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post #1 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-16-2009, 12:56 PM Thread Starter
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He spoke it

So Im having a conversation with our security guard about evolution vs creationism. He is a very strict Catholic and I completely respect that. Im a middle of the road person. I do not go to church but have done some research into it. I also believe in science but find it hard to believe we are just a huge genetic mutation. Both sides are very complex.


So I try and play devils advocate to push his buttons. He claimed that evolution is absolutely absurd and that you cannot create something out of nothing. I brought up the large hadron collider project. The only thing he knows about it was what he saw on Angels and Daemons the movie. He said that the project will not ever be able to prove the big bang theory and that it is impossible. So I explain to him, if they collided enough mass to try and replicate a big bang, our planet would explode. He could not comprehend the science behind it. He was close minded and if they cant test it, then it cannot be proven.


So, my question to him was, how did our universe come about. He told me God spoke it. God said the words and a universe appeared. So I asked...God made something out of nothing. He said no, he spoke it. I asked again, so his words created something out of nothing. Again, he said no, God spoke it. Obviously we are not on the same page of spontaneous creation of a universe. I said I say pencil and nothing appears. He said it was because I am not God. I understand that God has "powers" that we do not.

I would like to understand the creationism view of how the world came about. Im assuming God (who was not a physical being) was the only person alive (was he actually alive?) and spoke his words and magic happens and the universe is created. Im not trying to say this is absurd because I find both theories kinda skeptical to begin with.

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post #2 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-16-2009, 02:36 PM
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Who would've thought a little gooey egg and some man milk could make a person? Life's fucked up like that. The universe didn't come from nothing. The big bang started with a singularity of pure energy. There's a theory that this isn't the first universe. That the universe expands and contracts. A christian might ask "where did this energy come from?" I usually just answer "where did god come from?" It's basically the same question. It just is. No beginning, no end. It just "is." I think if people would learn to accept that, a lot of time could be saved and spent doing something useful. The only difference between creationism and evolution is that creationism gives "god" or the origin of existence characteristics which is fucked up because if such a being existed, I would imagine it would be pretty hard to describe it.
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post #3 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-16-2009, 04:42 PM
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One of my personal realizations of a Creator, in human terms, lies in the fact that the "normal" state of the universe should be complete chaos and disorder. Why then does the order that we observe in our world and beyond exist at all unless a higher power has fashioned it so?
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post #4 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-16-2009, 06:24 PM
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One of my personal realizations of a Creator, in human terms, lies in the fact that the "normal" state of the universe should be complete chaos and disorder. Why then does the order that we observe in our world and beyond exist at all unless a higher power has fashioned it so?
Order huh?

http://cr4.globalspec.com/blogentry/...-by-Space-Rock

Levi-Shoemaker 9 that hit jupiter. We actually witnessed it hit. If it would've hit earth, you and I wouldn't be here today.

http://atropos.as.arizona.edu/aiz/te...ter_impact.gif

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supernova

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galactic_cannibalism

Is Earth safe?

http://skywalker.cochise.edu/wellerr...s/image005.jpg

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tunguska_event

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chicxulub_crater



Hell, we don't even have "order" on our own planet.

Tsunami that killed 225,000 people

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2004_In...ean_earthquake

F5 tornado in Oklahoma City

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4pbqGsS5iB4

Earthquakes, etc...




To say that you believe in a higher power due to the "order" of the universe is a bit naive.
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post #5 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-16-2009, 06:41 PM
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post #6 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-16-2009, 07:57 PM
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You misunderstood.

Order, as in the existence of anything that we can perceive in what we call the observable universe.

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Originally Posted by poopnut2 View Post
Order huh?

http://cr4.globalspec.com/blogentry/...-by-Space-Rock

Levi-Shoemaker 9 that hit jupiter. We actually witnessed it hit. If it would've hit earth, you and I wouldn't be here today.

http://atropos.as.arizona.edu/aiz/te...ter_impact.gif

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supernova

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galactic_cannibalism

Is Earth safe?

http://skywalker.cochise.edu/wellerr...s/image005.jpg

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tunguska_event

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chicxulub_crater



Hell, we don't even have "order" on our own planet.

Tsunami that killed 225,000 people

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2004_In...ean_earthquake

F5 tornado in Oklahoma City

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4pbqGsS5iB4

Earthquakes, etc...




To say that you believe in a higher power due to the "order" of the universe is a bit naive.
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post #7 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-16-2009, 09:12 PM
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You misunderstood.

