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Laws on shooting someone on your property??

7K views 52 replies 26 participants last post by  Scott H 
#1 ·
Last night my neighbor got robbed by two guys that came to his back door and said they were cops. They shined flashlights in his windows and demanded that he open the door. After showing a fake badge, he opened the door. They smashed his head into the wall and put a knife to his back and told him they were going to kill him.
Next thing he knew it got quiet and he turned around and ran to my house. I woke up to him banging on my door crying for help. I had him at gun point for 5 minutes or so til I realized he was telling the truth. He was in some major shock and bleeding from his nose and mouth.
I had never seen that guy before( he just moved in that day) and he freaked me out. A bloody guy pressed up against my door window at 5 AM saying "help me help me" almost got shot, but I eneded up letting him in and helped him.
This shit has happened alot in austin lately and I want to know what I can and can't do.
Anyways, I want to know what the laws are in a situation like this.
Can I shoot someone through my back door? Do they have to be inside?
I heard that if they are even in my car on my property I can shoot them?
Can I shoot them if they are in my yard?..Backyard?

Here's a link to one that happened hours earlier.
http://www.news8austin.com/content/top_stories/default.asp?ArID=178776
 
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#27 ·
So if you've been convicted of a felony, you can't protect yourself/family???? That's crazy.
 
#29 ·
Juiced 35th said:
So if you've been convicted of a felony, you can't protect yourself/family???? That's crazy.
Felons are not allowed to own a firearm.
 
#31 ·
Killing anyone is against the law, period.

What you guys are talking about are defenses to prosecution. That means the DA can still prosecute, the judge can still convene a grand jury, a grand jury can still indict, the state can still prosecute and you can in fact be found guilty of murder regardless of any logical interpretation of the law.

Sometimes its best just to feed them to the hogs.
 
#32 ·
Sounds like premeditated to me.
 
#34 ·
Denny said:
Plan on having someone break into your house? I highly doubt it.

Scott, you're right, but those chances would be VERY slim for an incident meeting the criteria. I'll take my chances convincing 1 out of 12 than to bury a loved one.
I was just being my usual stupid self Dennis. It does seem as if the thread starter is just looking for an excuse to shoot someone though.
 
#36 ·
Actualy a felon can protect themselves. I would refer back to the penal code again. A felon that been off "paper" or his conviction by final disposition is five years or older can keep a firearm at his residence. NO WHERE ELSE. It is in black and white printed there.

I have seen a person killed on a front porch before and the "defendant" not indicted. It was ruled self defense. So the "perp" does not have to be inside your residence. It is about being in fear of your life.

Anytime you shoot any person, there will be a civil lawsuit. Promise, there are lawyers that watch the news and live for times like that.

Eric
 
#38 ·
RoadW3@aol.com said:
Actualy a felon can protect themselves. I would refer back to the penal code again. A felon that been off "paper" or his conviction by final disposition is five years or older can keep a firearm at his residence. NO WHERE ELSE. It is in black and white printed there.

I have seen a person killed on a front porch before and the "defendant" not indicted. It was ruled self defense. So the "perp" does not have to be inside your residence. It is about being in fear of your life.

Anytime you shoot any person, there will be a civil lawsuit. Promise, there are lawyers that watch the news and live for times like that.

Eric
Right, but that's why this bill is such a big deal. It's like no being able to be sued for trying to render aid under the Good Sumaritan Law. And once again, a felon can defend himself/herself, but won't be exempt under the Castle Doctrine.
 
#41 ·
RoadW3@aol.com said:
Actualy a felon can protect themselves. I would refer back to the penal code again. A felon that been off "paper" or his conviction by final disposition is five years or older can keep a firearm at his residence. NO WHERE ELSE. It is in black and white printed there.
Federal law says otherwise.
http://assembler.law.cornell.edu/uscode/html/uscode18/usc_sec_18_00000922----000-.html said:
(g) It shall be unlawful for any person—
(1) who has been convicted in any court of, a crime punishable by imprisonment for a term exceeding one year;
(2) who is a fugitive from justice;
(3) who is an unlawful user of or addicted to any controlled substance (as defined in section 102 of the Controlled Substances Act (21 U.S.C. 802));
(4) who has been adjudicated as a mental defective or who has been committed to a mental institution;
(5) who, being an alien—
(A) is illegally or unlawfully in the United States; or
(B) except as provided in subsection (y)(2), has been admitted to the United States under a nonimmigrant visa (as that term is defined in section 101(a)(26) of the Immigration and Nationality Act (8 U.S.C. 1101 (a)(26)));
(6) who has been discharged from the Armed Forces under dishonorable conditions;
(7) who, having been a citizen of the United States, has renounced his citizenship;
(8) who is subject to a court order that—
(A) was issued after a hearing of which such person received actual notice, and at which such person had an opportunity to participate;
(B) restrains such person from harassing, stalking, or threatening an intimate partner of such person or child of such intimate partner or person, or engaging in other conduct that would place an intimate partner in reasonable fear of bodily injury to the partner or child; and
(C)
(i) includes a finding that such person represents a credible threat to the physical safety of such intimate partner or child; or
(ii) by its terms explicitly prohibits the use, attempted use, or threatened use of physical force against such intimate partner or child that would reasonably be expected to cause bodily injury; or
(9) who has been convicted in any court of a misdemeanor crime of domestic violence,
to ship or transport in interstate or foreign commerce, or possess in or affecting commerce, any firearm or ammunition; or to receive any firearm or ammunition which has been shipped or transported in interstate or foreign commerce.
 
