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post #1 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-29-2009, 10:18 PM Thread Starter
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Bias if I've ever seen it...

If you want to subtly drop in your opinion fine it won't be a distraction while I'm reading, and I wouldn't normally add fuel to the fire that burns on the site, but this is ridiculous....
Quote:
Republicans: "Go To Hell America!" 100% Partisan Vote
Not one Republican vote! Not one! And that is the Republican Party's response to the American public who, as every poll indicates, are begging for less partisanship and more "just get the job done."

The Obama stimulus package passed in the House along strict party lines. So there it is America, we now know who to thank or blame. That being the case the Republicans just painted themselves into an obstructionist corner. They are betting on and praying for national failure. Like Rush Limbaugh, they are hoping the economic recovery fails. They have bet against our future, even against a president who reached out in an unprecedented way to them. Their answer to President Obama's extended hand? A clenched fist! Head in the sand! The "we won't play!" of perennial brats.

The Republican Party just doesn't get it. We are in trouble! And our country's fate and the success or failure of the Obama presidency is now one and the same.

The Republicans could have done a great thing for their party and the country: sent a message to the world -- we stand together! Imagine the impact on tomorrow's stock market, and our enemy's view of America and our standing in the world if instead of a partisan Republican "NO" vote the backing of the recovery plan had been unanimous approval!

If the Republicans weren't stuck in a white man's reactionary country club past -- and I speak here as white former life long Republican -- this momentous vote could have changed American history. It would have changed it not just on this issue but because of the symbolism. It would have told all Americans -- we are at war with our weaknesses, we will prevail, take heart help is on the way.

The Republicans might have then shared the credit, even won a few elections in the future. Now their fate is sealed. Obama will succeed. America won't forget who to thank.

The Republicans have made themselves the enemy of our recovery. They would rater take us all down than let our president have his day. While President Obama is blessed with a large vision, the Republicans are mired in a petty past, a small "victory" in unanimous obstruction passing for a moral "victory."

With this NO vote, the Republican Party sends us this message: we are a group of bad losers, don't entrust us with your future! And: We are betting against you America!

We Americans are wounded. President Obama has arrived with his ambulance as he promised he would. All the Republicans could think of doing was to try and let the air out of the tires. Shame!

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post #2 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-29-2009, 10:49 PM
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post #3 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-30-2009, 12:03 AM
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Alright, where to start.

1. Obama offered to include the republicans in the decision makin, as long as the republicans basically went along with the democratic decisions already made and didn't really change anything. Republican input was considered, and summarily dismissed with the "I Won" comment. The republican plan was long on tax breaks, and not so much on spending.

2. Given that the republicans go no input whatsoever, why should they approve of this deal?

3. The plan is *full* of pork, despite obamas comments about trimming it "line by line".

4. It' been estimated that maybe .12 of each dollar spent *might* stimulate the economy.

5. Historically, government spending during a recession only makes things worse, not better.

6. This is a plan to lock in and ensure democratic control of government for years.

Would YOU go along with a deal like this? I'm glad they nutted up, and hopefully this whole sordid deal can be headed off at the senate.
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post #4 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-30-2009, 12:41 AM
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Alright, where to start.

1. Obama offered to include the republicans in the decision makin, as long as the republicans basically went along with the democratic decisions already made and didn't really change anything. Republican input was considered, and summarily dismissed with the "I Won" comment. The republican plan was long on tax breaks, and not so much on spending.

2. Given that the republicans go no input whatsoever, why should they approve of this deal?

3. The plan is *full* of pork, despite obamas comments about trimming it "line by line".

4. It' been estimated that maybe .12 of each dollar spent *might* stimulate the economy.

5. Historically, government spending during a recession only makes things worse, not better.

6. This is a plan to lock in and ensure democratic control of government for years.

Would YOU go along with a deal like this? I'm glad they nutted up, and hopefully this whole sordid deal can be headed off at the senate.

LOL! But the 800billion is on loan to us from us, it'll be ok...
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post #5 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-30-2009, 01:06 AM
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post #6 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-30-2009, 04:18 AM
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I don't view the problem as partisan, hell both party's approved the initial $700 billion "bailout". But that $700B has, so far, just gone into Wall street's pocket. No reinvestment, no easing of credit, not one job saved, except maybe a few CEO's .

