Wild Bill vs. HPP

[BigShoe]

WTF?
http://www.dfwss.org/smf/index.php?topic=7519.0

[silvercobra03]

I am not a member what did it say?

[BigShoe]

I am not a member what did it say?
Fuck I forgot about that.

[Baron]

I am not a member what did it say?
http://www.dfwstangs.net/forums/showthread.php?t=349349

[BigShoe]

HPP RACING HAS MY CAR AND WILL NOT RELEASE IT!


I never in my wildest dreams would have thought that I would be facing this problem!

I ran small HPP RACING logos from 2003 to the end of 2004 at local races. In the end of 2004, I entered my first Fun Ford Weekend event. In 2005 I ran the entire Fun Ford Weekend series with the same logos on the car, but with large logos on my race trailer and ended up #7 in the Top 10 Eliminator Club of ModMotor. 2006 was a smaller racing schedule, but with full door HPP RACING logos on my car. I won the quickest MACH1 on the Mach1/Bullitt Shootout in 2005 and 2006. All this time promoting HPP RACING and sending them many customers.


After being a longstanding and dedicated customer since July 2003,Manny Alverez, the owner of HPP RACING, and I entered into a verbal agreement for a limited sponsorship in the end of 2006. They were to sell me parts at cost and no labor charge on my car. My job was to promote and race nation wide and locally with their new twin turbo kit on my 03 Mach1 with their logo on my doors, front and rear. This was after the repeated urging and offering of the sponsorship by Manny Alverez, one owner of HPP RACING.


I began promoting this turbo kit on numerous websites and at racing events in June 2006, because I was extremely impressed with the kit.


I gave HPP Racing $8,000 to start with the project. As soon as they removed the engine and transmission, I sold a few parts off the car that were not going to be used in the project for a total of $2960. This was before any parts were ordered or engine sent to the builder.


Early 2007, I began to "hang out" at the HPP RACING shop and then began performing various tasks. These were done at much reduced rate as my way of repaying back HPP RACING for the deal with parts and labor. A great deal of these tasks were not charged a dime to HPP RACING , such as metro-plex parts runs, taking customer cars to the alignment shops taking customer's cars and the shop race car to the track for test N Tune, polishing all Manny's a aluminum engine and some of the race car parts. Again a way for me to "pay them back".


All the labor intensive jobs were charged at a discounted rate. Long distance parts runs out of the Dallas/Ft Worth metro area were charged only actual fuel costs. Customer car pick-up and deliveries were charged actual fuel costs and very small discounted pay. In every time, HPP Racing make money off my work, but that's just good business.

This work amounted to another $6500. This is figure low for the simple fact that I had to keep hounding HPP RACING to credit my account with work performed. I know that I lost from $600 to $900 worth of credits not placed on my account, but I have no actual proof. It took well over a month for one credit to make it to my account, yet any buffing or polishing supplies were added to my bill immediately.

Over $900 that was paid to Manny Alverez, by a young man as partial payment on a 92 mustang that I sold the young man has yet to be credited to my account. With that credit to my account, I SHOULD have just over $18,360 as payments and credits to my bill and that does NOT contain the $600-900 of lost credits.

Even with ALL my parts being taxable (and all of them aren't), my bill with taxes should be $18,202 if HPP honored our original agreement.


The ONLY reason I'm picking up my car from HPP, is that my nephew that has very chronic Crohn's Disease and now has colon cancer. I'm the only one that can go out the Phoenix to help him and his immediate family through their time of need. He's the sole bread winner and is now on temporary disability. He has to have surgery for his Crones and we don't know the exact extent of the cancer but it was evident that it is extensive by the GI test. I have people to help my Mom here in Texas and she want me to go help him. The only way I can help him is go out to live with them and find a way to help support them finically, moral support and assist in my nephew's care during his recovery. At best this will take a minimum of 6 months and will surely be longer. As soon as my friend found out my situation with my nephew, he offered his shop for storage of my car and offered full use of his shop and tools. I was going to do my best to finish my car and STILL honor my agreement with HPP and continue to promote their twin turbo kit.

This brings us to the crux of my problem. HPP RACING will NOT release my car nor honor our agreement. They jacked up all my prices, still will not adjust a disputed $600 charge to me on a busted sale of parts for one of their techs that I was just trying to help him sell his parts, yet I'm responsible for a part that was shipped back and I don't even have the part that was taken back by the tech and sold. HPP RACING, namely OZZIE ALVEREZ, would NOT recover the credit to the tech, yet he BILLED my account. I offered to pay for the shipping for the part, yet they want me to pay for the whole amount.


I gave HPP RACING a discount in all the work I performed for them, yet they feel it ok to dishonor our agreement and jack up my bill. I don't think that's very fair.

I tried to be MORE than fair yesterday when I went to recover my car and parts. After being TOTALLY blindsided with the escalated bill and totally lack of flexibility in trying to work with me.



After roughly 7 months of working with HPP RACING, I was getting a bit burnt out and started to not feel very well. I picked up all my polishing gear along with many pieces to buff and polish. With in 2 days I was in the hospital with a severe kidney infection. I had a reaction to the initial round of IV antibiotics and almost died. It's taken almost 6 weeks to recover. I still finished my pieces of work from HPP, just as I got news of my nephew's predicament. I feel and have been told by several people at HPP RACING, that Manny and Ozzie think I've had a falling out with them during this time. This can't be further from the truth. Even from my hospital bed, I still tried to support HPP RACING by referring people by phone and the internet. It's only when coming back and informing them of my predicament and what I feel I had no choose in the matter and the owners of HPP RACING telling me that something has changed in my loyalty to them.
After yesterday, my attitude has change as I fell anyone's would. I feel like I've been stabbed in the back. I thought I had friends in Manny and Ozzie. I've gone beyond the normal business relationship. I've has Manny's back when we went to recover a car from a customer that defrauded them. The customer had hidden the car with one of his friends over 60 miles from the shop. This friend had a gun in his pants and I made sure that I had Manny covered with protection. That's just one of the things that come to mind.

I'm totally at wits end. I've lost what I thought were two good friends. I don't have my car. And I still have to go help my nephew.

[BigShoe]

http://www.dfwstangs.net/forums/showthread.php?t=349349
Oh hell I hardly go in the Back porch. Just thought I would get us going for the weekend

[built2layframe]

I feel bad for bill, he did nutswing like A mofo for them... I'm sure The best Thing for his Car would be to get it out of that shop anyways.

[silvercobra03]

Thanks for posting that 2foggers.

"Everything in writing"

[Baron]

I feel bad for bill, he did nutswing like A mofo for them... I'm sure The best Thing for his Car would be to get it out of that shop anyways.
HPP had an interesting predicament with ol bill. His mouth was always going 110%, and he got worse the farther into HPP's pockets he got.

Something like this was bound to occur, bill was "paying" HPP to build the fastest bla bla bla best bla bla bla red bla bla bla car out there. HPP was getting support from Bill, and would see some advertising out of the deal. What do you think the outcome would be if the car broke, or performed poorly? Would Bill blame himself for the loss? I doubt it, he has too much pride. It would all boil down to bill and HPP going at each other's throats. Bill would start mouthing, again, and there would e some sort of falling out at that point.

[Juiced4V]

:eek: lost for words

[mustangguy289]

Ive always felt the HPP was a little shady. Ive never used them and probably never will.

[silvercobra03]

Ive always felt the HPP was a little shady. Ive never used them and probably never will.

Just curious why is that I have never used them but would like to know for the future?

[grove rat]

here is wade @ hpp's response:

Bill,

We did have a good working agreement until it came time to pay your bill. You gave us a total of $8,000 to perform a job which at retail would have exceeded $50,000 to any other customer. We started the job with no money upfront, and after you yelled at me excessively, you bring a $4,000 check. 3 months later, after your Turbo Kit was complete along with your motor, you yelled at me again and brought another $4,000. The last payment was over 5 months ago and to keep the work going, payments EVEN AT COST have to be made for work to be completed. Ask any customer on any big job, deposits are needed, payments are made throughout the progress of the car, and upon pickup. You didn't keep up with any payments, although I asked over and over again.

Granted, there is plenty of work and credits you received for polishing, towing, and other work you performed. The agreement was to receive the parts at cost and get a heavily discounted labor rate, because lets face it, we still have to pay the technicians. We still have a business to operate and if we gave every customer cost, and did all the labor for free, we would not have been a successful business for almost 10 years. If we were even THOUGHT of as thieves, we would not be operating. We are not trying to take your car, we're just trying to receive what is rightfully ours. Money that is out on parts you ordered and you wanted on your car. It's just that simple.

