for a very long time while I also know of some companies where the existing employees had to train their indian replacements shortly before they got kicked out the door. Putting a tax on this activity would encourage those jobs to come back on shore, and would put a lot of unemployed americans back to work again.
Thats goes with this story. Ive also met people with degrees in IT and the like that cant find work. Theya re told they are "overqualified", its such BS.

http://www.techworld.com.au/article/...ing_us_workers

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post #22 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-04-2009, 10:26 PM
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Slammy, all this is going to do is increase our dependance on China and give the the government more control of our major industries. I don't see how you think this'll be good for America. What needs to happen is for us to let these companies fail, tell China to keep their money, and learn from our past mistake while we create new industrial giants and/or rebuild our old ones.
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post #23 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-04-2009, 10:39 PM
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-Outsourcing is a problem for American workers.
-Obama addresses the issue by trying to tax those who try to be cheap and send the work overseas.
-Bush nuthuggers/Obama haters somehow find a way to declare this a defeat and consider this a tyrannical move to take away our rights.


I can't figure out if it's racism, or just blind republican loyalty. Either way, no matter what he does (case in point), you'll twist it to something bad. Wow.
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post #24 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-04-2009, 10:44 PM
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I can't figure out if it's racism, or just blind republican loyalty. Either way, no matter what he does (case in point), you'll twist it to something bad. Wow.
he being Obama? I suppose you think this is a good idea? I mean, you did not take a side. You only made comments.

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post #25 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-04-2009, 11:07 PM
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Slammy, all this is going to do is increase our dependance on China and give the the government more control of our major industries. I don't see how you think this'll be good for America. What needs to happen is for us to let these companies fail, tell China to keep their money, and learn from our past mistake while we create new industrial giants and/or rebuild our old ones.
You mean let the companies fail that are recieving bailouts and whatnot? I agree that these companies should be allowed to fail, its not the american peoples responsibilty to keep them going, thats the job of their overpaid genuis CEOs.

The problem i see with what youre saying is that it would be a return to business as usual. The rules HAVE to change, and they have to change in americas favor. Businesses arent going to like it, but if allowed, they will sell us out as they have been doing for awhile now. I mean whats to stop the next generation of companies from doing the same thing as the current? Without the government stepping in and changing the rules we can never get the upperhand. The Us government is supposed to protect the american people both militarywise and economywise but they havent done shit to prevent the economic mess the US is in now.

They really need to make it illegal to do business with china but that wont happen since it would def start shit so they have to be subtle about it. China doesnt play the free trade market fairly, if they did you wouldnt have seen all the damn jobs in the world going there. We never had this problem with any other country either. There are numerous reports of their government intentionally keeping their money low in value. The chinese arent going to let go of their bread and butter willingly, we are gonna have to play their game in order to get back on top.

This is also chinas chance to become the most powerful country in the world and i dont expect them to lay down and take it. I just hope we can take back our economy, avoid WW3 and pay those commies back their damn money since america pays its dues. Then we need to tell them to fuck off and eat shit.

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post #26 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-05-2009, 12:01 AM
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They WILL change themselves when big corporations find out that the government won't bail them out. Right now in our Capatalistic Society., businesses can take risks and if it turns out good, they make money; if it turns out bad, the government bails them out. NO accountability. Fuck that! We end up paying for their bad decisions.
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post #27 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-05-2009, 12:19 AM
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They WILL change themselves when big corporations find out that the government won't bail them out. Right now in our Capatalistic Society., businesses can take risks and if it turns out good, they make money; if it turns out bad, the government bails them out. NO accountability. Fuck that! We end up paying for their bad decisions.
I think we are on different subjects denny but they are related. I agree with ya on the bailouts, it was BS when bush started it and what obama is doing is def adding logs to the fire and it needs to be stopped. The only good thing i can see, ill try and be optimistic here, is that maybe we can float some of these american companies till we get the country back on its feet but realistically, it will be decades before this even starts to really show unless they pass some super harsh law against doing business with china which is unrealistic.

All this talk about getting the country back to how it was ASAP and im still asking, what is normal? Back to borrowing money from china to fund bailouts and wars we cant afford? It needs to mean back to making money and paying china back.

The ONLY way thats gonna happen is if we have something the world wants/needs and is willing to pay for. That would be manufactured consumer products. Whoever that thought america could remove itself as the most productive country in the world and remain on top is a jackass. This is how the US became the worlds economic center. Which it has been losing for years and with that goes americas wealth.

