Barry's preaching "catastrophe" now. - DFWstangs Forums
 
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post #1 of 39 (permalink) Old 02-05-2009, 11:41 AM Thread Starter
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Barry's preaching "catastrophe" now.

What happened to "hope and change"? Just heard him say on CNN, that if this bill doesn't pass NOW, that our economy may NEVER recover...? Never recover from a recession? This chump is losing his mind. If you're going to be a con-man, you better have more game than that. It wasn't long ago that the Dems were saying that Bush was working off of our fears from 9/11. At least that was a very real scenario he presented. A little over 2 weeks in office, and he's abandoned his entire platform and has resorted to fear mongering...Only 1444 more days of his bullshit.

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post #2 of 39 (permalink) Old 02-05-2009, 11:46 AM
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post #3 of 39 (permalink) Old 02-05-2009, 11:47 AM
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post #4 of 39 (permalink) Old 02-05-2009, 11:52 AM
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He's panicking because his "hope" and "change" rhetoric has run into a brick wall when put into action in the real world, against people with differing opinions.

More and more he's now asserting the "I Won" statement. Sort of like a child stomping his foot because the other kids won't play along. Those darn republicans just won't play along, dammit!

Apparently the dems just had some kind of caucus or something, and the people there were told by barry's people to begin with the "republicans are being obstructionist" line.

Funny, because wasn't this the guy that said he was going to go "line by line" thru the budget/spending and redline pork? The dawn of new responsibility in washington? Hello? Its funny when idealism runs into cold, hard reality.

Maybe, just maybe..... the plan stinks as it is now, and it has nothing to do with obstructionism?

Also, where are the obama supporters thru all of these fisascos?
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post #5 of 39 (permalink) Old 02-05-2009, 11:53 AM
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post #6 of 39 (permalink) Old 02-05-2009, 11:57 AM
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post #7 of 39 (permalink) Old 02-05-2009, 12:05 PM Thread Starter
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He's panicking because his "hope" and "change" rhetoric has run into a brick wall when put into action in the real world, against people with differing opinions.

More and more he's now asserting the "I Won" statement. Sort of like a child stomping his foot because the other kids won't play along. Those darn republicans just won't play along, dammit!

Apparently the dems just had some kind of caucus or something, and the people there were told by barry's people to begin with the "republicans are being obstructionist" line.

Funny, because wasn't this the guy that said he was going to go "line by line" thru the budget/spending and redline pork? The dawn of new responsibility in washington? Hello? Its funny when idealism runs into cold, hard reality.

Maybe, just maybe..... the plan stinks as it is now, and it has nothing to do with obstructionism?

Also, where are the obama supporters thru all of these fisascos?
Seems like Barry's supporter's are going in the same direction as his "hope and change" platform...into extinction.

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post #8 of 39 (permalink) Old 02-05-2009, 12:13 PM
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AS I recall, didn't Bush use similar language to push through the original bailout package?
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post #9 of 39 (permalink) Old 02-05-2009, 12:20 PM
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AS I recall, didn't Bush use similar language to push through the original bailout package?
Yes, and it was complete bullshit then, too.

The problem isn't that we don't have enough government gimmes, the problem is we don't have enough good jobs for the people here. Our manufacturing base is GONE and our country will be in decline until it is restored. Period.
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post #10 of 39 (permalink) Old 02-05-2009, 12:22 PM
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Yes, and it was complete bullshit then, too.
Agreed

I just thinks it's funny all the panicky posts on here about the horrors of Obama. When in reality....not much difference...so far.

I've railed about our destroyed manufacturing base for YEARS. And most everyone told me I was "stuck in the past". And we did it do ourselves, buying foreign cars & cheap crap at Walmart.
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post #11 of 39 (permalink) Old 02-05-2009, 12:27 PM
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Agreed

I just thinks it's funny all the panicky posts on here about the horrors of Obama. When in reality....not much difference...so far.
The Horror of Obama is that nothing has changed and there was a small faction of Nobama-ers that didn't support him for this exact reason.

Meanwhile, the rest of the sheeple masses on here simply fear him because he's a "Socialist", completely ignoring the fact that what they support that they think is "better" is exactly the same.

