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post #1 of 30 (permalink) Old 12-04-2008, 12:46 PM Thread Starter
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The unthinkable is under consideration

Quote:
Dec. 4 (Bloomberg) -- General Motors Corp. and Chrysler LLC executives are considering accepting a pre-arranged bankruptcy as the last-resort price of getting a multibillion-dollar government bailout, said a person familiar with their internal discussions.
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?p...d=a36fjEnQqEgc

Now, we were told that this would not work just last week. I wonder why GM and Chrysler think that it will now work.
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post #2 of 30 (permalink) Old 12-04-2008, 12:48 PM
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Only reason they "thought" it wasn't going to work was because they wanted the big money AIG treatment.
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post #3 of 30 (permalink) Old 12-04-2008, 12:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by exlude
Only reason they "thought" it wasn't going to work was because they wanted the big money AIG treatment.

Yep, also get us to pay for them to stay in business then rape us on cars over and over again. So basically business as usual. Love that we will be paying to get fucked over twice.

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post #4 of 30 (permalink) Old 12-04-2008, 12:54 PM
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I really don't think they are going to file BK . I think Uncle Obama is going to get something passed on the bail out by the time he's in office .
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post #5 of 30 (permalink) Old 12-04-2008, 12:56 PM
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if they close the doors for 1 day all bets are off ,those line workers will be making what the toyota pays . then maybe they can compete. but they have to prove they can pay this loan back.

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post #6 of 30 (permalink) Old 12-04-2008, 01:01 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by thesource
I really don't think they are going to file BK . I think Uncle Obama is going to get something passed on the bail out by the time he's in office .
I guess you have not be keeping up. They run out of money before the end of the month.
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post #7 of 30 (permalink) Old 12-04-2008, 01:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TexasDevilDog
I guess you have not be keeping up. They run out of money before the end of the month.

GM said they dont' know if they will make it New Years. Chrysler(Cerebus) won't disclose any information and nor do they have to because they are privately held. Which to me means, if you can't disclose then well go fuck yourself go under. Cerebus is a bunch of rich assholes that buy companies and shrink them to make them lean and then resell. So I could give two fucks if they lost all the money they paid to get 80% stake in chrysler.

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post #8 of 30 (permalink) Old 12-04-2008, 01:09 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by prochargedpony
GM said they dont' know if they will make it New Years. Chrysler(Cerebus) won't disclose any information and nor do they have to because they are privately held. Which to me means, if you can't disclose then well go fuck yourself go under. Cerebus is a bunch of rich assholes that buy companies and shrink them to make them lean and then resell. So I could give two fucks if they lost all the money they paid to get 80% stake in chrysler.
Thanks narrowing my post, I should have said only GM will not make it to New Years.
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post #9 of 30 (permalink) Old 12-04-2008, 01:17 PM
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I really hate to point out the obvious but maybe the bankruptcy works as long as the government money is there right after they file.
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post #10 of 30 (permalink) Old 12-04-2008, 01:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TexasDevilDog
I guess you have not be keeping up. They run out of money before the end of the month.
I've heard them say they "could" run out of money as soon as the end of December . I have not heard that they absolutely will .
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post #11 of 30 (permalink) Old 12-04-2008, 02:29 PM
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If they want the money, GM should be forced to take the pre-arranged bankruptcy. Why fund a bloated decaying corpse that doesn't know its dead.

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post #12 of 30 (permalink) Old 12-04-2008, 02:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaithis
If they want the money, GM should be forced to take the pre-arranged bankruptcy. Why fund a bloated decaying corpse that doesn't know its dead.



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post #13 of 30 (permalink) Old 12-04-2008, 02:34 PM
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I'm willing to extend them credit as long as they severely limit the influence of unions. First step is making them a viable and competitive business enterprise.
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post #14 of 30 (permalink) Old 12-04-2008, 02:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 5.0_CJ
I'm willing to extend them credit as long as they severely limit the influence of unions. First step is making them a viable and competitive business enterprise.
Agreed

UAW helped ruin Detroit
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post #15 of 30 (permalink) Old 12-04-2008, 02:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 5.0_CJ
I'm willing to extend them credit as long as they severely limit the influence of unions. First step is making them a viable and competitive business enterprise.
This should be step number one of any bailout plan concerning the automakers.

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post #16 of 30 (permalink) Old 12-04-2008, 03:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 5.0_CJ
I'm willing to extend them credit as long as they severely limit the influence of unions. First step is making them a viable and competitive business enterprise.
I agree 100% but don't see it happening with out it being forced upon them .
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post #17 of 30 (permalink) Old 12-04-2008, 04:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AL P
I really hate to point out the obvious but maybe the bankruptcy works as long as the government money is there right after they file.
I agree with that. Without help, it goes from chap 11 to chap 7 in a few months.

My only question is, what will survive? The following is speculation on my part..

Jeep - obviously that survives
Dodge - I think its the odd man out
Chrysler - Either Chrysler goes or Buick does. I can't see justification in keeping both

On the GM side

Saturn, Saab, and Hummer all go away as planned. I think Saturn will be sold to a Chinese company.

Buick - either kill Chrysler, sell it to the Chinese, or kill it off in North America only. I prefer keeping Buick.
Caddy - obviously stays
Chevy - obviously stays
GMC - It stays but I disagree with GM's reasoning
Pontiac - Stays. I'm intrigued with GM's idea to make this into a Niche brand. How about just keeping the G8 and Solstice?