The new "bailout" is still a ripoff, but of a different flavor. Some of the infrastructure stuff is fine, we do have bridges falling down. Most of it is porkbarrel. But at LEAST 50% needs to go directly into jobs creation....not even close. Bail out "Joe Blow", not the billionaires.

I think the govt should commit about $400B of this new package for nuclear power plants, updating our electrical grids, encourage manufacturing, job training, etc,. This would creat millions of jobs, good jobs.

Both parties are equally guilty here, both Democrats for writing a bill with zero Republican input, and the Republicans for just turning thier backs on it.
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post #7 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-30-2009, 05:13 AM
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I'm not an avid listener to Rush's program. What he's being called out on is his comment that he wished Obama would fail. What he said prior to that is left out everytime. I'm paraphrasing but what he said was that these bailouts and stimulus packages amounted to socialism and he hoped Obama failed.
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post #8 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-30-2009, 05:25 AM
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I don't view the problem as partisan, hell both party's approved the initial $700 billion "bailout". But that $700B has, so far, just gone into Wall street's pocket. No reinvestment, no easing of credit, not one job saved, except maybe a few CEO's .

The new "bailout" is still a ripoff, but of a different flavor. Some of the infrastructure stuff is fine, we do have bridges falling down. Most of it is porkbarrel. But at LEAST 50% needs to go directly into jobs creation....not even close. Bail out "Joe Blow", not the billionaires.

I think the govt should commit about $400B of this new package for nuclear power plants, updating our electrical grids, encourage manufacturing, job training, etc,. This would creat millions of jobs, good jobs.

Both parties are equally guilty here, both Democrats for writing a bill with zero Republican input, and the Republicans for just turning thier backs on it.
They didn't "turn their backs". As this turd grew, Pelosi did not allow Rep input. I think what they did is perfect: if Barry's right, they will be wrong. If Barry's wrong on this, they have no blame in it. Is it a gamble? Hell yes. Is it worth it? Hell yes. If the "people" had a list of all the non-"bail out" pork, they would know whata steaming turd this thing really is. Nothing really goes into effect until late 2010, and by then, there would be a turn-around anyway.

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post #9 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-30-2009, 05:42 AM
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I'm not an avid listener to Rush's program. What he's being called out on is his comment that he wished Obama would fail. What he said prior to that is left out everytime. I'm paraphrasing but what he said was that these bailouts and stimulus packages amounted to socialism and he hoped Obama failed.
More along the lines of he wants Obama to succeed, the country to succeed, but for Obama's policies to fail.

If his policies pass, there is no way the country will flourish and grow.

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post #10 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-30-2009, 06:11 AM
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More along the lines of he wants Obama to succeed, the country to succeed, but for Obama's policies to fail.

If his policies pass, there is no way the country will flourish and grow.
It tickles the shit out of me, that Barry is even refering to Limbaugh at all! It shows his insecurities and does not exactly instill my confidence in the man.

Do you guys remember Clinton calling Limbaugh from Air Force One back in the mid-'90's? Greatness!

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post #11 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-30-2009, 06:24 AM
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Partisanship is the American way in politics, and I don't see any problems with it. I can actually applaud both parties in this case of sticking to their party lines, and can only hope that the final outcome works out, at least in part, for the good of America.
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post #12 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-30-2009, 06:31 AM
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Partisanship is the American way in politics, and I don't see any problems with it. I can actually applaud both parties in this case of sticking to their party lines, and can only hope that the final outcome works out, at least in part, for the good of America.
Exactly! Politics is all about partisanship. Why have different parties if you're going to agree on varying ideals? Pick your corner, and stay there. That's what got Bush and the Rep party in this pickle to begin with- trying to placate the other side. Piss on that. They should stick to their guns, no matter which side they're on. It's easier to pick out the enemy that way.

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post #13 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-30-2009, 07:00 AM
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I'm glad the Republicans finally actually stood for something. It'll be interesting to see how the bill does in the senate.