Now waiting for one of said sheeples to come agree with this statement...

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post #12 of 39 (permalink) Old 02-05-2009, 12:31 PM
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The Horror of Obama is that nothing has changed, and several people on here knew this is exactly what would happen.

Meanwhile, the rest of the sheeple masses on here simply fear him because he's a "Socialist", completely ignoring the fact that what they support that they think is "better" is exactly the same.

Now waiting for one of said sheeples to come agree with this statement...
Obama..on his own cannot fix our economic mess, neither could Bush, McCain, Thompson, Hillary or any of the others who ran.

And as far as socialism, we've been a hybrid capitalist/socialist country for nearly 100 years.
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post #13 of 39 (permalink) Old 02-05-2009, 12:33 PM Thread Starter
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Agreed

I just thinks it's funny all the panicky posts on here about the horrors of Obama. When in reality....not much difference...so far.

I've railed about our destroyed manufacturing base for YEARS. And most everyone told me I was "stuck in the past". And we did it do ourselves, buying foreign cars & cheap crap at Walmart.
Not much difference? That's all he preached about. Did Bushs' first 3 out of 4 appointee's bring embarrassment to the country? If you're tired of it now, you might as well just sign off, because I plan on beating folks about the head with this shit for the next 1440 days. Bush received no quarter, and neither shall the messiah.

edit* I'm watching his stumbling, bumbling press secretary as we speak, dodging questions from the press about an array of issues...

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post #14 of 39 (permalink) Old 02-05-2009, 12:35 PM
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The Horror of Obama is that nothing has changed and there was a small faction of Nobama-ers that didn't support him for this exact reason.

Meanwhile, the rest of the sheeple masses on here simply fear him because he's a "Socialist", completely ignoring the fact that what they support that they think is "better" is exactly the same.

Now waiting for one of said sheeples to come agree with this statement...
LOL at this and all the posts really. It's not even been one month, and yet the Obama haters feel as if the country should already have been turned around. It too Bush 8 years to drive us into this mess. Give Obama and co. more than a few weeks to fix it. As for all the people wanting TX to leave the US, go right ahead. That'll be the day I pack my crap and leave here along with all of the defense contracts that pour right into TX industry. If you want to attack someone, go attack your very own oil industry giants that continue to rake in profits. Bad loans are the major contributor to this mess, but the fact that gasoline was unnecessarily $4 a gallon contributed heavily to the fact that people couldn't make mortgage payments. $4 a gallon gas impacted groceries, especially corn and milk, all manufactured and shipped goods, etc. There is plenty of blame to go around, so people need to stop putting it all on one or two people.

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post #15 of 39 (permalink) Old 02-05-2009, 12:37 PM
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Not much difference? That's all he preached about. Did Bushs' first 3 out of 4 appointee's bring embarrassment to the country? If you're tired of it now, you might as well just sign off, because I plan on beating folks about the head with this shit for the next 1440 days. Bush received no quarter, and neither shall the messiah.
Calm down dude, I didn't vote for Obama & don't partucularly like him. But in the real world, what's changed? Fubars in cabinet appointments have no effects on our everyday lives.
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post #16 of 39 (permalink) Old 02-05-2009, 12:38 PM Thread Starter
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Obama..on his own cannot fix our economic mess, neither could Bush, McCain, Thompson, Hillary or any of the others who ran.

And as far as socialism, we've been a hybrid capitalist/socialist country for nearly 100 years.
So I guess we should keep advancing in that "socialist" direction, since it's worked out so well around the world?

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post #17 of 39 (permalink) Old 02-05-2009, 12:39 PM Thread Starter
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Calm down dude, I didn't vote for Obama & don't partucularly like him. But in the real world, what's changed? Fubars in cabinet appointments have no effects on our everyday lives.
I'm perfectly calm...scary, huh?