I love my old man to death but its hillarous listening to him blame the democrats for everything. I say its the GOVERNMENT dad, not just one party. The republicans havent done shit in decades to stop this, if they did this wouldnt have happened. He acts like the republicans would come riding in on a white horse in shining armor and make everything better with a wave of their hand.

He acts like they havent had chances to make changes, they have and they didnt act.Therefor they are BOTH guilty! The democrats simply make different mistakes than the republicans but none of it is what america needs. Sure it might have been good for american companies but the common american is losing their asses! Its a stupid ass blame game, someone needs to step and handle this shit regardless of party BS.

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post #28 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-05-2009, 12:35 AM
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It's not only the government, but our society's way of life that has this all screwed up. Granted, the government has allowed (if not lead) the people to be in this situation in order for them to become more dependant on the government. Bottom line is, we need failure in order to move on, learn and improve from our failures.

We don't have to have anything the world needs/wants. What about self-sufficiency?
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post #29 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-05-2009, 12:51 AM
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It's not only the government, but our society's way of life that has this all screwed up. Granted, the government has allowed (if not lead) the people to be in this situation in order for them to become more dependant on the government. Bottom line is, we need failure in order to move on, learn and improve from our failures.
Ive heard that side of it before, thats its the peoples fault. I honestly dont buy it as americans are very patriotic and as i said, wouldnt go for a foreign product unless it was either much higher quality than their own or much cheaper. Europe has been able to sell stuff here cause it is usually of high quality. No doubt that a BMW or Mercedes is nicer than a Chevy or Ford for example.

I think the government should have seen what dirt cheap chinese products would do to american companies and the market. They should have seen it stood to run alot of them out of business and put americans out of work which means less taxes being paid. Its a domino effect.

I was thinking about this the other day. Maybe we could coax china into a war with us now and then after we beat them, as punishment we could abolish our debt to them. But then again without the rules being changed here, in another 20 years we would be right back where we are. haha

I just feel like people are so concerned about us being attacked militarly but what about economically? Everyone seems to have their faith in our military but im beginning to think its becoming americas Maginot Line. I dont think any country has the balls to attack the US with us at full strength, But after a few years of being broke and out of money, after cutbacks and whatnot it could be possible. I know if i was a country that wanted to hurt the US, thats what i would do, destroy the backbone and sure it would take awhile but it would be devastating. Even bin laden since he wanted to bankrupt the US, joing the fucking party man!


Ever read the stories about the chinese building a massive fleet of fast attack boats with anti ship missles designed to attack carriers? Makes ya wonder man, why in the hell would they need that if they were our "friends"? Like the japanese leading up to ww2 is what im afraid of. Guess you cant trust any of the slant eyes.

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post #30 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-05-2009, 06:11 AM
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See, you make it sound as if each and every one of us shouldn't hold some burden of responsibility for this. No one forced people to live outside their means. We dictated our own society and now we should take it like grown-ups. Drop the Liberal mentality for just one moment and look at what WE'VE dreated for ourselves. China is just seizing their opportunity because they know we all want the "quick fix" and the government is seizing its opportunity to make the people more dependant on them.
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post #31 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-05-2009, 06:19 AM
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-Outsourcing is a problem for American workers.
-Obama addresses the issue by trying to tax those who try to be cheap and send the work overseas.
-Bush nuthuggers/Obama haters somehow find a way to declare this a defeat and consider this a tyrannical move to take away our rights.


I can't figure out if it's racism, or just blind republican loyalty. Either way, no matter what he does (case in point), you'll twist it to something bad. Wow.
Welcome to the world of trying to debate politics with 90%+ of DFWStangs. It constantly amazes me that they fail to see this attitude.

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post #32 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-05-2009, 06:43 AM
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Originally Posted by Juiceweezl View Post
Welcome to the world of trying to debate politics with 90%+ of DFWStangs. It constantly amazes me that they fail to see this attitude.
Dunno what you're so cranky about. We're just bitching and moaning, while you're getting what you want from from Obama. Well, maybe not what you want but at least you agree with his policies more then disagree.

My '03 Sold.
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post #33 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-05-2009, 06:47 AM
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Originally Posted by Hollywood View Post
-Outsourcing is a problem for American workers.
-Obama addresses the issue by trying to tax those who try to be cheap and send the work overseas.
-Bush nuthuggers/Obama haters somehow find a way to declare this a defeat and consider this a tyrannical move to take away our rights.


I can't figure out if it's racism, or just blind republican loyalty. Either way, no matter what he does (case in point), you'll twist it to something bad. Wow.
Obammy should use tax "incentives" to keep the jobs here, not penalize them for outsourcing. All the big companies will just cut more employees here at home to make up for the extra taxes. If the heat gets to be too much, the owners fold up their collective tents here at home, and open businesses in other countries. Barry penalizes our own people more than he does the countries that import their crap into here. Why? He's a "globalist", and wants to be loved by the world. Libs just don't get it.