Order, as in the existence of anything that we can perceive in what we call the observable universe.
Sorry.

What if we are some chaotic blip in the universe? Not saying we are, but being so small in such are large universe is humbling.
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post #8 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-17-2009, 10:04 AM
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Sorry.

What if we are some chaotic blip in the universe? Not saying we are, but being so small in such are large universe is humbling.

I think there is order. We have a time line....24hrs in a day, 365 days a year. We know when it is going to be winter, spring, fall. If the earths axis was off one degree, we would either freeze or burn to death. If there wasn't order, we would be floating around in space and would be dead. The way photosynthesis works so plants and life on earth can breath and have life is awsome. Now you could argue that some storms killing people is not order. But, compared to how the eath rotates perfectly around the sun for thousands of years, it is very minor.IMO As a believer, I will never worry about anything hitting the earth and killing us all. There is nothing in scripture that supports that. Even if we have threats of that happening, God will not allow it. It is against his word of how the world ends. God will give someone the wisdom of what to do to stop it, or he will stop it because I ask him too. That's how my God rolls. : )
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post #9 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-17-2009, 10:19 AM Thread Starter
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I think there is order. We have a time line....24hrs in a day, 365 days a year. We know when it is going to be winter, spring, fall. If the earths axis was off one degree, we would either freeze or burn to death. If there wasn't order, we would be floating around in space and would be dead. The way photosynthesis works so plants and life on earth can breath and have life is awsome. Now you could argue that some storms killing people is not order. But, compared to how the eath rotates perfectly around the sun for thousands of years, it is very minor.IMO As a believer, I will never worry about anything hitting the earth and killing us all. There is nothing in scripture that supports that. Even if we have threats of that happening, God will not allow it. It is against his word of how the world ends. God will give someone the wisdom of what to do to stop it, or he will stop it because I ask him too. That's how my God rolls. : )
gravity...we can prove orbit with gravity. And just so you know, the earth kinda wobbles..it is not a perfect 23.5*. Also the earth is not in a perfect orbit around the sun...this causes "global warming".
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The tilt also changes from 21 degrees to 25 degrees
and back to 21 degrees over a 41,000 year cycle; we are about in the
middle of that cycle presently.
http://www.newton.dep.anl.gov/askasci/env99/env202.htm

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post #10 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-17-2009, 10:47 AM
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how can anybody not beleive in evolution when it happens around them on a daily basis.

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post #11 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-17-2009, 11:40 AM
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I think there is order. We have a time line....24hrs in a day, 365 days a year. We know when it is going to be winter, spring, fall. If the earths axis was off one degree, we would either freeze or burn to death. If there wasn't order, we would be floating around in space and would be dead. The way photosynthesis works so plants and life on earth can breath and have life is awsome. Now you could argue that some storms killing people is not order. But, compared to how the eath rotates perfectly around the sun for thousands of years, it is very minor.IMO As a believer, I will never worry about anything hitting the earth and killing us all. There is nothing in scripture that supports that. Even if we have threats of that happening, God will not allow it. It is against his word of how the world ends. God will give someone the wisdom of what to do to stop it, or he will stop it because I ask him too. That's how my God rolls. : )
8mpg has pretty much said all that I can say. I think you might need to brush up on your physics a bit. Not only does the earth wobble as it rotates around the sun. The earth does not revolve around the sun in a perfect circle. It revolves in an elipse. Why do you think the seasons are so messed up?

About nothing in space hitting us. Click on this:
http://cr4.globalspec.com/blogentry/...-by-Space-Rock

Actually, I think you might have skipped all of my links. Ever been to the impact crater in Arizona? I have. Freaking huge. How big was the meteor? About the size of a car. We know for a fact that there are meteors hundred and hundreds of miles in diameter.

Or the tunguskan event in russia? A meteor exploded over russia demolishing miles and miles of landscape. Stronger than a nuclear bomb going off.

Or the impact that helped kill off the dinosaurs? If you think that's just a "theory" then you're hopeless.

We're all here on borrowed time and some of us might go through our entire lives without experiencing a cataclysmic event so we might think that it never happens, but when you think about our lifespans compared to that of the universe...it's a very small fraction.
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post #12 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-17-2009, 01:12 PM
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8mpg has pretty much said all that I can say. I think you might need to brush up on your physics a bit. Not only does the earth wobble as it rotates around the sun. The earth does not revolve around the sun in a perfect circle. It revolves in an elipse. Why do you think the seasons are so messed up?