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post #18 of 39 (permalink) Old 02-05-2009, 12:43 PM Thread Starter
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LOL at this and all the posts really. It's not even been one month, and yet the Obama haters feel as if the country should already have been turned around. It too Bush 8 years to drive us into this mess. Give Obama and co. more than a few weeks to fix it. As for all the people wanting TX to leave the US, go right ahead. That'll be the day I pack my crap and leave here along with all of the defense contracts that pour right into TX industry. If you want to attack someone, go attack your very own oil industry giants that continue to rake in profits. Bad loans are the major contributor to this mess, but the fact that gasoline was unnecessarily $4 a gallon contributed heavily to the fact that people couldn't make mortgage payments. $4 a gallon gas impacted groceries, especially corn and milk, all manufactured and shipped goods, etc. There is plenty of blame to go around, so people need to stop putting it all on one or two people.
My point is that he doesn't even know decent enough folks to fill his appointments! This should have all been sorted out before he even took office, so he could actually take care of REAL business.

Corn and "grain-related" foods were more impacted by the ethanol B.S. than gasoline.

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post #19 of 39 (permalink) Old 02-05-2009, 12:43 PM
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It too Bush 8 years to drive us into this mess. Give Obama and co. more than a few weeks to fix it.
Surely this is a sarcastic remark?

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post #20 of 39 (permalink) Old 02-05-2009, 12:46 PM
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Calm down dude, I didn't vote for Obama & don't partucularly like him. But in the real world, what's changed? Fubars in cabinet appointments have no effects on our everyday lives.
More important is what is changing. Some of us rather not wait until it has already changed before we take notice.

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post #21 of 39 (permalink) Old 02-05-2009, 12:48 PM
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So I guess we should keep advancing in that "socialist" direction, since it's worked out so well around the world?
Virtually all countries have mixed capitalist/socialist economies, it's just a question of how it's breaks down in terms of government. I think Bush pushed us more towards socialism, ie. goverment grew 40%, national debt doubled and $53 trillion Medicare act was passed.

Will Obama push us more towards socialism? yes....but would McCain have also pushed us more towards socialism? yes

I'm almost to the point that agree I with those who said Hillary was the most conservstive choice between her, Obama & McCain.
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post #22 of 39 (permalink) Old 02-05-2009, 12:51 PM
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More important is what is changing. Some of us rather not wait until it has already changed before we take notice.

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Unless you plan on staging a coup, or moving to Australia....I don't think you have a choice.
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post #23 of 39 (permalink) Old 02-05-2009, 01:01 PM
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Unless you plan on staging a coup, or moving to Australia....I don't think you have a choice.
I don't agree. Example, the more people that hear of this POS 'stimulas' Obama has on the table, the more people there are that don't like it, and the more heat gets applied to the leftists to drop it. If no one said anything, it would get voted in be a done deal.

As far as your two choices though, I think the first choice is imminent and unavoidable at this point.


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post #24 of 39 (permalink) Old 02-05-2009, 01:07 PM Thread Starter
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Unless you plan on staging a coup, or moving to Australia....I don't think you have a choice.
I've never been known to be a quitter. You sound a bit defeated to me...

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post #25 of 39 (permalink) Old 02-05-2009, 01:09 PM Thread Starter
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Virtually all countries have mixed capitalist/socialist economies, it's just a question of how it's breaks down in terms of government. I think Bush pushed us more towards socialism, ie. goverment grew 40%, national debt doubled and $53 trillion Medicare act was passed.

Will Obama push us more towards socialism? yes....but would McCain have also pushed us more towards socialism? yes

I'm almost to the point that agree I with those who said Hillary was the most conservstive choice between her, Obama & McCain.
"Gov't growth" and socialism aren't necessarily directly related.

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post #26 of 39 (permalink) Old 02-05-2009, 01:24 PM
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LOL at this and all the posts really. It's not even been one month, and yet the Obama haters feel as if the country should already have been turned around. It too Bush 8 years to drive us into this mess. Give Obama and co. more than a few weeks to fix it. As for all the people wanting TX to leave the US, go right ahead. That'll be the day I pack my crap and leave here along with all of the defense contracts that pour right into TX industry. If you want to attack someone, go attack your very own oil industry giants that continue to rake in profits. Bad loans are the major contributor to this mess, but the fact that gasoline was unnecessarily $4 a gallon contributed heavily to the fact that people couldn't make mortgage payments. $4 a gallon gas impacted groceries, especially corn and milk, all manufactured and shipped goods, etc. There is plenty of blame to go around, so people need to stop putting it all on one or two people.
Actually, continued overtaxation to provide benefits to non-citizens costs more than the difference of $2 and $4 gasoline. You complain about a $42B profit with Exxon Mobile, but on what revenue? you will probably find they are clearing about 6 or 7% net which is pretty common for ANY company. It's not like they are netting 50% profit but when a Gallon of bottled water is more expensive than a gallon of gas, how the fuck can you complain about the gas prices?