I'm sorry for your hard times, I'm sorry about your family issues, but at the same time we did not break the agreement off. What was discussed is not what went down. The agreement was for you to race the car around the country, when you decided to take your car, you broke that agreement.

As far as you were concerned, we were no longer doing the work, and you were no longer associated with HPP. So if we weren't doing the work and you weren't racing for us, how could we sell the parts at cost. Not only have we been out the thousands and thousands of dollars for months, we have been out our time and labor as well. Not only what we paid the technicians, but the people we pay to order the parts, the machine work for your motor, the head porting, the billet cams, the hardware, the turbo kit, the full cage, the kirkey seats, through the floor subframes, the weldon fuel system (that we took back), and other items just sitting here. All these parts equate to money out of HPP's account. Just floating parts without payment. We ordered these in good faith that you would uphold your end of the agreement, but you wouldn't even pay COST. Without the labor involved, that Ozzie, Manny, and myself have told you was not free, you wouldn't even attempt to square up on parts that were here. If it was a money issue all along, we should have known about it from the get go. You wanted a fast mod motor, we can provide it, but going fast is ANYTHING but cheap.

As far as your services go, you named your price and we paid. Either by putting it on your credits or giving you cash. You did charge fuel cost, but we paid you EXACTLY what you asked for including your towing charge in addition to the fuel. Im not saying you shouldn't get paid for work you perform, but thats all we're asking for. Just pay for the work we've done and the parts you ordered. Plain and simple.

I recall one Fun Ford where you said you didn't have any cash and Manny pulled $200 out of his pocket and handed it to you no questions asked. We did have a good working relationship and it boils down to this:

You wanted a product but unwilling to pay for product and services.

After breach of the "verbal agreement" we had no choice but to mark the parts up 10%. If you would have kept your end, we could and would have kept ours.

-Wade

[silvercobra03]

So this Bill guy has paid them around 16,000 and worked up there for some time how much more does he owe to HPP?

[Baron]

So this Bill guy has paid them around 16,000 and worked up there for some time how much more does he owe to HPP?
$50k - $16k = $34k


I think that bill has only paid about $8k to them.

[Cammin4V]

Ive always felt the HPP was a little shady. Ive never used them and probably never will.
same way. i learned my lesson a long time ago...

ill stick to doing most of the work myself, and buying parts and extra labor from trusted people.

[mustangguy289]

Just curious why is that I have never used them but would like to know for the future?
Just from reading the complaints..... i think there head(ego) has grown too big. Just my opinion.

[silvercobra03]

$50k - $16k = $34k


I think that bill has only paid about $8k to them.


hahaha he only paid 8k and and owes 42k and wants the car back hahaha this guy is funny

[mustangguy289]

same way. i learned my lesson a long time ago...

ill stick to doing most of the work myself, and buying parts and extra labor from trusted people.
Besides ourself... Slims mustang performance is the only shop that touches any of our stangs.

[silvercobra03]

Just from reading the complaints..... i think there head(ego) has grown too big. Just my opinion.


Who Manny?

[mustangguy289]

Who Manny?
You apparently know no history of this sight and the different complaints that have arisen from this shop.

[Baron]

hahaha he only paid 8k and and owes 42k and wants the car back hahaha this guy is funny
Oh, he doesn't have a completed car either. I would be willing to bet that he only owes a couple of grand.

[silvercobra03]

You apparently know no history of this sight and the different complaints that have arisen from this shop.


Wow I must have not seen or read alot of stuff that happen good to know thanks for the info :D

[silvercobra03]

Oh, he doesn't have a completed car either. I would be willing to bet that he only owes a couple of grand.


So they want 42k and the car is not done WTF :confused:

[Lason]

hahaha he only paid 8k and and owes 42k and wants the car back hahaha this guy is funny


Actually if you read everything so far instead of ASSUMING shit then you will see that your figure is completely wrong. HPP says he paid $16k, not 8K. Also if you see the work Wade spoke about, it is not $50k so I would think that figure is padded pretty good. Aolso Bill has said, and Wade agreed that Bill did work to pay off some debt.


Soooooooooooooo, all in all who knows except Bill and HPP how much is owed and being that its all verbal its all hear say anyway.........

BTW, Im completely unbiased. I know Bill as well as I know Manny/Ozzie/Wade which is not well at all.

Gearheads FTW!!! :eek: :D

[Ylw 98~~SNAKE~~]

That sounded like a bad situation to start with. GET IT IN WRITING!!!!! Now its a big clusterfuck nobody knows how much anybody owes everybody's pissed off. Good luck with that moral of the story if you want your car worked on dont try to work fo0r the shop so you can get it done for cheap cause it doesnt work.

[mustangguy289]

So they want 42k and the car is not done WTF :confused:
Good lord please try reading.

[silvercobra03]

Actually if you read everything so far instead of ASSUMING shit then you will see that your figure is completely wrong. HPP says he paid $16k, not 8K. Also if you see the work Wade spoke about, it is not $50k so I would think that figure is padded pretty good. Aolso Bill has said, and Wade agreed that Bill did work to pay off some debt.


Soooooooooooooo, all in all who knows except Bill and HPP how much is owed and being that its all verbal its all hear say anyway.........

BTW, Im completely unbiased. I know Bill as well as I know Manny/Ozzie/Wade which is not well at all.

Gearheads FTW!!! :eek: :D


Hey thanks for the heads up let me suggest you look up a couple of posts I asked if that was correct about the 16000???

[silvercobra03]

$50k - $16k = $34k


I think that bill has only paid about $8k to them.


Hey you 2 this is were I got the 42k baron said he thought he only paid 8k so take it easy on me I did not say I know whats going on thats why I am ASKING jeez

[Baron]

Actually if you read everything so far instead of ASSUMING shit then you will see that your figure is completely wrong. HPP says he paid $16k, not 8K. Also if you see the work Wade spoke about, it is not $50k so I would think that figure is padded pretty good. Aolso Bill has said, and Wade agreed that Bill did work to pay off some debt.


Soooooooooooooo, all in all who knows except Bill and HPP how much is owed and being that its all verbal its all hear say anyway.........

BTW, Im completely unbiased. I know Bill as well as I know Manny/Ozzie/Wade which is not well at all.

Gearheads FTW!!! :eek: :D

We did have a good working agreement until it came time to pay your bill. You gave us a total of $8,000 to perform a job which at retail would have exceeded $50,000 to any other customer. We started the job with no money upfront, and after you yelled at me excessively, you bring a $4,000 check. 3 months later, after your Turbo Kit was complete along with your motor, you yelled at me again and brought another $4,000. The last payment was over 5 months ago and to keep the work going, payments EVEN AT COST have to be made for work to be completed. Ask any customer on any big job, deposits are needed, payments are made throughout the progress of the car, and upon pickup. You didn't keep up with any payments, although I asked over and over again.


I have no idea how much $ changed hand, or what work was done, but it looks like Bill paid $8k in two payments of $4k.

[Lason]

I have no idea how much $ changed hand, or what work was done, but it looks like Bill paid $8k in two payments of $4k.


Well then my bad, I guess I misread it. Like I said though, I still think personally the $50k is HEAVILY padded and Bill and Wade both agreed Bill did other work to pay it off also. Like mentioned above this is just a big ole clusterfuck and while I think Bill fucked up not getting it in writing, what about HPP? They are the shop that should know better.

[silvercobra03]

Well then my bad, I guess I misread it.


:eek:

[mikeb]

The main issue here is that nothing was put into writing on a "$50k" deal. Now all that is left is finger pointing and lawsuits. Clearly both sides had differing expectations on what their duties and deliverables were in their agreement. I can see no good ending to this situation; someone is going to feel screwed in the end. I have a few other thoughts that i'll just keep to myself about this situation and the players therein.

[White_lightning]

just FYI.. in texas.. if any propertey or service offering is valued at over $500.. a verbal agreement can not be use.. it HAS to be writen for it to be binding.

[MR TINFOIL HAT]

Ive always felt the HPP was a little shady. Ive never used them and probably never will.
They're not even close to shady. They have gone out of their way several times to help me out, and a whole bunch of other people. It's a business, not a charity.

[TexasCobra97]

Besides ourself... Slims mustang performance is the only shop that touches any of our stangs.

I believe in the automotive industry you are not going to please everyone..I recall talking to slim asking if he could rebuild my tranny...I never heard a word after i called...