About nothing in space hitting us. Click on this:
http://cr4.globalspec.com/blogentry/...-by-Space-Rock

Actually, I think you might have skipped all of my links. Ever been to the impact crater in Arizona? I have. Freaking huge. How big was the meteor? About the size of a car. We know for a fact that there are meteors hundred and hundreds of miles in diameter.

Or the tunguskan event in russia? A meteor exploded over russia demolishing miles and miles of landscape. Stronger than a nuclear bomb going off.

Or the impact that helped kill off the dinosaurs? If you think that's just a "theory" then you're hopeless.

We're all here on borrowed time and some of us might go through our entire lives without experiencing a cataclysmic event so we might think that it never happens, but when you think about our lifespans compared to that of the universe...it's a very small fraction.

I'm not saying that meteors haven't, can't or won't ever hit the earth or they won't destroy a whole country or more. I am saying, they will not take out "all" of mankind, nor will global warming. God will have his say first. I understand that the earth wobbles, and that it doesn't rotate in a perfect circle. What I am saying, is that if the earth was to get much closer or further away from the sun, we would freeze or burn up. For thousands of years their has been life on earth. That is pretty good order, if you ask me.lol
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post #13 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-17-2009, 01:21 PM
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gravity...we can prove orbit with gravity. And just so you know, the earth kinda wobbles..it is not a perfect 23.5*. Also the earth is not in a perfect orbit around the sun...this causes "global warming".


http://www.newton.dep.anl.gov/askasci/env99/env202.htm


When I say, "perfect" I mean we aren't ash or ice cubes.lol
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post #14 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-17-2009, 01:25 PM
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I'm not saying that meteors haven't, can't or won't ever hit the earth or they won't destroy a whole country or more. I am saying, they will not take out "all" of mankind, nor will global warming. God will have his say first. I understand that the earth wobbles, and that it doesn't rotate in a perfect circle. What I am saying, is that if the earth was to get much closer or further away from the sun, we would freeze or burn up. For thousands of years their has been life on earth. That is pretty good order, if you ask me.lol
More then thousands.....

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post #15 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-17-2009, 01:58 PM
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You're under the assumption that the world has only been around a few thousand years (8-10,000) I think is what people think the bible says. Things are great for now. Hell, there has been complex life on earth for millions of years. That sounds pretty "orderly." Considering the earth is arguably a few billion years old, that's pretty much nothing. Plus, life has been challenged by global events time and time again like global warming/cooling, earthquakes, supervolcanoes, and celestial objects, but it starts back up. Call it God's will or whatever, but don't think that we're safe and in the clear from the dangers of the universe.
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post #16 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-17-2009, 03:19 PM Thread Starter
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You're under the assumption that the world has only been around a few thousand years (8-10,000) I think is what people think the bible says. Things are great for now. Hell, there has been complex life on earth for millions of years. That sounds pretty "orderly." Considering the earth is arguably a few billion years old, that's pretty much nothing. Plus, life has been challenged by global events time and time again like global warming/cooling, earthquakes, supervolcanoes, and celestial objects, but it starts back up. Call it God's will or whatever, but don't think that we're safe and in the clear from the dangers of the universe.
and years back then were not calculated correctly. People before the flood were living 200-300years

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post #17 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-17-2009, 03:27 PM
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I believe in a creator... that's it...

I don't belive any of this god spoke, god farted, etc. shit...

I believe in the scientific method... I don't believe in fairy tales... I don't believe in a man in the clouds, I don't believe the world was created in 7 days, I don't believe we are the only beings in the universe, I don't belive I look like my creator, I don't believe I can comprehend my creator without injesting a lethal dose of halucinagens

but I do believe in a creator
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post #18 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-17-2009, 03:28 PM
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You're under the assumption that the world has only been around a few thousand years (8-10,000) I think is what people think the bible says. Things are great for now. Hell, there has been complex life on earth for millions of years. That sounds pretty "orderly." Considering the earth is arguably a few billion years old, that's pretty much nothing. Plus, life has been challenged by global events time and time again like global warming/cooling, earthquakes, supervolcanoes, and celestial objects, but it starts back up. Call it God's will or whatever, but don't think that we're safe and in the clear from the dangers of the universe.


I have heard the earth argued to be thousands, millions, and billons of years old. Who knows. I am as clueless as science when it comes to the age of the earth. The only difference is, they care.lol A meteor might hit me on the head and kill me while I type this. But, the whole world will not fall before Jesus returns. God is not a liar.
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post #19 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-17-2009, 03:38 PM
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I believe in a creator... that's it...