Liberalism, socialism and communism DON'T FUCKING WORK. They are all basically the same and Russia proved that it doesn't work 15 years ago when they collapsed trying to take care of their population. If someone can't put food on their own table, fuck em. Let em die or work to make their lives better.

I can tell you right now that if MY tax money is sent to Kali to pay for their bullshit, heads are going to roll.



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post #27 of 39 (permalink) Old 02-05-2009, 01:24 PM
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I don't agree. Example, the more people that hear of this POS 'stimulas' Obama has on the table, the more people there are that don't like it, and the more heat gets applied to the leftists to drop it. If no one said anything, it would get voted in be a done deal.

As far as your two choices though, I think the first choice is imminent and unavoidable at this point.


Stevo
When bailout # 1 was proposed, I believe at least 70% of Americans were against it. Didn't stop Bush and both Democrats & Republicans from ramming it down our throats.

But I agree with your sentiment to let our elected officials know when we don't like something. Hey, back when Bush tried to strong arm Congress into passing the Dubai ports deal, Congress got such overwhelming negative feedback that they didn't buckle.
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post #28 of 39 (permalink) Old 02-05-2009, 02:53 PM
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post #29 of 39 (permalink) Old 02-05-2009, 04:29 PM
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My point is that he doesn't even know decent enough folks to fill his appointments! This should have all been sorted out before he even took office, so he could actually take care of REAL business.

Corn and "grain-related" foods were more impacted by the ethanol B.S. than gasoline.
I'll agree that all positions should've been filled on a "what-if" scenario. That part is an embarassment. As for the ethanol BS, it was created by $4 gas. For the record, I'm not an Obama supporter, nor was I a Bush fan. Personally, I think we should do away with all income tax and go to a straight sales tax. That gives the power to the people for how much you want to pay in taxes. It will never happen though.

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post #30 of 39 (permalink) Old 02-05-2009, 04:32 PM
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Actually, continued overtaxation to provide benefits to non-citizens costs more than the difference of $2 and $4 gasoline. You complain about a $42B profit with Exxon Mobile, but on what revenue? you will probably find they are clearing about 6 or 7% net which is pretty common for ANY company. It's not like they are netting 50% profit but when a Gallon of bottled water is more expensive than a gallon of gas, how the fuck can you complain about the gas prices?


Liberalism, socialism and communism DON'T FUCKING WORK. They are all basically the same and Russia proved that it doesn't work 15 years ago when they collapsed trying to take care of their population. If someone can't put food on their own table, fuck em. Let em die or work to make their lives better.

I can tell you right now that if MY tax money is sent to Kali to pay for their bullshit, heads are going to roll.
Actually, continuing to spend billions in Iraq for no conceivable reason costs more than either. Exxon's margin is around 9.6% or so. That's a manageable number and I'm fine with that -- except that it's a commodity, and they control that market and thus the price which is unfair. As for a gallon of water costing more, sure I can complain -- I don't drink bottled water. I have that choice. It's not like I have a choice about buying gasoline and paying for heat, etc. I can choose an economic vehicle (which I drive) IF I can swing a financial transaction to get one. My point is that people became strapped for cash when gas spiked. People were spending double the amount on gas as before.

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post #31 of 39 (permalink) Old 02-05-2009, 04:59 PM Thread Starter
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I'll agree that all positions should've been filled on a "what-if" scenario. That part is an embarassment. As for the ethanol BS, it was created by $4 gas. For the record, I'm not an Obama supporter, nor was I a Bush fan. Personally, I think we should do away with all income tax and go to a straight sales tax. That gives the power to the people for how much you want to pay in taxes. It will never happen though.
We were getting ethanol stuck up our rectums long before $4 gas, but I'm going to do some research to be sure I can back that up. A lot of idiots thought ethanol was the answer way back there.