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post #14 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-30-2009, 07:16 AM
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Partisanship is the American way in politics, and I don't see any problems with it. I can actually applaud both parties in this case of sticking to their party lines, and can only hope that the final outcome works out, at least in part, for the good of America.
I disagree, partisanship has become so caustic, so destructive that both party's are obssesed with destroying the other. It was Karl Rove's goal to so critically wound the Democratic party that a 50 year Republican majority would occur. That didn't work out, and now the Democrats are out to extract revenge.

It didn't used to be that negative of an enviroment. Remember how Reagan worked WITH Tip O'Neal and the Democratic Congress? Remember the "Reagan Democrats"? Of course they had idealogical differences & clashed on occassion....but they could work together.

I don't see how anyone can support the 2 parties taking pot shots at each other while the USA goes to hell. Extreme partisanship in unamerican.
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post #15 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-30-2009, 07:17 AM
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I love how they (dems) scream of bipartisanship, but then on the next breath will do whatever they can to stop the other side (turn off the lights in Congress, Texas dems actually going to another state, filibustering, etc..)

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post #16 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-30-2009, 07:25 AM
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Originally Posted by White trash wagon View Post
I disagree, partisanship has become so caustic, so destructive that both party's are obssesed with destroying the other. It was Karl Rove's goal to so critically wound the Democratic party that a 50 year Republican majority would occur. That didn't work out, and now the Democrats are out to extract revenge.

It didn't used to be that negative of an enviroment. Remember how Reagan worked WITH Tip O'Neal and the Democratic Congress? Remember the "Reagan Democrats"? Of course they had idealogical differences & clashed on occassion....but they could work together.

I don't see how anyone can support the 2 parties taking pot shots at each other while the USA goes to hell. Extreme partisanship in unamerican.
I don't see them out to destroy each other so much as being miles apart on ideology when it comes to addressing the negative issues confronting America today. The great leadership shown in the past, by both parties, is what seems to be lacking today. Compromise will first require a greater show of intelligence on the part of our leaders.
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post #17 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-30-2009, 07:53 AM
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I disagree, partisanship has become so caustic, so destructive that both party's are obssesed with destroying the other. It was Karl Rove's goal to so critically wound the Democratic party that a 50 year Republican majority would occur. That didn't work out, and now the Democrats are out to extract revenge.

It didn't used to be that negative of an enviroment. Remember how Reagan worked WITH Tip O'Neal and the Democratic Congress? Remember the "Reagan Democrats"? Of course they had idealogical differences & clashed on occassion....but they could work together.

I don't see how anyone can support the 2 parties taking pot shots at each other while the USA goes to hell. Extreme partisanship in unamerican.
Big differences. Pelosi ain't no Tip Oneal, and Barry ain't no Reagan. How's that for contrast? Reagan had a Republican senate, while the Dems (and Oneal) ran the House. At this point in his presidency (almost ironically to the day-Feb. 5th, 1981) Reagan hit the congress with proposed TAX and SPENDING CUTS, NOT some $800billion+ pork-barrel POS. These two factions need to stick to party lines, and let us, as the voters, determine which side we want to go with. The extremes of each party are running each side, so I see little chance of bi-partisanship in the near future.

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post #18 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-30-2009, 09:35 AM
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The Republicans finally standing up for conservative values is not a bad thing. The toxic atmosphere is a liberal thing. When Jimmy Carter left office and was at The Reagan inauguration, not one Reagan supporter booed him. He was by far a worse and weaker President than Bush ever was yet the liberals booed Bush when he was at the Messiah's inauguration.

The liberals have created this hostile atmosphere and then cry when true conservatives stand up for what they believe in and don't allow pork barrel bills and crazy wasting of taxpayer dollars. I hope this is the beginning of the resurgence of conservatism in the Republican Party.

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post #19 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-30-2009, 09:36 AM
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I love how they (dems) scream of bipartisanship, but then on the next breath will do whatever they can to stop the other side (turn off the lights in Congress, Texas dems actually going to another state, filibustering, etc..)
Very true.

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post #20 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-30-2009, 09:42 AM
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The liberals have created this hostile atmosphere and then cry when true conservatives stand up for what they believe in and don't allow pork barrel bills and crazy wasting of taxpayer dollars. I hope this is the beginning of the resurgence of conservatism in the Republican Party.
I agree with this statement.