I don't belive any of this god spoke, god farted, etc. shit...

I believe in the scientific method... I don't believe in fairy tales... I don't believe in a man in the clouds, I don't believe the world was created in 7 days, I don't believe we are the only beings in the universe, I don't belive I look like my creator, I don't believe I can comprehend my creator without injesting a lethal dose of halucinagens

but I do believe in a creator


So how did you come to believe in your creator?
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post #20 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-17-2009, 03:46 PM
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So how did you come to believe in your creator?
the simplest answer is usually the correct answer...

biology and evolution is much easier to believe in than some magic man that speaks english and doesn't like brown people (that "he" also created )

I believe in the big bang theory because the science behind it is sound...

but what's behind that? the simplest answer is a creator...

I believe in the soul and an eternal existence vs. a final destination (heaven vs. hell)
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post #21 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-17-2009, 03:57 PM
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I believe that Im the 2nd Jesus and we're fucked.
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post #22 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-17-2009, 04:03 PM
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the simplest answer is usually the correct answer...

biology and evolution is much easier to believe in than some magic man that speaks english and doesn't like brown people (that "he" also created )

I believe in the big bang theory because the science behind it is sound...

but what's behind that? the simplest answer is a creator...

I believe in the soul and an eternal existence vs. a final destination (heaven vs. hell)

"a creator" When you say this are you saying it's a creator not of any religion practiced today? Or is there a certain religion?
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post #23 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-17-2009, 04:08 PM
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Plus, life has been challenged by global events time and time again like global warming/cooling, earthquakes, supervolcanoes, and celestial objects, but it starts back up.
Yep, there have been 5 or 6 major extinction events similar to the one that killed off the dinos. First life on Earth is belived to have started around 3.5 billion years ago.

History of human kind isn't even a blip on the radar of the 4.6 billion year timeline of Earth. Can really make you feel small.

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post #24 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-17-2009, 04:31 PM
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I haven't read any of the post as i'm about to leave work so i'll read them when i get home. But my thoughts actually were maybe there are like 10 "gods" "super beings" or w/e you wanna call them. Maybe god is the baby and his older brother(s) (if time exist there) said hey bet you can't make a race as smart as the races we made. He said watch me and now they're laughing at us and him. Now that is assuming there is a him. But maybe the heat is getting to me and i have way to much time to think about things while we're slow at work. carry on.....

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post #25 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-17-2009, 05:22 PM
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I believe that Im the 2nd Jesus and we're fucked.
No, we are not
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post #26 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-17-2009, 05:28 PM
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I believe that Im the 2nd Jesus and we're fucked.
What do you mean "we" grasshopper, you have mouse in pocket? lol
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post #27 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-17-2009, 06:19 PM
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and years back then were not calculated correctly. People before the flood were living 200-300years
????

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I have heard the earth argued to be thousands, millions, and billons of years old. Who knows. I am as clueless as science when it comes to the age of the earth. The only difference is, they care.lol A meteor might hit me on the head and kill me while I type this. But, the whole world will not fall before Jesus returns. God is not a liar.
Never said that God was a liar. However, people are. Assuming the bible is God's words written by man makes christians no different than muslims, buddhists, or filthy jews. Their books were all their god's word. What makes the bible the right one?
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post #28 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-17-2009, 06:26 PM
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????



Never said that God was a liar. However, people are. Assuming the bible is God's words written by man makes christians no different than muslims, buddhists, or filthy jews. Their books were all their god's word. What makes the bible the right one?
God to Jews and Christians is one and the same.
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post #29 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-17-2009, 06:28 PM
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God to Jews and Christians is one and the same.
Not necessarily when you start getting into all the goofiness that is Jesus being God and Gods son, etc...

Plus, I just wanted to say "filthy jews"
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post #30 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-17-2009, 06:30 PM
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Not necessarily when you start getting into all the goofiness that is Jesus being God and Gods son, etc...

Plus, I just wanted to say "filthy jews"
Yes, the God of the Jews and Christians is one and the same.

Actually, the Gentiles used to be known as the filthy ones......
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post #31 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-17-2009, 07:29 PM
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????



Never said that God was a liar. However, people are. Assuming the bible is God's words written by man makes christians no different than muslims, buddhists, or filthy jews. Their books were all their god's word. What makes the bible the right one?


I am not saying you called God a liar. I am just saying God put it in writing how the world ends, and a meteor destroying the earth all at once, wasn't part of it.