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post #32 of 39 (permalink) Old 02-06-2009, 06:55 AM
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We were getting ethanol stuck up our rectums long before $4 gas, but I'm going to do some research to be sure I can back that up. A lot of idiots thought ethanol was the answer way back there.
Yes, the push was on for ethanol beforehand, but $4 gas was the proverbial "gasonline on the fire" if you will. Everyone went into panic mode and basically said, "We need alternatives now -- let's use ethanol." The end result is the consumer gets screwed on quality as ethanol gas is crap, and consumer goods went up that depended on corn.

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post #33 of 39 (permalink) Old 02-06-2009, 07:02 AM
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One more thing on the gas price being a part of this that people are neglecting. I'll use my wife and I for example. For round numbers sake, let's say we use 30 gallons of gas a week. The actual number is close to that. We each commute about 75 miles round trip each day plus weekend driving. Her minivan gets high 20's mpg, and my focus gets 30+. Let's look at the math.

$4/gal * 30 gal = $120/wk for gas. or $480/month
$2/gal * 30 gal = $60/wk for gas. or $240/month
$1.50/gal * 30 gal = $45/2k for gas. or $180/month

Using the high and low for us, that means we could possibly have an extra $300/month in disposable income to either spend on consumer goods, investements, mortgage, etc. We live simple and try to save money, so we are not in danger of losing our house, etc. as long as we stay employed.

For those who bought houses/cars/etc. that was closer to the limt of their income, this started their downward spiral. Yes, the insane mortgage and other purchases of items they couldn't really afford started it, but spending an extra $300/month for gas flat out destroyed them. If you don't think that a family having a few extra hundred per month to pay their mortgage or buy consumables with would make a difference to our economy, then you are mistaken. IMO, the superficial high price of gasoline pushed us over the edge.

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post #34 of 39 (permalink) Old 02-06-2009, 08:32 AM
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Obama..on his own cannot fix our economic mess, neither could Bush, McCain, Thompson, Hillary or any of the others who ran.

And as far as socialism, we've been a hybrid capitalist/socialist country for nearly 100 years.
But it really ramped up under FDR and IMO the Capitalist/Socialist curve is like a hp/tq curve. At some point they will cross and the torque that capitalism has will be overshadowed when the horsepower of socialism takes off. The only problem is that socialism falls flat on it's face after 5500rpm like a 96 4.6 SOHC

We've been riding the wave of prosperity put in motion over a century ago and the government has gained control with each passing day, which leaves us in the current predicament and the one coming over the horizon.


Barry preaching fear is Barry showing his general ignorance. He needs to be stonewalled!

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post #35 of 39 (permalink) Old 02-06-2009, 08:40 AM
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Originally Posted by Sean88gt View Post
But it really ramped up under FDR and IMO the Capitalist/Socialist curve is like a hp/tq curve. At some point they will cross and the torque that capitalism has will be overshadowed when the horsepower of socialism takes off. The only problem is that socialism falls flat on it's face after 5500rpm like a 96 4.6 SOHC

We've been riding the wave of prosperity put in motion over a century ago and the government has gained control with each passing day, which leaves us in the current predicament and the one coming over the horizon.


Barry preaching fear is Barry showing his general ignorance. He needs to be stonewalled!

I pretty much agree with all that Sean. But PURE capitalism doesn't work,just as pure democracy doesn't work. But yes, the "blend" is getting a little too much socialism
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post #36 of 39 (permalink) Old 02-06-2009, 11:19 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Juiceweezl View Post
One more thing on the gas price being a part of this that people are neglecting. I'll use my wife and I for example. For round numbers sake, let's say we use 30 gallons of gas a week. The actual number is close to that. We each commute about 75 miles round trip each day plus weekend driving. Her minivan gets high 20's mpg, and my focus gets 30+. Let's look at the math.

$4/gal * 30 gal = $120/wk for gas. or $480/month
$2/gal * 30 gal = $60/wk for gas. or $240/month
$1.50/gal * 30 gal = $45/2k for gas. or $180/month

Using the high and low for us, that means we could possibly have an extra $300/month in disposable income to either spend on consumer goods, investements, mortgage, etc. We live simple and try to save money, so we are not in danger of losing our house, etc. as long as we stay employed.