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post #34 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-05-2009, 06:49 AM
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Originally Posted by Juiceweezl View Post
Welcome to the world of trying to debate politics with 90%+ of DFWStangs. It constantly amazes me that they fail to see this attitude.
And it amazes me how you blindly follow that lying sack of shit, and not realize the rights you are giving up.

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post #35 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-05-2009, 06:55 AM
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Originally Posted by Hollywood View Post
Either way, no matter what he does (case in point), you'll twist it to something bad. Wow.
Like Democrats did for the past eight years? Get over it, that's American politics.
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post #36 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-05-2009, 08:59 AM
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Originally Posted by Vertnut View Post
And it amazes me how you blindly follow that lying sack of shit, and not realize the rights you are giving up.
I don't blindly follow. I leave that to the bulk of you extreme right wingers that are still bitter and making jokes about a black man in the Oval Office. Hollywood just made the point that no matter what he does, several of you just twist it and attack him over and over (much like many left wing extremists did with Bush). It's just the way it is.

Vert, I respect your views and typically enjoy reading your posts (with the exception of many childish name calling ones). Your stance has been clear from the beginning and you do not waffle at all on it. Whether I agree or not, I at least respect it and respect the firm stance/belief.

Juiceweezl
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post #37 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-05-2009, 09:10 AM
Lifer
 
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Originally Posted by Juiceweezl View Post
I don't blindly follow. I leave that to the bulk of you extreme right wingers that are still bitter and making jokes about a black man in the Oval Office. Hollywood just made the point that no matter what he does, several of you just twist it and attack him over and over (much like many left wing extremists did with Bush). It's just the way it is.

Vert, I respect your views and typically enjoy reading your posts (with the exception of many childish name calling ones). Your stance has been clear from the beginning and you do not waffle at all on it. Whether I agree or not, I at least respect it and respect the firm stance/belief.
A "black man" in office doesn't bother me. An obvious "socialist", does. Since before his college days, it is well documented how he feels about this country and our capitalistic system. Clarence Thomas doesn't have anything but respect from me, ditto for Michael Steele. The Liberals WANT to make this a racial issue ( a la Janine Garafalo?) so the actual POLITICAL issues stay hidden. It's the old "bait and switch"...a diversion tactic.

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post #38 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-05-2009, 09:10 AM
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we are capitalist first! outsourcing is a good capital move if it saves you money

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post #39 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-05-2009, 09:17 AM
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Originally Posted by Juiceweezl View Post
I leave that to the bulk of you extreme right wingers that are still bitter and making jokes about a black man in the Oval Office.
I'm not sure if you've noticed, but it is YOU and HOLLYWOOD that make comments about the color of the President's skin. It seems funny that you apply a racism label to people that have not mentioned it. Apparently it is you that has a problem with his skin color, as it is you that keeps bringing it up. Racist.
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post #40 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-05-2009, 09:21 AM
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Originally Posted by Vertnut View Post
A "black man" in office doesn't bother me. An obvious "socialist", does. Since before his college days, it is well documented how he feels about this country and our capitalistic system. Clarence Thomas doesn't have anything but respect from me, ditto for Michael Steele. The Liberals WANT to make this a racial issue ( a la Janine Garafalo?) so the actual POLITICAL issues stay hidden. It's the old "bait and switch"...a diversion tactic.
You're not someone making an issue out of it. Sorry if I implied that. It's those that continue to make jokes/comments about cadillacs, him being shot, etc....

I agree that wind bags like that idiot Garofolo (I don't know how to spell it either) try to make it an issue to divert attention or get a free pass with it. Then again, both parties have used stunts like that for years. Intelligent people see right through it and still focus on the issues.

Juiceweezl
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post #41 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-05-2009, 09:25 AM
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Originally Posted by 46Tbird View Post
I'm not sure if you've noticed, but it is YOU and HOLLYWOOD that make comments about the color of the President's skin. It seems funny that you apply a racism label to people that have not mentioned it. Apparently it is you that has a problem with his skin color, as it is you that keeps bringing it up. Racist.
I simply just referenced it because there are a number of comments here about his color, him being shot, etc. I didn't refer to any specific person (i.e. you) as having made the comments. If you don't agree that people attack him by labeling him as black, then you're completely off base.

