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post #1 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-10-2008, 05:07 AM Thread Starter
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AIG Déjà Vu

Quote:
NEW YORK (CNNMoney.com) -- Troubled insurer American International Group got a new, $150 billion deal from the federal government on Monday, as the Federal Reserve and Treasury Department made significant changes to the terms of the company's original bailout.
http://money.cnn.com/2008/11/10/news...ion=2008111006

By my calculations of AIG balance sheet, subtracting out the government bailout amount, AIG is a zombie being supported by me and you. It is insolvent.
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post #2 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-10-2008, 05:56 AM
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..

"Today's actions send a strong signal to our policyholders, business partners and counterparties that AIG is on the road to recovery."

I'm sure the execs will expect to be paid nicely for the "recovery" that we paid for while we get pay nothing in return.
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post #3 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-10-2008, 06:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by line-em-up
"Today's actions send a strong signal to our policyholders, business partners and counterparties that AIG is on the road to recovery."

I'm sure the execs will expect to be paid nicely for the "recovery" that we paid for while we get pay nothing in return.
LMAO, I look at this as AIG didn't spend the first $150 billion correctly so now their gonna try it again

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post #4 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-10-2008, 06:58 AM
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So how much money has the gubment doled out for this "rescue?" Not just AIG, but everything in general.

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post #5 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-10-2008, 07:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Geor!
So how much money has the gubment doled out for this "rescue?" Not just AIG, but everything in general.
I've heard numbers like 4 to 5 TRILLION when you count the money from the Congress and the Fed.

Right now, I don't think we're looking at bailouts or rescues. We're looking at an out right raiding of the Treasury.

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post #6 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-10-2008, 07:06 AM
 
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It's like feeding a retarded kid.

"don't smear this on your face... damn! Ok... don't smear THIS on your face... damn!"
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post #7 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-10-2008, 07:10 AM
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Originally Posted by gpamp
It's like feeding a retarded kid.

"don't smear this on your face... damn! Ok... don't smear THIS on your face... damn!"


this is the first post i actually agree with you on.
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post #8 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-10-2008, 07:24 AM
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this is socialism for the elite class
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post #9 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-10-2008, 07:31 AM
 
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Originally Posted by sc281_99-0135
this is the first post i actually agree with you on.
It's just really hard to believe the government's doing this. They KNOW that they've deregulated them. So, they KNOW that they can do whatever they want with the money. The government is now the brother who gives his drug addict sibling money, every time they ask, thinking "maybe they won't spend THIS $100 on drugs". Sorry to use yet another analogy. But when I say it as it really happened, I get pissed, because it sounds like a bad tv show.
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post #10 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-10-2008, 07:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gpamp
It's like feeding a retarded kid.

"don't smear this on your face... damn! Ok... don't smear THIS on your face... damn!"
lmao...
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post #11 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-10-2008, 09:35 AM
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their stock went up 20 % haha i guarantee its gonna fall by the end of the day Im gonna borrow some of that junk and buy it back at a lower price at the end of the day...

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post #12 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-10-2008, 09:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gpamp
It's like feeding a retarded kid.

"don't smear this on your face... damn! Ok... don't smear THIS on your face... damn!"


LMAO! See, when you pull Obama's cocknballs out of your mouth, you might not be as bad as I had originally thought.
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post #13 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-10-2008, 09:42 AM
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i bet there is a few folks that would like to use their ceo as a fucking pinata

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post #14 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-10-2008, 11:08 AM
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The Republicans are too fucking dumb to realize that their base is incensed over the tax-funded bailout of private companies. My mind's eye sees McCain and Bush doing everything they could to get the bailout passed, and it ticks me off. And of course all the top Democrats were there too, but they are tax-and-spend nanny Democrats, that's what they do. The Reps are supposed to be the voice of financial sanity and they most certainly are NOT.

This was taxpayer dollars used to keep private investors from losing their ass, nothing more and nothing less. Nothing has been changed to make sure these companies don't get in financial trouble again. And apparently there is no end to the dollars the government is going to give them. I'm fed up with this shit.