Ive dealt with manny,ozzie,wade,adler,red,brandon,and i have nothing but positive things to say...Yeah im impatient and wish they were faster sometimes..But They have always came through for me...I understand hard times fall on families, but life goes on and so does business...

[dan03mach]

Should have taken it to GearHeads!!! :D

[FRANCISCO308]

They're not even close to shady. They have gone out of their way several times to help me out, and a whole bunch of other people. It's a business, not a charity.
x2

[mustangguy289]

Should have taken it to GearHeads!!! :D
lol

[Cody B]

Ive always felt the HPP was a little shady. Ive never used them and probably never will.

Just an fyi.. This may be construde as slander and they WILL NOT STAND FOR IT!!!!

[PWTRTXSS]

Just an fyi.. This may be construde as slander and they WILL NOT STAND FOR IT!!!!

Construed. Written defamation is libel and oral defamation is slander. The person claiming they have been libeled or slandered has to be able to prove that what was claimed about them isn't true.

Looks like HPP will be standing for it.

[SVT Lurch]

I hope they get it worked out. :(

[BP]

Just an fyi.. This may be construde as slander and they WILL NOT STAND FOR IT!!!!

He said that he felt they were shady, not that they were. If in fact he said they were shady and somehow they could prove they weren't then someone might have a case.

[Cooter]

ok, I forced myself to read the entire thread at SVT Performance (GOD that board sucks ass)

as near as I can tell, the bottom line at this point is $2,000. and even at that Bill is receiving discounted parts and labor rate...

$2,000?! I thought he was a fuckin west Texas oil baron :confused:

[Cooter]

Just an fyi.. This may be construde as slander and they WILL NOT STAND FOR IT!!!!

actually, it may not

[PWTRTXSS]

I believe in the automotive industry you are not going to please everyone..I recall talking to slim asking if he could rebuild my tranny...I never heard a word after i called...

Ive dealt with manny,ozzie,wade,adler,red,brandon,and i have nothing but positive things to say...Yeah im impatient and wish they were faster sometimes..But They have always came through for me...I understand hard times fall on families, but life goes on and so does business...

I don't know if I would compare a guy you don't know not calling you back to a shop you have been loyal to for years "adjusting" prices after the fact, calling you a liar and not releasing your car with no paperwork to back anything up.

[foggedpacecar]

i was told his bill is $20650 for a car in pieces that is crazy no matter how you put it its no 25.5 car or anything if thats true sounds like hpp is trying to cash in on the whole deal and thats after the money already paid wow!!!! :eek:

[Lason]

I will not tolarate all the wrongful slander, there are laws for that kinda stuff. Just like there are for the situation. If he chooses to slander our name then we will take all the legal action we can. Which would make it way worse for him.

OH NOES!!!! Someone said we kept their car, lets sue them for talking shit on the internet! :rolleyes:

Sorry I got nothing against HPP but start throwing out shit like slander and all I think about is Al Sharpton coming in and raising cane for calling HPP stupid, lol.

[spankustang]

I hope this works out for everybody!
My own personal experience with HPP has been nothing but exceptional.

[Cody B]

OH NOES!!!! Someone said we kept their car, lets sue them for talking shit on the internet! :rolleyes:

Sorry I got nothing against HPP but start throwing out shit like slander and all I think about is Al Sharpton coming in and raising cane for calling HPP stupid, lol.

LOL :D

[wayne fontenot]

i'd get that car as quick as possible because hpp is "shady" enough to file a mechanics lean and keep the car.

[32VfromHell]

I like both Bill and Ozzie, Wade, and Manny at HPP. I think a good point is brought up that all that labor on the car was supposed to be "paid" back by performance on the track and getting that kit out there for all to see and the future business it would bring. When the deal felt compromised, i can understand the guys at HPP wanting a return on their investment.

At the same time, Bill's situation sucks, its exactly the right recipe to create a disaster for him with a family emergency and a trip to the hospital. I would like to say both parties can come to some kind of resolution as i can tell you from personal experience Manny and Ozzie are one of the most flexible and accomidating guys in the business.

[manny]

A lot of you guys are talking about something you know nothing about. All the trash talking that he is doing and lieing is wrong, uncalled for, and will only make matters worse.
It all comes down to he doesn't have the money to finish what he started. He wanted to build an 8 sec. car, do some of you talking shit know what it takes to build an 8 sec. car. He was building off of another car we did for a guy. A car that was brought to us as a stock 01 cobra motor. The guy said I want to go 8's, never even been down a track. He now runs 5.5's in the 1/8th like nothing. You think you can build that for 20k???? That is the guy that spent 50k, he paid for it, and got what he wanted.
Bill talked a big game about all this oil he was going to be cashing in on. Which is the only reason 20-30k in parts were ordered for him. Everyone here knows how long bills car has been down. How many cars have been completed with similar setups, a ton. The problem with Bill is he did not have the money to finish his project. Not even with parts at cost.
We have had 20-30k out on this car for a year now. He only paid 8k out of his pocket. The rest he was trying to work off by polishing one turbo at a time. How many shops would let you do this? He made over 7k in credits towards his bill in transporting cars for us and polishing turbo's. He named his price and was paid. Sometimes even a little more to give him the oppurtunity to make credits for his bill.
We had a talk in early Dec., where we expressed to him that we needed for him to start making payments towards his bill. We have had to much money out to long, specially in a case where you are giving cost.
He got all mad, we talked about it some more, then he said all was cool. He waited for everyone to leave, took all his belongings and left. Nobody heard from him till just the other day. I tried calling him before christmas and new year with no answer or returned call.
Now all of sudden he shows up and says he is aborting the project and taking his car. He says to just take everything he still owes for off his bill. Stuff that has been special ordered for him and paid for.
At this point I removed as much as I could, close to 7k in parts. However I did change the price from cost to 10% over cost. Which is still a good deal. Why should we have to give cost on parts that were ordered a year ago and sitting around.
After all of this he was just going to owe another 2k to take all of his parts. Instead he chose to bash us, if we were going to have take all this BS. I should have raised it to retail. I don't owe him anything, he got paid for what he did and got plenty of other benefits.
I will give him his parts and car as soon as he pays for them.

[fordracing19]

When we had problems with Hpp Bill was first to defend them. I think Manny is an ok guy. I could care less for Ozzie and Wade. I will never take a car back to HPP.

[mustangguy289]

When we had problems with Hpp Bill was first to defend them. I think Manny is an ok guy. I could care less for Ozzie and Wade. I will never take a car back to HPP.
Watch out they may sue u too.

[silvercobra03]

Wow I must have missed alot of stuff with HPP :confused:

[mustangguy289]

Wow I must have missed alot of stuff with HPP :confused:
Yea but i like u more since u changed ur avatar

[silvercobra03]

Yea but i like u more since u changed ur avatar


haha I aim to please vote for me in 08 best avatar :D

[Cody B]

When we had problems with Hpp Bill was first to defend them. I think Manny is an ok guy. I could care less for Ozzie and Wade. I will never take a car back to HPP.


I know a couple of people who said they would have went to HPP if it were not for these 2. They say manny is pretty reasonable and he knows what he is talking about but they say the other 2 are just dicks.

[Baron]

A lot of you guys are talking about something you know nothing about. All the trash talking that he is doing and lieing is wrong, uncalled for, and will only make matters worse.
It all comes down to he doesn't have the money to finish what he started. He wanted to build an 8 sec. car, do some of you talking shit know what it takes to build an 8 sec. car. He was building off of another car we did for a guy. A car that was brought to us as a stock 01 cobra motor. The guy said I want to go 8's, never even been down a track. He now runs 5.5's in the 1/8th like nothing. You think you can build that for 20k???? That is the guy that spent 50k, he paid for it, and got what he wanted.
Bill talked a big game about all this oil he was going to be cashing in on. Which is the only reason 20-30k in parts were ordered for him. Everyone here knows how long bills car has been down. How many cars have been completed with similar setups, a ton. The problem with Bill is he did not have the money to finish his project. Not even with parts at cost.
We have had 20-30k out on this car for a year now. He only paid 8k out of his pocket. The rest he was trying to work off by polishing one turbo at a time. How many shops would let you do this? He made over 7k in credits towards his bill in transporting cars for us and polishing turbo's. He named his price and was paid. Sometimes even a little more to give him the oppurtunity to make credits for his bill.
We had a talk in early Dec., where we expressed to him that we needed for him to start making payments towards his bill. We have had to much money out to long, specially in a case where you are giving cost.
He got all mad, we talked about it some more, then he said all was cool. He waited for everyone to leave, took all his belongings and left. Nobody heard from him till just the other day. I tried calling him before christmas and new year with no answer or returned call.
Now all of sudden he shows up and says he is aborting the project and taking his car. He says to just take everything he still owes for off his bill. Stuff that has been special ordered for him and paid for.
At this point I removed as much as I could, close to 7k in parts. However I did change the price from cost to 10% over cost. Which is still a good deal. Why should we have to give cost on parts that were ordered a year ago and sitting around.
After all of this he was just going to owe another 2k to take all of his parts. Instead he chose to bash us, if we were going to have take all this BS. I should have raised it to retail. I don't owe him anything, he got paid for what he did and got plenty of other benefits.
I will give him his parts and car as soon as he pays for them.