Juiceweezl
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post #42 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-05-2009, 09:26 AM
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Originally Posted by Juiceweezl View Post
If you don't agree that people attack him by labeling him as black, then you're completely off base.
So calling someone black is an attack? We need JC to weigh in on this!
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post #43 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-05-2009, 09:28 AM
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Originally Posted by Juiceweezl View Post
I simply just referenced it because there are a number of comments here about his color, him being shot, etc. I didn't refer to any specific person (i.e. you) as having made the comments. If you don't agree that people attack him by labeling him as black, then you're completely off base.
For the record, I would NEVER want a POTUS shot or harmed in any way, while in office. Now then...a nice scandal would be a horse of another color...

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post #44 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-05-2009, 12:53 PM
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See, you make it sound as if each and every one of us shouldn't hold some burden of responsibility for this. No one forced people to live outside their means. We dictated our own society and now we should take it like grown-ups. Drop the Liberal mentality for just one moment and look at what WE'VE dreated for ourselves. China is just seizing their opportunity because they know we all want the "quick fix" and the government is seizing its opportunity to make the people more dependant on them.
Denny dont resort to the liberal name calling BS. I dont think the government needs to take care of the people in a general sense but there are things they are supposed to handle. The trade deals with other countries is def one, protecting the country is another, handling the immigration issue is another big one. The trade deal with china i think def fails under this thomas jefferson quote

"I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them."

By that i mean that there is/was nothing good for americans in a trade deal with china. What in the hell could they possibly offer us, the most intelligent and advanced country in the world? It was made out to be a benefit for us, i guess cause of cheap goods, like that was supposed to be good for us. That ties in your point of people living beyond their means, the governmen made changes to the american system of business supposedly to benefit us and it backfired. They failed to realize that access to dirt cheap labor would put americans out of work therefor making the benefit of cheap products meaningless. I still dont think they get it. They talk about jobs being created without realizing those are jobs at mcdonalds while we lose all kinds of high paying skilled jobs. These kinds of jobs are for high school kids, not educated people yet you see them working them all the time now.


I just dont agree that people up and decided to live beyond their means one day. It was a gradual shift. I mean greed is in everybody but wanting something and being able to get it are two different things. Id love to have a ferrari but until they drop the price to 30k, theres no way in hell i could ever afford one. Thats why i blame the government and the chinese and not the american people, they are simply buying whats available to them.

The trouble with doing something right the first time is that nobody appreciates how difficult it was.
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post #45 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-05-2009, 01:00 PM
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Originally Posted by Vertnut View Post
For the record, I would NEVER want a POTUS shot or harmed in any way, while in office. Now then...a nice scandal would be a horse of another color...
You didn't need to state that. I know where you stand. LOL Hey, I can dig a scandal too. Can we start a Jerry Springer chant now???

Juiceweezl
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post #46 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-05-2009, 03:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Hollywood View Post
-Outsourcing is a problem for American workers.
-Obama addresses the issue by trying to tax those who try to be cheap and send the work overseas.
-Bush nuthuggers/Obama haters somehow find a way to declare this a defeat and consider this a tyrannical move to take away our rights.

I can't figure out if it's racism, or just blind republican loyalty. Either way, no matter what he does (case in point), you'll twist it to something bad. Wow.

x2 to the 25th power. Some people have made up their minds already...
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post #47 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-05-2009, 03:20 PM
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What I think is funny is that you don't see the posts of people that agree with it.
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post #48 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-05-2009, 03:35 PM
Lifer
 
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Originally Posted by Juiceweezl View Post
You're not someone making an issue out of it. Sorry if I implied that. It's those that continue to make jokes/comments about cadillacs, him being shot, etc....

I agree that wind bags like that idiot Garofolo (I don't know how to spell it either) try to make it an issue to divert attention or get a free pass with it. Then again, both parties have used stunts like that for years. Intelligent people see right through it and still focus on the issues.
Who is making jokes about cadillacs, him being shot, etc.? I for one don't view the majority of Obama's policies as being anything to joke about.
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post #49 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-05-2009, 09:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Geor! View Post
Obama to tax business who outsource jobs overseas more.

I had heard that he had planned/wanted to do this during his campaign and really only liked that lone idea he had -- mainly because that really hit home.

What are your thoughts?
First shot of the trade wars. Smoot Hartley Act, anyone?
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post #50 of 56 (permalink) Old 05-05-2009, 09:56 PM
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Originally Posted by ceyko View Post
he being Obama? I suppose you think this is a good idea? I mean, you did not take a side. You only made comments.
Yes, I support this. It's a problem that i'm glad is being addressed. I'm having a hard time seeing why anyone would be against such a move, unless they were the head of one of these large corporations that does this to make their already deep pockets, deeper.
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