I hear all the gloom talk about what would have happened if they didn't do the bailout, but the economy is still in the shitter and flushing fast... doesn't seem like our "$700 billion (ha ha ha)" went very far to me.


Last edited by 46Tbird; 11-10-2008 at 11:17 AM.
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post #15 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-10-2008, 12:52 PM
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If AIG fails you will see hundreds of banks that go insolvent.
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post #16 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-10-2008, 12:57 PM
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i was reading an aviation magazine over the weekend and flexjet or one of those time lease corporate jet places had an add that said "applicable with government bailout plan" or somthing of that nature. Shit i can't buy my old ass G4 yet, but the government is gonna pay for these goons to still fly around in one, give me a break.

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post #17 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-10-2008, 12:59 PM
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I wonder where they're going for vacation this time?
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post #18 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-10-2008, 03:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AL P
If AIG fails you will see hundreds of banks that go insolvent.
Okay.

So who says AIG still won't fail?

What is the limit on the dollars they receive as part of the bailout?

And what has AIG (and other companies receiving the $$) done to ensure that a similar bailout will never be necessary again?



They get American peoples' money to help them out. So now the American people are the lenders, and AIG etc are the borrowers. Where are the terms and conditions for these loans? It's like your dad stealing your piggy bank to get his alcoholic buddy a case of beer and waiting on that dumbshit to pay you back. It ain't gonna happen. Once these companies become profitable (if ever) then they will be keeping the profits to themselves again. The whole deal is chickenshit.
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post #19 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-10-2008, 03:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 46Tbird
Okay.

So who says AIG still won't fail?

What is the limit on the dollars they receive as part of the bailout?

And what has AIG (and other companies receiving the $$) done to ensure that a similar bailout will never be necessary again?



They get American peoples' money to help them out. So now the American people are the lenders, and AIG etc are the borrowers. Where are the terms and conditions for these loans? It's like your dad stealing your piggy bank to get his alcoholic buddy a case of beer and waiting on that dumbshit to pay you back. It ain't gonna happen. Once these companies become profitable (if ever) then they will be keeping the profits to themselves again. The whole deal is chickenshit.
Its bullshit but if the govt doesnt step in its gonna cause markets all over the world to nose dive like a 737 with 2 dead engines. They have over a trillion dollars in assets and 74 million clients. If they fail its gonna fuck up some shit big time!! If they were just some small bullshit company i doubt they would get help.

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post #20 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-10-2008, 04:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 46Tbird
Okay.

So who says AIG still won't fail?

What is the limit on the dollars they receive as part of the bailout?

And what has AIG (and other companies receiving the $$) done to ensure that a similar bailout will never be necessary again?



They get American peoples' money to help them out. So now the American people are the lenders, and AIG etc are the borrowers. Where are the terms and conditions for these loans? It's like your dad stealing your piggy bank to get his alcoholic buddy a case of beer and waiting on that dumbshit to pay you back. It ain't gonna happen. Once these companies become profitable (if ever) then they will be keeping the profits to themselves again. The whole deal is chickenshit.
I totally agree with everything you said.

However, banks all over the world hold credit swaps with AIG on portfolios of bad mortgages. It was a completely unregulated industry that literally had guys doing deals via AOL instant messenger. As long as AIG can hold up their end of the deal on those swaps the banks never have to write down the value of those mortgage portfolios. That's because they are "insured" against loss. The minute AIG goes down all those banks are going to have to take that loss and instantly become insolvent. That may, in turn, result in other banks going insolvent in a chain reaction. Once a bank is insolvent the FDIC takes them over. Either way it is taxpayer money.

And nobody knows how deep the rabbit hole is, AIG may need billions more next month. There are trillions of dollars of these swap contracts out there. Some people estimate a dollar value higher than the GDP of the entire world. The entire thing could still collapse too. Saying "just let it collapse" is a gamble, nothing may happen or we could be eating out of fucking trashcans. Nobody really knows.
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post #21 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-10-2008, 04:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AL P
I totally agree with everything you said.