The Jews, Muslims, and Christians believe in the same Creator/God. But, the Muslims and Jews went different ways after Abraham. Judaism is the Old Test. The Jews believe a Messiah is coming (as stated in the Old Test.), but don't believe Jesus was the Messiah. Christians believe Jesus is the Messiah (hence the New Test.).

God blesses his people. Compare countries and their majority belief. Obviously, Christianity is Americas majority religion, and IMO we are the most blessed country in the world. I don't think too many will deny that. Isreal is primarly Judaism and it too is very blessed, it is a small fruitful country that is surrounded by a sandbox full of poverty struck Muslims. Look up the six day war when all of the surrounding countries were against little ole Isreal and Isreal lit them up....IN SIX DAYS!!!lol If that isn't the blessing of God, I don't know what is.
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post #32 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-17-2009, 07:30 PM
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"a creator" When you say this are you saying it's a creator not of any religion practiced today? Or is there a certain religion?
man created the religions practiced today... not god... and men have been killing eachother over which religion is the right one since day one
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post #33 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-17-2009, 07:41 PM
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Not necessarily when you start getting into all the goofiness that is Jesus being God and Gods son, etc...

Plus, I just wanted to say "filthy jews"
I couldn't help but snicker at the "filthy jews" comment. To understand the Jesus being God thing you just have to have a basic understanding of the difference in the Old and New Test. It took me a while before I understood. I see alot of people including Christians that don't understand. When I get time I will try and start a new thread to explain it. It might take a while since I type 5 words per minute.lol It is hard to explain things on here because you really have to be PC and explain things in great detail or people will take things out of context. Kind of like some of my earlier comments were challanged, because I wasn't thorough enough.
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post #34 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-17-2009, 07:43 PM
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man created the religions practiced today... not god... and men have been killing eachother over which religion is the right one since day one

So are you saying the creator you believe in doesn't have a religion known today?
Basically my question is what religion are you?
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post #35 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-17-2009, 07:48 PM
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man created the religions practiced today... not god... and men have been killing eachother over which religion is the right one since day one
Religion, in modern times at least, has been used as a excuse for war by despotic leaders when it furthers their purposes but is not the actual reason. For instance, what role has religion actually played in any war since the American Revolution?
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post #36 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-17-2009, 08:11 PM
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Originally Posted by Mr Majestyk View Post
Religion, in modern times at least, has been used as a excuse for war by despotic leaders when it furthers their purposes but is not the actual reason. For instance, what role has religion actually played in any war since the American Revolution?
this is a rhetorical question, right? you think suicide bombers blow themselves up for fun?
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post #37 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-17-2009, 08:13 PM
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They blow themselves up to make a name for themselves, at the urging of their aforementioned despotic leaders. My question was about wars, that is what role has religion actually played in wars since the American Revolution?
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post #38 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-17-2009, 08:13 PM
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Originally Posted by StangTamer View Post
So are you saying the creator you believe in doesn't have a religion known today?
Basically my question is what religion are you?
why would a creator "have a religion"?

I don't follow a particular scripted religion. They are flawed and divisive. I'm too intelligent to buy into that bullshit
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post #39 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-17-2009, 08:15 PM
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They blow themselves up to make a name for themselves. My question was about wars.
do they do it to make a name for themselves or do they do it because their religion promises them virgins in heaven?

religion plays a part in ANYTHING that involves religious people...
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post #40 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-17-2009, 08:17 PM
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do they do it to make a name for themselves or do they do it because their religion promises them virgins in heaven?

religion plays a part in ANYTHING that involves religious people...
They do it to make a name for themselves, same as any mass murderer in the U.S.
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post #41 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-17-2009, 08:21 PM
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They do it to make a name for themselves, same as any mass murderer in the U.S.
or Crusader in Europe?
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post #42 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-17-2009, 08:24 PM
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Are you intentionally ignoring the question of what role has religion played in wars since the American Revolution?
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post #43 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-17-2009, 08:25 PM
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meanwhile, you act as if history doesn't matter... "yeah, millions of people have been mentaly enslaved and or killed in the name of religion since the dawn of time, but that's the past... this is now... the fact that religion has always been bullshit doesn't mean it is now"

religious people are so fucking short sighted it's rediculous... god is all powerful and creates a universe with millions of galaxies in it and for some reason decides to only create intelligent life forms on one little speck of dust that we call earth?

dinosaurs? nope, never existed... god put them bones there on the 2nd or 4th day, kaint 'member which right now, but he put them thare to test are faith!!1

get the fuck out of here with that ignorant mess
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post #44 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-17-2009, 08:27 PM
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Are you intentionally ignoring the question of what role has religion played in wars since the American Revolution?
are you denying that the middle eastern zealots who have declared a holy war on the west believe that they are justified in the eyes of god?
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post #45 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-17-2009, 08:33 PM
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They are perverting Islam to further their own secular purposes. Are you too blind to see that? Since you claim religion is the motivation behind Muslim suicide bombers, quote from their Qur'an where taking the lives of non-combatants is a ticket to paradise.