I figured it was a couple of grand that he was bitching about.

Manny, you guys seem to know your shit, and have a successful business that you have created. I was kind of surprised that you would let one of your most vocal cheerleaders have word of mouth credit, especially to the tune of $20-$30K that is coming out of your pocket. I was surprised because that was all he ever did, cheer lead and talk shit. I don't think that 10% over cost is anything but reasonable, and without interest on the loan. :eek: Bill is a time bomb ticking, luckily you guys have a the car, and are only bickering over 2 grand, rather than later down the road if bill decided then to not uphold his end of the bargain.

[wayne fontenot]

haha I aim to please vote for me in 08 best avatar :D


she's covering too much imo. less hand...more boob

i will never take a car to hpp again also

[mustangguy289]

she's covering too much imo. less hand...more boob

i will never take a car to hpp again also
y not

[wayne fontenot]

y not

imo manny has no clue on how to tune a car

[FRANCISCO308]

imo manny has no clue on how to tune a car
Have you ever tuned a car at Hpp ?

[wayne fontenot]

brought a car there once and that was the last time

[grape]

short analysis. Jerry Haas and Rick Jones build 90% of the pro stock cars running today. Not one is "sponsored" to anyone, no matter who they are, nor are they discounted.

Why should bill get shit for free? :confused:

[SVT Lurch]

imo manny has no clue on how to tune a car
LMAO! Really?

[grove rat]

damn wild bill, all this drama over 2k!? now i'm not saying 2k is nothing, but your post over on svt made it out that they wanted 20k

[PWTRTXSS]

If the amount being argued over is only $2K, Bill should just pay it and be done with it all. The way he was spending on that car, most of us were lead to believe that he eats pickles and shits nickels. $2k shouldn't be a problem. Just pay it and dog the shit out of HPP after that car is back at home.

[whiteboy]

damn wild bill, all this drama over 2k!? now i'm not saying 2k is nothing, but your post over on svt made it out that they wanted 20k

I could fart 2k.

[whiteboy]

imo manny has no clue on how to tune a car


LOL come on. :rolleyes:

[D]

Manny, this who situation is your fault. You fucked up in taking someone's word. You can't right your wrong by taking it out on Bill and holding his car. You should've gotten it in righting.

Just my $.02

[Skidmark]

I could fart 2k.

Can you fart some cash my way? :p

I duno what to say about the whole situation. When it comes to money it's always good to get it in writing like said above. It's hard to trust people when it comes to the greenbacks. People will turn on you with a quickness and hope you forget, no matter how close they are to you.

This really could have been taken care off of any boards as posting up really won't do much except give HPP a case of the fuckits.

[Nestromo]

I've only met wild bill a couple of times and I really liked him. First time I met him was when he brought the red Mach into the dealership where I worked for an alignement. As I recall the car was mostly stock with just a currie rearend and a few if any bolt ons. I talked to him for a while and he was a really friendly guy. The other time was at Kennedale when the car rolled back off of the trailer ( :eek: :eek: ) and a buddy and I stayed late and helped him get it back on because he didn't have a flashlight or anything. We had to use the reel out light on my buddy's Silverado (thanks Chevy!). At the time it was running in the 8.1 zone still mostly stock. For our efforts he gave us a whole shitload of beer, which was cool because we didn't expect anything for help and we were not yet old enough to source our own brew. Sucks that he is carless and has all of this shit to deal with. Hope everything gets resolved between him and HPP, but it's not looking good.

[D]

I've only met wild bill a couple of times and I really liked him. First time I met him was when he brought the red Mach into the dealership where I worked for an alignement. As I recall the car was mostly stock with just a currie rearend and a few if any bolt ons. I talked to him for a while and he was a really friendly guy. The other time was at Kennedale when the car rolled back off of the trailer ( :eek: :eek: ) and a buddy and I stayed late and helped him get it back on because he didn't have a flashlight or anything. We had to use the reel out light on my buddy's Silverado (thanks Chevy!). At the time it was running in the 8.1 zone still mostly stock. For our efforts he gave us a whole shitload of beer, which was cool because we didn't expect anything for help and we were not yet old enough to source our own brew. Sucks that he is carless and has all of this shit to deal with. Hope everything gets resolved between him and HPP, but it's not looking good.

That isn't exactly something I would be tooting your horn about on a public forum.

[Nestromo]

That isn't exactly something I would be tooting your horn about on a public forum.

Oh well, I'm 23 now and I doubt he will get arrested based on something that I said that I could obviously be lying about anyway.

We helped him and he helped us.

[D]

He's not getting arrested for anything at all anyway. This whole predicament is all HPP's doing for taking someone's word and not getting things in writing. Oh well.

[Nestromo]

Exactly. So I wouldn't worry about a side comment I made in a post just telling the only experiences that I had with the guy because it doesn't amount to jack shit, I was just saying why I liked him. ;)

[D]

Exactly. So I wouldn't worry about a side comment I made in a post just telling the only experiences that I had with the guy because it doesn't amount to jack shit, I was just saying why I liked him. ;)

Let me worry about what I worry about. If you want be friends with a shady person like Bill, be my guest.

[Nestromo]

Let me worry about what I worry about. If you want be friends with a shady person like Bill, be my guest.

We ain't friends. I met the guy twice and I liked him. I've never done any business with him and I don't even know the man's last name.

[D]

We ain't friends. I met the guy twice and I liked him. I've never done any business with him and I don't even know the man's last name.

LeMay.

[Nestromo]

LeMay.

Eh?

[D]

Eh?
His last name.

[Nestromo]

Oh. In that case, you just don't like him because he is french... same reason I won't use a chamois.

[D]

Oh. In that case, you just don't like him because he is french... same reason I won't use a chamois.

LOL! If that were the case I'd hate myself too...French-Canadian on both sides with a splash of Polish from my mom's side. I'm doomed.

I don't like Bill because he fucked over a friend of mine from this message board. He and I used to be friends and he helped me out with the Mach more than once, but we quit talking and I started to hear all of these horror stories about him and decided I don't like associating myself with people like that.

[wayne fontenot]

We ain't friends. I met the guy twice and I liked him. I've never done any business with him and I don't even know the man's last name.


Hitchcock


oh wait wrong bill

[Crooner]

LeMay.

lol

[Mychael101]

Waiting on Forensix to come to the rescue with the cash. Those pity fucks had to be worth a lot of cash.

[D]

lol

That was a piece of shit post for being your 666 post.

[Crooner]

That was a piece of shit post for being your 666 post.


Didn't even notice that was 666. You cant talk to much about post whoring or the gestapo will come reset your count.

[D]

Didn't even notice that was 666. You cant talk to much about post whoring or the gestapo will come reset your count.

LOL. So I hear.

[Cmarsh93z]

This should have never been posted...handle it like a man, face to face...not like a kid on the internet. I am sure everything will be taken care of....just never good to take it to the internet on something like this

Chris

[dan03mach]

Let me worry about what I worry about. If you want be friends with a shady person like Bill, be my guest.
A while back you were one of Bill's biggest nuthuggers, now you're calling him shady? LMFAO It's funny how people change their minds about people when shit happends. :rolleyes:

[D]

A while back you were one of Bill's biggest nuthuggers, now you're calling him shady? LMFAO It's funny how people change their minds about people when shit happends. :rolleyes:

I used to be pals with Bill, but I didn't swing from his balls or anything like that. Some stuff went down over the summer between him and a friend of mine that really changed my mind about him. I'm not going to divulge any information out of respect to who it happened to, but it was fucking shady at best. It's got nothing to do with HPP or any of this other crap.

[dan03mach]

I used to be pals with Bill, but I didn't swing from his balls or anything like that. Some stuff went down over the summer between him and a friend of mine that really changed my mind about him. I'm not going to divulge any information out of respect to who it happened to, but it was fucking shady at best. It's got nothing to do with HPP or any of this other crap.
Does it have to deal with a car that Bill fixed for someone?