However, banks all over the world hold credit swaps with AIG on portfolios of bad mortgages. It was a completely unregulated industry that literally had guys doing deals via AOL instant messenger. As long as AIG can hold up their end of the deal on those swaps the banks never have to write down the value of those mortgage portfolios. That's because they are "insured" against loss. The minute AIG goes down all those banks are going to have to take that loss and instantly become insolvent. That may, in turn, result in other banks going insolvent in a chain reaction. Once a bank is insolvent the FDIC takes them over. Either way it is taxpayer money.

And nobody knows how deep the rabbit hole is, AIG may need billions more next month. There are trillions of dollars of these swap contracts out there. Some people estimate a dollar value higher than the GDP of the entire world. The entire thing could still collapse too. Saying "just let it collapse" is a gamble, nothing may happen or we could be eating out of fucking trashcans. Nobody really knows.

With as much money as the govt has handed them on a silver platter, and the unkown of how much more they will need to survive, shouldn't the govt just go ahead and tell them to get fucked and deal with the consequences?


I mean, after all... This does make $340 Billion to AIG alone, right? There was the first $150, then $40, and now another $150. I mean really, when is enough enough? As a taxpayer, I fucking DEMAND every last head of upper management and every last fucking executive. Medieval, public fucking hanging style.


Too bad I'm a nobody, and it will never happen. Instead, they'll spend millions more on useless fucking vacations and retreats, while the company is run further in to the fucking ground, and everyone walks off scott fucking free.

This pisses me off to no end. The amount of irresponsibility that the Execs showed by the company getting this bad, and the amount of the same the Govt has shown by giving them billions of dollars is sickening.

Last edited by bcoop; 11-10-2008 at 04:31 PM.
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post #22 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-10-2008, 04:27 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bcoop
This pisses me off to no end. The amount of irresponsibility that the Execs showed by the company getting this bad, and the amount of the same the Govt has shown by giving them billions of dollars is sickening.
[AIG exec]We cannot fail. Give us more money. We cannot fail. Give us more money. We cannot fail. Give us more money. [/aig exec]
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post #23 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-10-2008, 04:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bcoop
With as much money as the govt has handed them on a silver platter, and the unkown of how much more they will need to survive, shouldn't the govt just go ahead and tell them to get fucked and deal with the consequences?


I mean, after all... This does make $340 Billion to AIG alone, right? There was the first $150, then $40, and now another $150. I mean really, when is enough enough? As a taxpayer, I fucking DEMAND every last head of upper management and every last fucking executive. Medieval, public fucking hanging style.


Too bad I'm a nobody, and it will never happen. Instead, they'll spend millions more on useless fucking vacations and retreats, while the company is run further in to the fucking ground, and everyone walks off scott fucking free.

This pisses me off to no end. The amount of irresponsibility that the Execs showed by the company getting this bad, and the amount of the same the Govt has shown by giving them billions of dollars is sickening.
Actually what I would like to see them do is relax the Sarbanes-Oxley requirements for writing the assets down to market value while at the same time declaring the swap contracts to be void. Maybe while easing up on the FDIC requirements for bank solvency. Then let the workouts begin on all these notes so the banks can come out with a more realistic loss.

But really, I'm not a banker and am probably talking out of my ass. I'm sure there are tons of reasons why what I said won't work at all.

The thing to remember is that none of these talking heads really have a clue as to what would happen if AIG fails. The person on the street who says "fuck them" really has no clue either and is just jumping on the populist bandwagon. Honestly I couldn't care less about what some Wall Street execs get paid. Those fuckwads will have money no matter what. I do care about what happens to me though.

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post #24 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-10-2008, 06:12 PM
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Robbery at the highest level.

They should just rob everyone of us at gunpoint. At least we would get to see the faces of these fucksticks.

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post #25 of 25 (permalink) Old 11-11-2008, 09:48 AM
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Robbery at the highest level.

They should just rob everyone of us at gunpoint. At least we would get to see the faces of these fucksticks.


I agree, but I shoot back.


I wonder if someone would actually have a case to make for tax evasion, with shit like this going on. Certainly raises an interesting point...
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