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post #21 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-30-2009, 11:33 AM
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I don't view the problem as partisan, hell both party's approved the initial $700 billion "bailout". But that $700B has, so far, just gone into Wall street's pocket. No reinvestment, no easing of credit, not one job saved, except maybe a few CEO's .

The new "bailout" is still a ripoff, but of a different flavor. Some of the infrastructure stuff is fine, we do have bridges falling down. Most of it is porkbarrel. But at LEAST 50% needs to go directly into jobs creation....not even close. Bail out "Joe Blow", not the billionaires.

I think the govt should commit about $400B of this new package for nuclear power plants, updating our electrical grids, encourage manufacturing, job training, etc,. This would creat millions of jobs, good jobs.

Both parties are equally guilty here, both Democrats for writing a bill with zero Republican input, and the Republicans for just turning thier backs on it.
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post #22 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-30-2009, 08:58 PM
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The Republicans finally standing up for conservative values is not a bad thing. The toxic atmosphere is a liberal thing. When Jimmy Carter left office and was at The Reagan inauguration, not one Reagan supporter booed him. He was by far a worse and weaker President than Bush ever was yet the liberals booed Bush when he was at the Messiah's inauguration.

The liberals have created this hostile atmosphere and then cry when true conservatives stand up for what they believe in and don't allow pork barrel bills and crazy wasting of taxpayer dollars. I hope this is the beginning of the resurgence of conservatism in the Republican Party.

It's really quite simple Don.

Republicans, for the most part, have class and act accordingly.

Democrats, for the most part, have no class and act accordingly.

For a quick demonstration of said class, google pics of the aftermath of the republican convention, then do likewise for the democratic convention. Then youtube for demonstrations during the republican convention and the democratic convention. Those two illustrations should be sufficient to drive the point home...
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post #23 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-30-2009, 09:00 PM
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I disagree, partisanship has become so caustic, so destructive that both party's are obssesed with destroying the other. It was Karl Rove's goal to so critically wound the Democratic party that a 50 year Republican majority would occur. That didn't work out, and now the Democrats are out to extract revenge.

It didn't used to be that negative of an enviroment. Remember how Reagan worked WITH Tip O'Neal and the Democratic Congress? Remember the "Reagan Democrats"? Of course they had idealogical differences & clashed on occassion....but they could work together.

I don't see how anyone can support the 2 parties taking pot shots at each other while the USA goes to hell. Extreme partisanship in unamerican.
For the first time, maybe ever, I totally agree with you. It is quite ridiculous, and by design.
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post #24 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-30-2009, 09:23 PM
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I don't see how anyone can support the 2 parties taking pot shots at each other while the USA goes to hell. Extreme partisanship in unamerican.
Yep. Amazing how so many people have come to care waaay more about "their" party than our country. Something I never thought we would lose site of but we have. Divide and conquer may work well in the short run but at a hell of a penalty.

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post #25 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-30-2009, 09:36 PM
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Yep. Amazing how so many people have come to care waaay more about "their" party than our country. Something I never thought we would lose site of but we have. Divide and conquer may work well in the short run but at a hell of a penalty.


I could give a damn about party. I believe that we need to earn our own way in life and stop encouraging people to sit on their fat asses. Why is that so wrong?

This country was built on hard work and we now seem to be hell bent on tearing it apart by encouraging people to stick their hands out for that which they didn't work.
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post #26 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-30-2009, 09:53 PM
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I could give a damn about party. I believe that we need to earn our own way in life and stop encouraging people to sit on their fat asses. Why is that so wrong?

This country was built on hard work and we now seem to be hell bent on tearing it apart by encouraging people to stick their hands out for that which they didn't work.
I agree. And don't I wish that welfare entitlement was one of our most pressing concerns. What happens when the hard working people have no place to work hard?

* For the record. I've missed very few work days since I was 13...and I'm no youngster.

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post #27 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-30-2009, 10:01 PM
 
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I could give a damn about party. I believe that we need to earn our own way in life and stop encouraging people to sit on their fat asses. Why is that so wrong?