[mikeb]

I've only met wild bill a couple of times and I really liked him. First time I met him was when he brought the red Mach into the dealership where I worked for an alignement. As I recall the car was mostly stock with just a currie rearend and a few if any bolt ons. I talked to him for a while and he was a really friendly guy. The other time was at Kennedale when the car rolled back off of the trailer ( :eek: :eek: ) and a buddy and I stayed late and helped him get it back on because he didn't have a flashlight or anything. We had to use the reel out light on my buddy's Silverado (thanks Chevy!). At the time it was running in the 8.1 zone still mostly stock. For our efforts he gave us a whole shitload of beer, which was cool because we didn't expect anything for help and we were not yet old enough to source our own brew. Sucks that he is carless and has all of this shit to deal with. Hope everything gets resolved between him and HPP, but it's not looking good.

Just to show that there is a flip side to everything I introduced myself to bill at a GTG when he was new on the scene and he couldn't be bothered to talk to me. Tried it again later on at the track and got the same result. I just chalked it up to him being one of those "i'm too cool for everyone else" kind of people.

Looks like when he needs something he can be downright friendly though.

[bobs94formula]

Is it just me or is birdman941 over at the SVT board an idiot?? LMAO the way he talks Bill built HPP LOL.
I've never met Bill, or done any business with HPP, so I am not trying to say one is right or wrong. Although if someone agrees to run races with a shops logo for steep discounts and they don't live up to their end of the agreement they should expect to pay more in the end for not doing what they said they would. That said it should have been put in writing, like everyone else can agree, but both sides sound as though they thought their "friends" wouldn't do something like this.

You sound like another JR Granatelli.
Listen and listen good.
The ONLY reason ANYONE has ever heard of you is because of Bill.
No Bill, No HPP.
This is already all over the web.
Bill is a straight up guy and has never screwed anyone.
His reputation is impeccable.
Nothing you say or write will change that.
Cut the car and his parts loose.
The more you prolong this, the worse YOU look.
Bill will survive.
If his stuff is not returned, HPP will be forever known as
"The place that screwed Bill".
That's the way it works.

Exactly my point.
No matter whom is at "fault",
HPP posting excuses is exactly what I predicted would happen.
HPP NOT posting is even worse.
No matter what, if Bill's car and parts are not returned to him,
HPP's reputation will be irreparably harmed by their own hand,
and lack for both foresight and hindsight.
This is the way HPP will be perceived by most from this point forward.
Nothing else matters.
The only way to salvage HPP's reputation is to return his stuff.
Pronto.
This is the way the digital world works.
Live by the sword, die by the sword.

[D]

Is it just me or is birdman941 over at the SVT board an idiot?? LMAO the way he talks Bill built HPP LOL.
I've never met Bill, or done any business with HPP, so I am not trying to say one is right or wrong. Although if someone agrees to run races with a shops logo for steep discounts and they don't live up to their end of the agreement they should expect to pay more in the end for not doing what they said they would. That said it should have been put in writing, like everyone else can agree, but both sides sound as though they thought their "friends" wouldn't do something like this.

That same guy is on Mach1Registry and is an equally big douche bag there too.

[PooterWS6]

With the bill being only 2k, id pay it and get my car back and consider it a lesson learned on verbal contracts, no matter how much you think you know the person or how easy the contract could go sour.

[aggie97]

What I find funny is that all the people that bash shops tend to be broke dick assholes who think building race cars is cheap. It's always a bleeding ass story about somebody getting fucked over by a shop because they went in having a SERIOUSLY wrong expectation of costs to have someone build them a car. A shop, any shop, can't just give away parts or labor because they have bills to pay. Tech's don't work for free, insurance isn't free and rent can get damn expensive with utilities.

I have dealt with numerous shops over the years getting "sponsorships" and any shop willing to offer that kind of thing MUST expect a return. If you aren't getting it, it's best to come to an agreement and part ways. I myself had to go through this in 07' with a VERY well known shop. Sure, I was out some money and lost my hookup, but you NEVER found me on the net bashing them. I understand the costs of racing and got over it and moved on.

That being said, HPP is by far the best race shop I have ever dealt with...fair, reasonable and VERY clear on what they can and will provide for a price. They back it up with quality work that deserves getting paid for.

I say, file the Mech's lien and I want to be first in line to pay off the bill and take the car for the $2k pay off. :D

If you can't afford to play with the big boys, stay the fuck home and build your own piece of shit.

[MR TINFOIL HAT]

What I find funny is that all the people that bash shops tend to be broke dick assholes who think building race cars is cheap. It's always a bleeding ass story about somebody getting fucked over by a shop because they went in having a SERIOUSLY wrong expectation of costs to have someone build them a car. A shop, any shop, can't just give away parts or labor because they have bills to pay. Tech's don't work for free, insurance isn't free and rent can get damn expensive with utilities.

I have dealt with numerous shops over the years getting "sponsorships" and any shop willing to offer that kind of thing MUST expect a return. If you aren't getting it, it's best to come to an agreement and part ways. I myself had to go through this in 07' with a VERY well known shop. Sure, I was out some money and lost my hookup, but you NEVER found me on the net bashing them. I understand the costs of racing and got over it and moved on.

That being said, HPP is by far the best race shop I have ever dealt with...fair, reasonable and VERY clear on what they can and will provide for a price. They back it up with quality work that deserves getting paid for.

I say, file the Mech's lien and I want to be first in line to pay off the bill and take the car for the $2k pay off. :D

If you can't afford to play with the big boys, stay the fuck home and build your own piece of shit.
Exactly.

[360 Notch]

I could fart 2k.

then fart up what you owe me bitch.

seriously.

[Skidmark]

then fart up what you owe me bitch.

seriously.

:eek:

[Cody B]

then fart up what you owe me bitch.

seriously.

ROLFLMAO. I am crying.. :eek: :eek:

[foofinator]

lol some of you tool jobs crack me up.

The collective value of the cars owned by the people bashing HPP looks to be 10g's.

Manny doesn't know how to tune? lmao.. ok.



Sorry to see it go this way. HPP is great, and Bill is also a good guy.

My condolences to your family Bill, glad to see you recovered.

Hopefully this business situation can be worked out.

[wayne fontenot]

lol some of you tool jobs crack me up.

The collective value of the cars owned by the people bashing HPP looks to be 10g's.

Manny doesn't know how to tune? lmao.. ok.



Sorry to see it go this way. HPP is great, and Bill is also a good guy.

My condolences to your family Bill, glad to see you recovered.

Hopefully this business situation can be worked out.


just to inform you, the value of the car i'm referring to is close to 60g's. from the start when talking to manny about the tune on the car, he bashed the set up. we were not paying him for his opinion, just a tune. when he refused to tune it the nesesary way for the set up we went elswhere. now that it is tune propperly it make killer power. so before calling anyone a tool job get the facts

[whiteboy]

just to inform you, the value of the car i'm referring to is close to 60g's. from the start when talking to manny about the tune on the car, he bashed the set up. we were not paying him for his opinion, just a tune. when he refused to tune it the nesesary way for the set up we went elswhere. now that it is tune propperly it make killer power. so before calling anyone a tool job get the facts

what car?

[wayne fontenot]

what car?


just a little 04 mach 1

[whiteboy]

just a little 04 mach 1
60k in a mach1??

[Cody B]

lol some of you tool jobs crack me up.

The collective value of the cars owned by the people bashing HPP looks to be 10g's.
.


WHat does that have to do with anything. I personally have no dealings with HPP so I am not bashing but just curious are you saying that HPP only taylors to the higher dollar car. Are you an official spokesman for HPP. I just need to know because my value on my car is around 8k and if its to low of a car for them to work on then I guess I'll find a shop that works on customer cars that are "less fortunate" to having a high dollar car such as yours :rolleyes: :rolleyes: .

[wayne fontenot]

WHat does that have to do with anything. I personally have no dealings with HPP so I am not bashing but just curious are you saying that HPP only taylors to the higher dollar car. Are you an official spokesman for HPP. I just need to know because my value on my car is around 8k and if its to low of a car for them to work on then I guess I'll find a shop that works on customer cars that are "less fortunate" to having a high dollar car such as yours :rolleyes: :rolleyes: .


you hit the nail on the head. the one time i was at hpp, i was treatedlike a nobody. they were very "snobbish" and i was very disappointed with them, seeing that alot of people talked highly of them. but after my experiance with them i have heard simular stories from others. i have heard a disturbing story about manny and jeremy at ntn, any truth to it?