And, you continue to dodge the question I posed about the role of religion in wars since the American Revolution, apparently proving you realize that you posted before thinking.
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post #46 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-17-2009, 08:39 PM
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why would a creator "have a religion"?

I don't follow a particular scripted religion. They are flawed and divisive. I'm too intelligent to buy into that bullshit

I don't understand. You say the Bible is flawed, divisive, God hates brown people, etc. But, you believe in a creator that you have no information on, and no proof at all to back up your claims.of this creator, and you call my belief bullshit?lol Wow! Forrest, I have always thought you were a pretty smart guy, but dude, you dropped the ball on this one. You said you didn't believe in fairy tales earlier, was this a misprint? I don't mean this in a bad way bro. But, it is far fetched.
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post #47 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-17-2009, 08:40 PM Thread Starter
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????



Never said that God was a liar. However, people are. Assuming the bible is God's words written by man makes christians no different than muslims, buddhists, or filthy jews. Their books were all their god's word. What makes the bible the right one?
If you look up religious timelines, you will see that Adam/Eve, their sons, Noah, etc lived to be 200-400 years old. People back then saw 5 generations of their families together. I tried to do the math and tried to find a common denominator comparing their "years" to our current...but couldnt find anything. After the flood and the whole Ark thing with Noah, people lived much shorter lives (100 years) while I believe he died at 400+ years old.

Again if we look at the religious angle of procreation, Adam and Eve had two sons. This was the beginning of mankind. 3 men and 1 woman. We dont need to be a rocket scientist to understand how people multiplied. Some defend the bible stating that during the time, women were inferior and possibly women (daughters of Eve) were not written about. That is fine but again, moms and dads grew up in the same house.

Fast forward to Noah and the Ark. God told Noah to build an ark to save all the animals of the Earth and preserve life. The story says he saved a pair of every animal and his own family. After the torrential flood, Noah procreated with his family to restart mankind.

Must have been a huge ark to hold 2 of every type of animal. Hell theres 100s of breeds of dogs let alone every species we have today. And if we simply say that there was only the "basic" animals: monkeys, lions, tigers, bears, etc, then we must believe in evolution of new species. So, it must have been a HUGE ass ark.

Noah died not to long after the flood at a ripe 400+ years old.

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post #48 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-17-2009, 08:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Majestyk View Post
They are perverting Islam to further their own secular purposes. Are you too blind to see that? Since you claim religion is the motivation behind Muslim suicide bombers, quote from their Qur'an where taking the lives of non-combatants is a ticket to paradise.

And, you continue to dodge the question I posed about the role of religion in wars since the American Revolution, apparently proving you realize that you posted before thinking.
so Islam is a perfectly acceptable religion? they're all going to heaven too?

religion has a role anywhere there are religious people... perversion of a religion still involves religion
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post #49 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-17-2009, 08:48 PM
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I don't understand. You say the Bible is flawed, divisive, God hates brown people, etc. But, you believe in a creator that you have no information on, and no proof at all to back up your claims.of this creator, and you call my belief bullshit?lol Wow! Forrest, I have always thought you were a pretty smart guy, but dude, you dropped the ball on this one. You said you didn't believe in fairy tales earlier, was this a misprint? I don't mean this in a bad way bro. But, it is far fetched.
do you have any proof of the god and religion you believe in other than that book you live your life by? LOL!
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post #50 of 107 (permalink) Old 06-17-2009, 09:08 PM
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do you have any proof of the god and religion you believe in other than that book you live your life by? LOL!

I sure do. Everything the Bible teaches has worked in my life. I have seen many miracles, my sister was raise from the dead, my dads heart was healed from a heart attack when the doctors said the lower part of his heart was dead, my grandmothers arteries in her neck had 90% blockage due to blood clots that were completely healed, and more finacial miracles than I can remeber. I can go on and on. I have a true relationship with God. It isn't just something that I know of God and read some stories about him. I truely know God. If I could explan it better, I would. I just don't know how to put it in words.
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