This country was built on hard work and we now seem to be hell bent on tearing it apart by encouraging people to stick their hands out for that which they didn't work.
It all comes down to the idea that the government owes you something. So many people think that they have been wronged by our government and they should be taken care of. The government owes us nothing, except all of our stolen rights back.

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post #28 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-30-2009, 10:05 PM
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You're right, it's really not. Our 'out of control' government is a much larger concern, imo. If we can stop the programs, the fat will lose those asses upon which they sit...

And I've been by your side in that work ethic. When I lost my job of twelve years five months ago I had a job the same day. Not making as much but I am providing for my family without asking for a damned thing from anyone.

Which is as it should be...
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post #29 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-30-2009, 10:12 PM
 
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You're right, it's really not. Our 'out of control' government is a much larger concern, imo. If we can stop the programs, the fat will lose those asses upon which they sit...

And I've been by your side in that work ethic. When I lost my job of twelve years five months ago I had a job the same day. Not making as much but I am providing for my family without asking for a damned thing from anyone.

Which is as it should be...
I fully agree, our government has become one large soulless beast that keeps growing larger. Our Founding Fathers envisioned a small government, so that the power would never leave the peoples hands.

Experience should teach us to be most on our guard to protect liberty when the government's purposes are beneficent. Men born to freedom are naturally alert to repel invasion of their liberty by evil-minded rulers.The greatest dangers to liberty lurk in insidious encroachment by men of zeal, well meaning but without understanding.
--Louis D. Brandeis, Olmstead vs. United States, 1928
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post #30 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-30-2009, 10:24 PM
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may be a repost , why Obama plan is bad

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post #31 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-30-2009, 10:27 PM
 
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Thats what happens when you have nothing to back our currency. I becomes a worthless piece of paper.
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post #32 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-30-2009, 10:27 PM
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I fully agree, our government has become one large soulless beast that keeps growing larger. Our Founding Fathers envisioned a small government, so that the power would never leave the peoples hands.

Experience should teach us to be most on our guard to protect liberty when the government's purposes are beneficent. Men born to freedom are naturally alert to repel invasion of their liberty by evil-minded rulers.The greatest dangers to liberty lurk in insidious encroachment by men of zeal, well meaning but without understanding.
--Louis D. Brandeis, Olmstead vs. United States, 1928
I like that quote, though the skeptic within can't help but apply it to current times. As such I wonder if our governmental figureheads truly have what's best for our country (the people of which it is comprised) at heart, or are they more concerned with the shaping of the entity as a whole (in effect not giving a damn about those same people) into some sort of kingdom.

Wasted muse, as we all know the answer, whether we admit it or not...
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post #33 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-30-2009, 10:31 PM
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Screw that! They've got pics of Sarah Palin in a bikini!

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post #34 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-30-2009, 10:31 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Fox466 View Post
I like that quote, though the skeptic within can't help but apply it to current times. As such I wonder if our governmental figureheads truly have what's best for our country (the people of which it is comprised) at heart, or are they more concerned with the shaping of the entity as a whole (in effect not giving a damn about those same people) into some sort of kingdom.

Wasted muse, as we all know the answer, whether we admit it or not...
The only thing many of them desire is to sit in their comfy chair a few more year. And we allow it, we re-elect the same failures each year. I point the finger at both, Us and them, because we, in the end, are the true failures.
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post #35 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-30-2009, 10:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paladin View Post
I hope this is the beginning of the resurgence of conservatism in the Republican Party.
Been waiting a while... on pins and needles.
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post #36 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-30-2009, 10:51 PM
 
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How about not just a resurgence of conservatism in the republican party, how about a total resurrection of the ideals of the Constitution. Those are the ideals we should be directing our life toward. And instead of sitting behind our party lines, we work together for the good of our future generations and the preservation of liberty in America.
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post #37 of 37 (permalink) Old 01-31-2009, 06:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Japes View Post
The only thing many of them desire is to sit in their comfy chair a few more year. And we allow it, we re-elect the same failures each year. I point the finger at both, Us and them, because we, in the end, are the true failures.

Very true sir.

And welcome to the board, btw.
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