[aggie97]

just to inform you, the value of the car i'm referring to is close to 60g's. from the start when talking to manny about the tune on the car, he bashed the set up. we were not paying him for his opinion, just a tune. when he refused to tune it the nesesary way for the set up we went elswhere. now that it is tune propperly it make killer power. so before calling anyone a tool job get the facts


Is this a fucking pro mod car?! :rolleyes:

Just so you are aware, there are a LOT of people that won't bother tuning a car if the Owner comes in and wants something that is not safe or normal. Probably because they know that if it blows up, stupid fucks like you would be on boards like this two days later saying "they don't know shit and fucked up my car.." whining like a little bitch. It's called being smart and not wasting YOUR money or THEIR repuation. :rolleyes:

[Lason]

What I find funny is that all the people that bash shops tend to be broke dick assholes who think building race cars is cheap.

Are you reffering to people like me that say this is why I only use local shops for buying parts and not labor? If so then maybe people like myself believe that if we can do the work then why pay others to do it. I would rather put that money to better parts than labor from someone I dont trust. Its my ass going down the track, not the underpaid tech paid to work on it.

If you can't afford to play with the big boys, stay the fuck home and build your own piece of shit.


Will do!

[Jared Ezzell]

everyone is going to have their opinions and personally ive been to dallas mustang slims gearheads and hpp, and yestereday manny treated me exceptionally well all i wanted was to fill my botte up and see what the air fuel was on the dyno but he went to greated links he did 4 pulls on the dyno data logged them even put a bottle heater on my car just for the pulls and gave me a nitrous jet all for 75 bucks now come on u cant ask for much better than that and i i paid gearheads 35 for 2 pulls and when i saw my #'s i was impressed i did 433 tq on a 75 shot and yesterday hpp's dyno was 375 big differnce well gearheads adds 8% for drivetrain loss i mean come on lets get real hpp knows whats up THATS MY OPINION

[White_lightning]

since we are bashing HPP i thought i would chime in.. i have been there once. i went there to dyno my supra. I had never met any of them before but they knew who i was from the board. It was the same day skip was having his cobra tuned there. Well. they where very nice to me.. friendly and took care of everything.

My 2c.. if some one brings something to me and asked me to "tune it" or what ever. If i didnt feel confident in the set up.. its my right to refuse.. Any shop as the right to refuse work.. they dont HAVE to accept every one who brings their car in...

wayne.. just as a question. What exactly was put into a mach 1 that cost 60k? i know people running 8s in a supra and vettes, that stop and handle like road race cars with 1/3rd of that in them..


just curious.

[dan03mach]

i paid gearheads 35 for 2 pulls and when i saw my #'s i was impressed i did 433 tq on a 75 shot and yesterday hpp's dyno was 375 big differnce well gearheads adds 8% for drivetrain loss i mean come on lets get real hpp knows whats up THATS MY OPINIONGHP doesn't add 8% for drivetrain loss on their dyno numbers. It's a dynojet you can't add drivetrain loss. I will tell you one thing though, when using N20 the numbers can very depending on what RPM you hit it, PSI in the bottle, ect. And IMO 375rwtq is kinda low for a 75 shot. I would figure it would be in the 4xx range. On my old 125 shot back at hpp my tq was 520 on the stock motor, but that was a couple years ago.

[mustangguy289]

Is this a fucking pro mod car?! :rolleyes:

:
lmao at you thinking 60g's will build a promod from the ground up

[spankustang]

The thread Bill started on Yellowbullet says it's been taken care of!!

[wayne fontenot]

Is this a fucking pro mod car?! :rolleyes:

Just so you are aware, there are a LOT of people that won't bother tuning a car if the Owner comes in and wants something that is not safe or normal. Probably because they know that if it blows up, stupid fucks like you would be on boards like this two days later saying "they don't know shit and fucked up my car.." whining like a little bitch. It's called being smart and not wasting YOUR money or THEIR repuation. :rolleyes:


to start i have not called anyone names or "bashed" anyone. i have just stated opinions. manny has been a stand up guy and pm'd me on the matter. i replied and hopfully takes my complaint to heart and the matter can be resolved. when i say 60g's that is including the price of the car. the car has a fully built motor and turbo kit. fuel system and all bolt ons to go with it. it has a full maximum motorsports launch kit and cage(anything maximum is not cheap) the car is making a little less than 1g rwhp. the issue with manny was when the car had a blower on it he would not add the adiquit timing for the snow kit. but again that complaint has been sqashed between he and I trhough a pm.

[dan03mach]

to start i have not called anyone names or "bashed" anyone. i have just stated opinions. manny has been a stand up guy and pm'd me on the matter. i replied and hopfully takes my complaint to heart and the matter can be resolved. when i say 60g's that is including the price of the car. the car has a fully built motor and turbo kit. fuel system and all bolt ons to go with it. it has a full maximum motorsports launch kit and cage(anything maximum is not cheap) the car is making a little less than 1g rwhp. the issue with manny was when the car had a blower on it he would not add the adiquit timing for the snow kit. but again that complaint has been sqashed between he and I trhough a pm.
I would like to take a look at that car... When are yall going to the track?

[SVT Lurch]

HPP works on my car and it's probably only worth about 7000. for now :D

[wayne fontenot]

I would like to take a look at that car... When are yall going to the track?


the car has not seen a track yet. it is actually at the tuner as we speak. i am picking it up saterday and you are more than welcome to come see it on sundayif you are i n the denton area.

[Cmarsh93z]

to start i have not called anyone names or "bashed" anyone.


Not bashed????????

i'd get that car as quick as possible because hpp is "shady" enough to file a mechanics lean and keep the car.

imo manny has no clue on how to tune a car

So because manny would not add timing, he is shady and he doesn't know how to tune? I build and tune all my own cars..and I don't trust many people to work on one of my cars. But if I had a 03-04 Cobra, I would hand the keys to manny in a new york minute. Just stinks of shit that you get on here in a thread like this and spread your b.s. Glad manny pm'ed you and set ya straight :D

Chris

[bcoop]

Poor Bill. All that hard time he spent on his knees, and this is what he gets in return. :(




Sorry, Bill. Had to. :p Hope you all can get it worked out. I see Bill's side, but I also see HPP's side. This is one of the few arguments they've made publicly, that made sense. At least, that I can recall anyways.

Hope you are able to work past it, and that you both learned something.

[dan03mach]

the car has not seen a track yet. it is actually at the tuner as we speak. i am picking it up saterday and you are more than welcome to come see it on sundayif you are i n the denton area.
Sweet I'm in Lewisville. Yeah I'd like to see it.

[aggie97]

to start i have not called anyone names or "bashed" anyone. i have just stated opinions. manny has been a stand up guy and pm'd me on the matter. i replied and hopfully takes my complaint to heart and the matter can be resolved. when i say 60g's that is including the price of the car. the car has a fully built motor and turbo kit. fuel system and all bolt ons to go with it. it has a full maximum motorsports launch kit and cage(anything maximum is not cheap) the car is making a little less than 1g rwhp. the issue with manny was when the car had a blower on it he would not add the adiquit timing for the snow kit. but again that complaint has been sqashed between he and I trhough a pm.

So basically, you are talking out of your ass trying to look cool on an interweb board...Thumbs up to you. :rolleyes:

Hmm, maximum motorsports stuff on a drag car... well, they really aren't known for that but are probably better known for the rest of their stuff which my car is a poster child for. Wonder where that $700 in free parts just came from?

I will put $50 on the table that YOU don't even own said 1000rwhp mach1 but are on someone's nuts like you own it... :p


Lason, please don't lump yourself into the broke dick crowd...

[wayne fontenot]

So basically, you are talking out of your ass trying to look cool on an interweb board...Thumbs up to you. :rolleyes:

Hmm, maximum motorsports stuff on a drag car... well, they really aren't known for that but are probably better known for the rest of their stuff which my car is a poster child for. Wonder where that $700 in free parts just came from?

I will put $50 on the table that YOU don't even own said 1000rwhp mach1 but are on someone's nuts like you own it... :p


Lason, please don't lump yourself into the broke dick crowd...


not one time did i say it is a drag car. it is a daily driver. nor did i say i own the car. i have had a BIG hand in building the car. whats this 700 in free parts bullshit?

[gip99drop]

Thats a lot of money being exchanged with no written contract. Sounded like a bad deal from the jump for both parties. Hope that they can work things out.