#43 ·
Denny said:
Plan on having someone break into your house? I highly doubt it.

Scott, you're right, but those chances would be VERY slim for an incident meeting the criteria. I'll take my chances convincing 1 out of 12 than to bury a loved one.
Oh definitely, I just thought I would make it clear that the law is the law, and what everybody thinks is legal is really just a defense.

If I am on a jury and you killed a thief, I would let you walk even if you held the bastard captive and tortured him for years. Even if it were my kid. I simply hate thieves.
 
#44 · (Edited)
Denny said:
The domicile isn't listed, though.
As it was explained to me that states in legalese that they are not allowed to posses a firearm or ammunition in any way and it is indefinete, there is no term in which they regain their Right to Bare Arms.

Here it is broke down to normal speak. I thought I found a loophole being that if the gun was produced in the state a felon could posses it as long as it had not crossed a state line but this pretty much sums it up.
http://www.hwylaw.com/CM/Articles/Articles88.asp#N_3_ said:
3. 8 U.S.C. §922(g)(1) provides that it is unlawful for any person "who has been convicted in any court of a crime punishable by imprisonment for a term exceeding one year . . . to possess . . . any firearm or ammunition."
 
#46 ·
18 USC 922(g)(1) without the spaces, dots, etc.

It shall be unlawful for any person who has been convicted in any court of, a crime punishable by imprisonment for a term exceeding one year to ship or transport in interstate or foreign commerce, or possess in or affecting commerce, any firearm or ammunition; or to receive any firearm or ammunition which has been shipped or transported in interstate or foreign commerce.


A domicile isn't in or affecting commerce.
 
#47 · (Edited)
To the thread starter, as I understand the law as it sits at this moment, you have a "duty" to retreat, if possible, from your house unless there are others in the house with you that cannot retreat(such as children or a spouse in a room seperate from you, or you are upstairs, etc...)
If you feel your life is threatened then you can use deadly force(if you make your presence known and he does anything you deem as threatening)
If he turns and runs he is not threatening you and you will get it in the butt if you kill him! for now atleast
Outside of the house you're not going to get away with shooting someone over theft unless you confront them and you feel your life is in danger .

The Castle Doctrine, as I understand it so far, states that you will no longer have a duty to retreat from a thief in your house, your car, or your business; Meaning you can use deadly force before your life has been threatened to stop the burglary/ensure your safety. Also I believe as far as a car is concerned it's referring to you being in the car i.e. you are getting car-jacked. I'm not sure how it will affect a car in the driveway.
It also states, as I understand it, that you will be protected from civil suits brought on by family members of perps, or perps themselves if you shoot them.
 
#48 ·
if you shoot and kill someone for peeking in your window, a jury will most likely BURY you. there has to be some type of proof that you were indeed fearing for your life. a good example was someone kicking in your door. hardest thing to do in court would be proving that they were trying to cause you harm. if your door was broken down, there's your proof. some dude peaking in your window? duck tape your asshole because you're going to jail.
 
#49 ·
Actually, there are a few ways of working around it. The law is brilliant in that it is built with loopholes and such. That's the reason I went to law school. They're right though, someone in your home? Clean slate, shoot.

Someone stealing you're stuff AT NIGHT? You can still technically shoot.

The thing is, you have to live with shooting someone. As someone who has taken lives in the line of duty, you do pay a hard price for pulling that trigger. One that you will deal with the rest of your life.
 
#50 ·
1991vert is full of all kinds of bad advise lol.....

i didn't read the entire thread but to your original question yes you can shoot them through a backdoor ect. like others were saying if there is a fear of serious bodily injury. At night if they are stealing your property and you fear your not ever gunna get it back bust a cap in their bitch ass. Techniqually you can shoot and kill someone for toilet papering your house at night. Not that i'd recommend it but its ok as far as the penal code goes. And as someone else stated no matter what your going to end up going to court for any shooting you do. It doesn't matter if the person is inside raping your s.o. with a knife to their throat if you kill them your still going to have to see if you get no billed. There's an old saying that is a good one in this type of stuff when it comes to fear for your life. Better to be judged by 12 then carried by 6.
 
#51 ·
forever_frost said:
Actually, there are a few ways of working around it. The law is brilliant in that it is built with loopholes and such. That's the reason I went to law school. They're right though, someone in your home? Clean slate, shoot.

Someone stealing you're stuff AT NIGHT? You can still technically shoot.

The thing is, you have to live with shooting someone. As someone who has taken lives in the line of duty, you do pay a hard price for pulling that trigger. One that you will deal with the rest of your life.
That's how I understood it.
Goef: Im dbl checking the laws because of the situation I was in. I don't see how you got that Im looking for a reason to shoot someone...oh wait your probably just being your usual stupid self.
The guy at my door could have very well been planning a home invasion robbery with others hiding against the walls of my house or who knows what.
There has been alot of these home invasions here lately too. I just want to know the legalities of this shit.
 
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