As a result of a merger and Chap 11, I think GM will close down a lot of their own plants. Chrysler actually as newer manufacturing plants out there.

I think the next Gen Chrysler 300 / Dodge Charger platform can be the basis for a new large Buick and an Impala.

The Ram truck would definitely die. GM could integrate some of that manufacturing for their pickups. Dodge has a deal with Nissan to build their fullsize pickup. I see no reason why GM can't take that deal over. The Ram is a newer platform than the GMT-700, I could see GM putting out a new Silverado sooner than expected if they used the RAM platform...

The Chrysler minivans become Buick and/or Chevy products. They are guaranteed to stick around. Considering GM's improved design prowess, the next gen minivans could be pretty damn good..

Sadly, the Viper dies. I think there is a chance that GM could sell the factory and brand off to a third party (an American version of Ferrari?) There is no way GM would allow direct competition with the 'Vette...

If the Chrysler and Dodge names die, then so does the Challenger. If you've got one, you're going to have a real collector car... If Dodge goes but Chrysler stays, then the Challenger might be kept for a few years or rebadged (Barracuda?) Maybe it could be re-badged as a Pontiac for a few years since that is the niche brand...

Unless the Chrysler Pheonix engine project can walk on water, it dies. The 3.6 liter DI V6 is a damn good engine...

What do you guys think would happen...

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post #18 of 30 (permalink) Old 12-04-2008, 04:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thesource
I agree 100% but don't see it happening with out it being forced upon them .
Yea, and with Democrats controlling Congress, it isn't happening..

In fact, one of the reason I think Republicans are so against the bailout is because they don't want to help the UAW.

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post #19 of 30 (permalink) Old 12-04-2008, 05:01 PM
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Thumbs up

I like what Mr McCotter here has to say....

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post #20 of 30 (permalink) Old 12-04-2008, 05:07 PM
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Originally Posted by MattB
I like what Mr McCotter here has to say....
Those were some powerful words. I like. I don't agree with some of it but he seems to have his head on straighter than most.

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post #21 of 30 (permalink) Old 12-04-2008, 05:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sgt Beavis
Yea, and with Democrats controlling Congress, it isn't happening..

In fact, one of the reason I think Republicans are so against the bailout is because they don't want to help the UAW.
no votes for the republicans from the uaw. payback.
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post #22 of 30 (permalink) Old 12-04-2008, 05:18 PM
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Here is McCotter's site, http://mccotter.house.gov/HoR/MI11/Home/

And I hate Barney Frank. I sincerely hope that he gets a double case of AIDS and lives out his days in a vegetative state.

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post #23 of 30 (permalink) Old 12-04-2008, 05:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Sean88gt
Here is McCotter's site, http://mccotter.house.gov/HoR/MI11/Home/

And I hate Barney Frank. I sincerely hope that he gets a double case of AIDS and lives out his days in a vegetative state.

my thoughts EXACTLY. i wanna punch that fat fuck RIGHT IN THE FACE.
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post #24 of 30 (permalink) Old 12-04-2008, 05:26 PM
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Originally Posted by sc281_99-0135
my thoughts EXACTLY. i wanna punch that fat fuck RIGHT IN THE FACE.
I have dreams about his failed suicide attempts.

1/19/09, the last day of Free America.
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post #25 of 30 (permalink) Old 12-04-2008, 05:27 PM
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He makes some very valid points. Not that the idiotic masses will ever pay attention, they are too busy crying because they can't get some money from the Treasury.
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post #26 of 30 (permalink) Old 12-04-2008, 05:32 PM
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Originally Posted by AL P
He makes some very valid points. Not that the idiotic masses will ever pay attention, they are too busy crying because they can't get some money from the Treasury.
Which is why I hope for a catastrophe like a mini-ice age. Most of the dumbasses, if we're lucky, will die off. Then again, I'm being to think that fucking idiots are the cockroaches of the new millenium.

1/19/09, the last day of Free America.
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post #27 of 30 (permalink) Old 12-04-2008, 05:37 PM
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I like that guy. The thinly veiled scorn for those around him and the policys that they espouse was presented quite nicely...

Quote:
Originally Posted by MattB
I like what Mr McCotter here has to say....
Was that the mexican democratic guy from california or some such saying it was long enough without that stuff?
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post #28 of 30 (permalink) Old 12-04-2008, 05:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Fox466
I like that guy. The thinly veiled scorn for those around him and the policys that they espouse was presented quite nicely...



Was that the mexican democratic guy from california or some such saying it was long enough without that stuff?
The guy at the end saying it was long enough was Barney Frank. I loathe him but I believe all he was saying is that the meeting was already taking too long and that they needed to cut the applause short in order to save time.
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post #29 of 30 (permalink) Old 12-04-2008, 05:42 PM
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Originally Posted by AL P
The guy at the end saying it was long enough was Barney Frank. I loathe him but I believe all he was saying is that the meeting was already taking too long and that they needed to cut the applause short in order to save time.
He's still being a twat. Had then been applauding his cocksucking he would have let it go on.

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post #30 of 30 (permalink) Old 12-04-2008, 05:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Sean88gt
He's still being a twat. Had then been applauding his cocksucking he would have let it go on.
Of course, he is a flamer. I just give credit where it is due even if I think the person is an asshole.
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