[8mpg]

Geez... what a mess. If its $2k worth of 10% mark up, I think HPP should just let it go. Ordering parts and letting them sit there isnt a big deal. Now if its $2000 out of pocket, Bill just needs to pay up and let it go. part your ways and both act like grown men. Things dont always go right and this is one of those.

They just need to hurry up and part ways and leave each other alone.

[bcoop]

part your ways and both act like grown men. Things dont always go right and this is one of those.

They just need to hurry up and part ways and leave each other alone.



I do recall a certain someone starting a thread asking who was the douchebag, in a situation not too different than this one.... ;) :p

[8mpg]

I do recall a certain someone starting a thread asking who was the douchebag, in a situation not too different than this one.... ;) :p

LOL... and you know what, we worked it out and are still friends today. :cool:

[musclestang89]

not one time did i say it is a drag car. it is a daily driver. nor did i say i own the car. i have had a BIG hand in building the car. whats this 700 in free parts bullshit?


post up some pics of the said car. i'm curious to see

[wayne fontenot]

post up some pics of the said car. i'm curious to see


i do not have pics of the car the moment but i can and will take some soon.

[musclestang89]

i do not have pics of the car the moment but i can and will take some soon.


hmmm , not calling you a liar but if I had a "BIG hand in building the car" on a 60K car I would have a crap load of pics. From the build up to finish and prolly vidoes to. Well maybe thats just me :cool:

[FWT03Term]

Hitchcock


oh wait wrong bill

It's Hickock, not Hitchcock. That was funny as hell though!!

[wayne fontenot]

hmmm , not calling you a liar but if I had a "BIG hand in building the car" on a 60K car I would have a crap load of pics. From the build up to finish and prolly vidoes to. Well maybe thats just me :cool:


no actually you are calling me a liar......i did not have a camera till i was given one for christmas. the car will be picked up from the tuner saturday morning. i will take pics of it and even video a dyno pull.

[wayne fontenot]

It's Hickock, not Hitchcock. That was funny as hell though!!


sorry, my mistake i never did well in history class

[8mpg]

no actually you are calling me a liar......i did not have a camera till i was given one for christmas. the car will be picked up from the tuner saterday morning. i will take pics of it and even video a dyno pull.

sorry, my mistake i never did well in history class


Nice... Didn't do well in English either :D

[wayne fontenot]

Nice... Didn't do well in English either :D

i received a diploma thats all that matters to me

[musclestang89]

no actually you are calling me a liar......i did not have a camera till i was given one for christmas. the car will be picked up from the tuner saturday morning. i will take pics of it and even video a dyno pull.


sorry bro, didn't mean it to come put sounded like i was calling you a liar.

like i said thats prolly just me

[wayne fontenot]

sorry bro, didn't mean it to come put sounded like i was calling you a liar.

like i said thats prolly just me


if i would have had a camera i would have a HUGE photo album of this car. it has had many set ups and has had a great deal of labor put into it and i would have loved to document it

[Sean88gt]

This shit gives me tired head...

[wayne fontenot]

This shit gives me tired head...


i'm gettin kinda bored with it too.... this thread went wayyyyyyyy south

[Da Prez]

wow thats sucks to hear that this has happened to both sides, i only deal with HPP and i always will, but i do think bill is a cool dude... sucks thats you guys couldnt work it out and it had to be posted on the net...

[Wade@HPP]

When we had problems with Hpp Bill was first to defend them. I think Manny is an ok guy. I could care less for Ozzie and Wade. I will never take a car back to HPP.

The only time I've ever met you or talked to you was when I helped you find your stock X-Pipe two years ago. (When Jeremy was still at HPP)

Weird.

[Wade@HPP]

I know a couple of people who said they would have went to HPP if it were not for these 2. They say manny is pretty reasonable and he knows what he is talking about but they say the other 2 are just dicks.

I dont know what goes on behind doors but I do try to help everyone if they are calling just to ask a technical question or to order thousands of parts. Granted, I do get behind at times but i've never recalled being a "dick" to anyone. If I have, I sincerely apologize.

There have been issues in the past but I stand behind HPP and I do look out for the companies best interest. If there is ever any question of fairness Manny, Ozzie, and myself always try to find out where the breakdown was and fix it.

------

As far as the Bill situation goes, Im talking to him in person tomorrow. I have talked to him at great length on my personal cell phone and on my days off/after hours. We just want whats fair. Thats all.

-Wade

[360 Notch]

I havent dumped truck loads of money at HPP and Wade, Oz, Manny and the rest of the guys up there are always very friendly and act as if they were happy to see me and help me in every way.

I think there are always two sides to the story. I dont know the whole story, it so Im not gonna comment on the Bill thing. Its between Bill and HPP.

I really love how the bashing starts on here. I am sorry it came to posting it on the websites. I typically would expect that to be a last resort type of thing.

Im going up there tomorrow and Im sure Ill be treated as if I was anyone else. I dont want a shop to suck my xxxx when I come up there. Just treat me right.

I hope Bills family gets thru the tough times ok and wish every one the best.


ubil

[aggie97]

not one time did i say it is a drag car. it is a daily driver. nor did i say i own the car. i have had a BIG hand in building the car. whats this 700 in free parts bullshit?

Then why mention the "launch pack"...? Sounds like a drag car to me...

Figured my $50 was safe... :rolleyes:


I was referring to the fact that Maximum gives me free stuff for my race car...you figure out the rest...

[mustanggene1980]

i don't know manny or bill, my friend had his car worked on there and the work was top notch and the after sale support was great . I've heard alot bill and manny and they both sound like stand up guys hope it all gets worked out

[foofinator]

Facts are facts, at Kellers on Saturday....

Clint's blue 03
Steven's black 03
Manny's blue 03
my yellow 04..

HPP tuned cars making well over 700. Manny can't tune though.. don't tell my car. Not to mention a shit ton of other HPP cars in the parking lot, like an orange mach, a red camaro etc etc....

Is this the red Mach 1 that was being loaded onto the trailer that one day that you are talking about?

[RyanB]

everyone is going to have their opinions and personally ive been to dallas mustang slims gearheads and hpp, and yestereday manny treated me exceptionally well all i wanted was to fill my botte up and see what the air fuel was on the dyno but he went to greated links he did 4 pulls on the dyno data logged them even put a bottle heater on my car just for the pulls and gave me a nitrous jet all for 75 bucks now come on u cant ask for much better than that and i i paid gearheads 35 for 2 pulls and when i saw my #'s i was impressed i did 433 tq on a 75 shot and yesterday hpp's dyno was 375 big differnce well gearheads adds 8% for drivetrain loss i mean come on lets get real hpp knows whats up THATS MY OPINION

Some punctuation?



This shit gives me tired head...

Agreed!

[1994SilverGT]

kinda funny seeing all the hpp nutswingers throwing around most of the insults to the people who areny on their knees....

But regardless, ive never dealt with hpp, so i cant say anything other than what is on here. Hope both sides learn something from it though.

[txstangguy]

you hit the nail on the head. the one time i was at hpp, i was treatedlike a nobody. they were very "snobbish" and i was very disappointed with them, seeing that alot of people talked highly of them. but after my experiance with them i have heard simular stories from others. i have heard a disturbing story about manny and jeremy at ntn, any truth to it?
Which one the black 03' with the f1-r that got sold to a friend of mine in east texas?? because if that is the cas then yes. They bought the car and didn't get to pick it up for a month... during that time the aftermarket heatexchanger, springs, caster camber plates, and all but one tune were taken off. The car had a bad head that shortly blew a head gasket, and the car also had a bad case of odometer fraud not to mention it spun a rod bearing. Now they have over 40k in a car that is worth about 25k. is that the story you were speaking of?

[Mustangman_2000]

Can't believe all of this drama is about $2K. Should have been handled better IMO.

I've been to HPP twice in the past. A dyno and the subsequent visit they installed my 4.30 gears, aluminum drive shaft, and hpm safety loop.

The first ring and pinion was noisy out of the box regardless of what they tried. Manny installed a second set of frpp 4.30s and a new bearing set without charging me any additional money. Therefore, my experiences dealing with Manny were positive.

People are always going to have good and bad experiences dealing with any Performance shop. It's the nature of the beast.

[fordracing19]

The only time I've ever met you or talked to you was when I helped you find your stock X-Pipe two years ago. (When Jeremy was still at HPP)

Weird.
When my brother had his car their. :rolleyes:

[wayne fontenot]

Then why mention the "launch pack"...? Sounds like a drag car to me...