For those who bought houses/cars/etc. that was closer to the limt of their income, this started their downward spiral. Yes, the insane mortgage and other purchases of items they couldn't really afford started it, but spending an extra $300/month for gas flat out destroyed them. If you don't think that a family having a few extra hundred per month to pay their mortgage or buy consumables with would make a difference to our economy, then you are mistaken. IMO, the superficial high price of gasoline pushed us over the edge.
What's the quote about,"Poor preparation on your part, does not constitute an emergency on my part"? Your last paragraph is very telling. Gas prices did hurt all of us, but it boils down to folks living above their means. There are no guarantee's when it comes to the price of anything. You can use the same analogy for rising health-care costs', and electricity (which is a great example). My wife started car pooling after the gas took off, and found that it was something she should have been doing all along.

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post #37 of 39 (permalink) Old 02-06-2009, 07:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Vertnut View Post
What's the quote about,"Poor preparation on your part, does not constitute an emergency on my part"? Your last paragraph is very telling. Gas prices did hurt all of us, but it boils down to folks living above their means. There are no guarantee's when it comes to the price of anything. You can use the same analogy for rising health-care costs', and electricity (which is a great example). My wife started car pooling after the gas took off, and found that it was something she should have been doing all along.
Agreed, just as I stated. The credit and stupid loans/spending put us in the mess, but it was not over the top until gas spiked. My wife and I were looking ahead. I parked both my mustang and my truck fall of 2006 when I bought my focus. We had also refi'd to a 15 year note a little before then to get ahead. We were able to withstand the gas crunch and just refi'd again to 4.625% on a 30 year note. I am pumped now to watch the principal plummet. We are part of the group that can get loans and could've upgraded house, cars, etc., but we're being smart. Once the economy eventually recovers, we'll be set because of discipline and planning. Unfortunately, we're in the minority group here.

You're right about the carpooling/living smarter deal. I had only had my focus about 6 months when I realized I should've done it all along.

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post #38 of 39 (permalink) Old 02-06-2009, 08:12 PM
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Originally Posted by Juiceweezl View Post
Agreed, just as I stated. The credit and stupid loans/spending put us in the mess, but it was not over the top until gas spiked. My wife and I were looking ahead. I parked both my mustang and my truck fall of 2006 when I bought my focus. We had also refi'd to a 15 year note a little before then to get ahead. We were able to withstand the gas crunch and just refi'd again to 4.625% on a 30 year note. I am pumped now to watch the principal plummet. We are part of the group that can get loans and could've upgraded house, cars, etc., but we're being smart. Once the economy eventually recovers, we'll be set because of discipline and planning. Unfortunately, we're in the minority group here.

You're right about the carpooling/living smarter deal. I had only had my focus about 6 months when I realized I should've done it all along.
We see things the same way. We've always tried to live within our means, and have paid off debt, etc. Got rid of the F150 for a focus when gas spiked after katrina. Dumped AT&T and got vonage. Dumped ADT and got a cheaper company. Had an insurance review. The house is financed for 15 years at 5.25%. The wife drives a 10 year old expedition with 162k miles on it. I have run up a balance on ONE card to pay for the restoration of my daughters t/a (I chose to do that to expedite the process), but that should be paid off in 6-8 months. All other bills are paid off. We've been able to ride out some bumps and me not getting paid for 4 months now along with some significant medical bills (paid), and I still have cash in the bank. I should get paid on the 30th, so we'll work on rebuilding the bank account and paying off that one card.
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post #39 of 39 (permalink) Old 02-06-2009, 09:03 PM
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Originally Posted by White trash wagon View Post
I pretty much agree with all that Sean. But PURE capitalism doesn't work,just as pure democracy doesn't work. But yes, the "blend" is getting a little too much socialism
The curve will fall off at somepoint, hopefully.

1/19/09, the last day of Free America.
Pericles "Freedom is the sure possession of those alone who have the courage to defend it. "

"[T]he people alone have an incontestable, unalienable, and indefeasible right to institute government and to reform, alter, or totally change the same when their protection, safety, prosperity, and happiness require it." --Samuel Adams


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