:HI Sam... me again... good points. First I want to apologize for some (not all) of that stuff I said last night, I am not sure what got into me?
Hey there Jason.
Apology accepted, and let me extend my apologies if I came on too strong with you, not for my thoughts : )
Right before I responded to you, I had just got through BUSTING and EXPOSING cantdrive55, a loudmouthed rightwinged SOB, who CLAIMED he was a Marine Veteran of 8 years.
His problem was, he elaborated TOO much, and I PROVED he was lying through his teeth. See the post at
Its towards the bottom, just do a search on that page for BUSTED. There are 2 articls. The other a RW who cant manage an intelligent thought of his own. He has to steal his post and "Copy and Paste " them here.
Anyway, I was pretty pissed when I showed up here.
:Let's start again with a few things....
:I'll start with the ones that I can answer quickly...
:My Dad's injury was not intentional as it was long before he would have been eligible for a draft. He was lived on a farm and his pistol discharged in his holster. In the side of his leg.
I grew up hunting and am an avid hunter now. Gun safety is important, and just thankfully he didnt lose his life.
:My issues with the military were not due to the military itself, but more the fact that I was 7 when he joined and it upset my enitre life, now when you live within bike riding distance of your friends and grandparents your whole life and then suddenly you are 1,200 miles away it was traumatic for me as a 7 year old to go thorugh that, I thought my life was over. To me the Army caused that and I had a mental block against it since.
I guess that could be a bad experience. Having been born in the military, I never knew any differnt till I was almost 13. We moved so often that the 3 oldest kids in my family were born on 2 different continents, and lived in 8 different states by the time I started to school. We settled down right after dad got home from Vientam. He had had his fill of the military by then. He had planned to be a career man, Vietnam changed his mind about that.
:Which Gulf War are you referring to that started before
I said first Gulf War.
:My father has served over 22 years now and including Saudi Arabia and likely Afghanistan this coming month. (Little different than a Navy stint)
Lifer huh? Well tell your dad from me, to keep his head and butt down, and come home safe. And let me make this point to you. Alot of right wingers are trying to say that if you protest this president, or this war, you dont support the troops. THAT IS A FLAT OUT LIE. I supported our invasion of Afghanastan. And I support out troops without question or reservation.
Let me explain, I see it this way, I KNOW, that a soldier goes where he is told to go, fights who he is told to fight. They dont get to make a choice. Since that is the case, I figure that they are being sent to a place that is inherintly dangerous, with people shooting at you and other such stuff. Short of it is, they are being put into harms way, and they have to protect and defend themselves so that they come home safe and sound. To that end, I dont care what they have to do to accomplish that, just do it. Do whatever it takes to get home to their loved ones as best they can.
The other issues, like the reasons this friggin lying asshole president is sending them will be dealt with. Anyway, like I said, you tell your dad for me, to do whatever he has to, to get home to you and the rest of his family.
:The info on Clinton lying about 238 things came from a source you likely wouldn't agree with (the media). As far as this stuff about Bush lying, maybe he did and does, that wasn't the issue I had with your statement. You were saying these things like there was NEVER this type of stuff going on when cuzzin Bill was there getting BJ's under the desk in the Oval office.
Now now, If Bill had been lying. so that he could send troops into an unjustified war, I would have raised just as much hell. I guarantee that. I am not owned by any party. No one tells me what to think. No one. I know what I think is right. and I do my best to stand by my beliefs.
:The job situation is a bad deal for all Americans, but you if you think back a lot of the jobs created during Clinton's administration were often times with companies that were startups of different kinds that had no real sustainable business models. As with many things like that it sometimes takes a couple of years to see that these companies don't last and when they failed, the jobs went bye bye.
True to an extent. But not 4 million jobs. Besides that, we all heard how the first Tax Cut was going to stimulate job growth. It has only gotten much worse. And there seems to be an attitude when republicans are in office, that companies can do what they want when a republcan is in office. After all, a republican is the corporations best friend, and if a company wants to screw the people, then that is fine with the president. (see ENRON)
:As far as not caring about the troops themselves...
I was basing that on what you had said.
hmmm not true as many of my friends and customers were and are in the military. The first Gulf War was pretty much while I was in HS myself and I had to get my car searched for bombs every morning before I could go to school.
Now I dont remeber a real protest against the first Gulf War, not that extended to the troops and their families. I do know that during Vietnam, there were plenty of attacks and such things against army brats then. As a matter of fact, the asshole that lives and lived across the street from my wife and her parents as she was growing up, used to call my wifes father a baby killer and such things. He didnt say it to my father in law,(he was in Vietnam) but he used to tauntmy wife and her brothers and sisters. Stupid shit, like breaking windows, flattening tires. They caught him doing several things like that. Now he was a teenager at the time, but she was only 7 or 8 and he used to slap and hit her. He wouldnt slap her now. He said something smartassed to her shortly after she and I were married and I simply explained to him that I would rip his friggin head off his shoulders and shove it up his ass. He never pushed the issue and he has never spoken to her again.
BTW, he grew up to be a BIG TIME Bush supporter.
: The reality of the dangers they face are very sobering Facts are the majority signed themselves up for duty and therefore they should have known that the possibilty of combat would be there no matter how slim it would be.
I agree. BUT, that doesnt mean that the president doesnt owe it to them and the American people,. to make a good case for the war. Especially when it is pre-emptive. And if it is ever proven beyond a reasonable doubt that he lied, then he should be held accountable for soldiers dying, when it wasnt neccesary. Would you agree?
I think the evidence is already there. And if enough people become convinced of it, he is in DEEP shit. Now there are some that you will never convince. They are EXACTLY like the democrats that still say Clinton didnt lie.
:I like you Sam... you made me think... I have to go to work now, but I'll get back to you on this...
One more point, and then I must go, I have had to stop and start 30 times since I started this. I have a Computer System in San Antonio that is acting up and I have been waiting for someone to get into the office so that they can do some hands on trouble shooting. I can do alot of things from my computer here, but I can reach out and touch components from here.
My point is this. That these people, that are so all-fired up about sending people like your dad to go fight a war, and yet they dont think it is a war worthy of them sticking their butts on the line ?
Seems like if they really believed in it, they would be willing to fight it. And then there are alot of them, that are awfully brave, just so long as it is someone else that is going into harms way..
And I cant stand a coward like that.