Figured my $50 was safe... :rolleyes:


I was referring to the fact that Maximum gives me free stuff for my race car...you figure out the rest...


just because it has a launch kit doesn't make it an all out drag car...its a street car. congradulations, your sucking the right XXXX at maximum.

[SEB]

All I can say about this is this makes me as a customer think twice about doing a big project with a speed shop.

Point blank. Shops like HPP & GEARHEADS would not be in buisness if it wasn't for their customers.

All these problems with customers & Shops is really going to give these shops bad names. Money is tight these days for alot of people. Time's are getting tough & I would be willing to bet the first thing most American Familys will do is let the car hobby take a break.

My point. This thread is BAD NEWS FOR HPP & their buisness.

I have dealt & done buisness with HPP before & was a happy customer when I left. But all I hear is horror stories lately.

[Juiceweezl]

Here's my .02 FWIW. I have no bias towards HPP. I have done practically all of my business with Lonestar through the years. I have spoken with Manny over the phone for some help once, and he happily assisted. Furthermore, I was having problems at the track once while they were there tuning on the race car. I went over and spoke to him asking for help. He happily took some time away from the laptop while tuning on his car to speak with me and one of his team even looked at my car. He even offered tools or whatever I needed to work on my car there. This was done while not really knowing me, but obviously knowing that much work had been done to my car by another shop. To me, that's good business and a stand up guy/team.

Too often, people (I'd say 98%+ on this site) spend money they don't have working on their only car to make it faster. Racing or building hot rod cars is not something for the light in pocket crowd. HPP is a business trying to make a profit just like everyone. They grow their business by providing a great service that customers deem worthy of the price. If their work is quality, they can charge a premium. From what I can see, this is a case of the shop trying to help a customer/friend out, but reaching their limit. It seems that Bill was given enough rope, and he finally hung himself.

[Wario]

Sounds to me like someone bit off a little more then they could chew. 50 large is alot to spend.

[bcoop]

All I can say about this is this makes me as a customer think twice about doing a big project with a speed shop.

Point blank. Shops like HPP & GEARHEADS would not be in buisness if it wasn't for their customers.

All these problems with customers & Shops is really going to give these shops bad names. Money is tight these days for alot of people. Time's are getting tough & I would be willing to bet the first thing most American Familys will do is let the car hobby take a break.

My point. This thread is BAD NEWS FOR HPP & their buisness.

I have dealt & done buisness with HPP before & was a happy customer when I left. But all I hear is horror stories lately.



Did you read it all? HPP isn't in the wrong here.... Sounds to me like Bill just wanted something for nothing, and no business will stay in business by giving away free shit. He didn't hold up his end of the deal, period. Sucks that a sickness in the family caused all this, but a deal is a deal and he didn't hold up his end. The more I read, the more black and white this becomes.

[SEB]

Did you read it all? HPP isn't in the wrong here.... Sounds to me like Bill just wanted something for nothing, and no business will stay in business by giving away free shit. He didn't hold up his end of the deal, period. Sucks that a sickness in the family caused all this, but a deal is a deal and he didn't hold up his end. The more I read, the more black and white this becomes.


Yeah, its just these negative threads regardless of it being the shops fault or not are bad for the companys buisness.

Yes it sounds like Bill got in over his head & should have documented things better.

Nobody is gonna win here.

[White_lightning]

here is what i have learned in the last 12 years of fucking around with cars.
(1) no shop is perfect
(2) every shop will have ppl who love it
(3) every shop will have ppl who hate it.
(4) every shop will screw up something once in a while
(5) every shop will have a " how they fucked me over " thread that is always 50% truth and 50% fabrication..

unless you are bill or hpp you will never know the 100% full story. so IMO let this go.

[prochargedpony]

Is bill even allowed to post on here any more? I thought he got banned for life. It sounds like bill bit off WAAAAY more then he could chew, he never had the cash, always WAITING To cash in. For christ sake he was polishing parts and delivering cars, and being a bounty hunter to try and pay off his debt. There are no other shops that would let a customer do that, in hopes of getting paid. He wasn't building a car that was broken per say, he wanted an 8sec car. I would expect that shit from a shop who worked on a 2k grand am that needed a head gasket to help someone out. Not a performance shop to help a guy build an 8sec car. :eek: Bill just needs to pay his 2k, it is fair to give them 10 percent over cost, he should agree and admit he never had the money. They worked on his shit for a year, they even took of the parts and applied it towards his bill, I would love to see the labor charge, out wait there ISN"T ONE........

[blownaltered]

It doesn't matter who is actually at fault here, the damage has been done. Bill has been on atleast 4 different sites running his mouth. This will not change the minds of current HPP customers, its going to influence the decission of future HPP customers. So the out come now isn't going to change that, I never thought I would see the day when Bill bashed HPP. In the end I hope everything gets resolved and then everybody can go their seperate ways.

[AL P]

Did you read it all? HPP isn't in the wrong here.... Sounds to me like Bill just wanted something for nothing, and no business will stay in business by giving away free shit. He didn't hold up his end of the deal, period. Sucks that a sickness in the family caused all this, but a deal is a deal and he didn't hold up his end. The more I read, the more black and white this becomes.

Maybe one of these days UNICEF will start building race cars for charity, I'm just sayin....

Bill seems like an OK guy. I know for a fact that Manny and Ozzie are going to bend over backwards. To me it sounds like they just need to agree on a dollar amount (someone mentioned 2K) and Bill just needs to pay it. Based on one post he already may have done that. That isn't a lot of money in a situation like this.

[SSMAN]

It was a bad business decision on Bill's part. That kind of money on a verbal agreement? I would have given him more credit than that. I have read the thread. To be honest I don't see any blame on HPP's part. It's business........that's it. I have heard way more good about HPP than bad over the years.

[Justa4banger]

Mna i need more popcorn......... :D

[dan03mach]

Well any word? Did they come to a decision yet?

[BOOSTED32V]

Maybe one of these days UNICEF will start building race cars for charity, I'm just sayin.....HAHA, No shit!

I know for a fact that Manny and Ozzie are going to bend over backwards.Thats what I'm talkin about, I've know Manny and Ozzie since way back before HPP, they have done alot for me and my Cobra through the years and have always been stand up guy's in my book! I have my own business and I know what they are going through, I've had this exact situation present itself at my shop, I got screwed and the other party probably thought they got screwed, in the end it cost me $$$ and was not worth it, sometimes you think some people are your friends and then it turns around to bite you in the ass, and of course
the business is the one that get's the bad rap.

I'm also not bashing Bill, I've met at him, hanged with him at the track, GTG's and he seems like a good guy, but NOTHING in this world is free and Bill of all people should know that. It takes money to go fast, lot's of it...'Henry

[manny]

SEB, what are we suppose to do? Give him parts that he has not paid for?

This guy, that few think is a stand up guy, is now calling our customers talking trash to them. I have heard from 2 different customers that he called them and told them that we were going to use used parts on his car, and weren't going to use the parts that we told him we were. This guy is from LA. and was seriously worried, I just spent 1.5hrs on the phone with him explaining the real story.
I am way to proud of the business & reputation we have built over the last 10 years doing this, to scam anyone. Not once have we scammed, misled, or ripped some one off. That is not how we do business.
He had stickers on his car from back in the day when it just had a few bolt ons. He did that cheering for the shop he liked just like others cheer for the shop they like, except he always took it to another level. He likes the stickers so people think it's an important race car, we had no deal with him at all till his car broke and wanted a built motor.
Every one here has seen how crazy he can get if you don't agree with him. The whole time he was cheerleading it was all on his own, I even asked him several times to settle down. I told him in several cases he was doing more harm then good, when threatening people or calling names.
At this point I wish I had never met the dude or done any work on his car. He has done way worse for business then any good he could have done. He got hooked up from the begining.
All of this because he never got the oil money he thought he was going to get. It boils down to he doesn't have the money to even pay cost on his parts.
He figured if he did his internet trashing we would just give it to him. Wrong, you still have to pay for your parts!
Most people know how he can be, the ones that don't are finding out. I don't see how any one would ever want to sponsor someone like this.
Sorry for the rant.

[8mpg]

sounding like the moral of the story is: BILL NEEDS TO PAY FOR HIS PARTS AND STOP THE SHIT

[Juiceweezl]

It doesn't matter who is actually at fault here, the damage has been done. Bill has been on atleast 4 different sites running his mouth. This will not change the minds of current HPP customers, its going to influence the decission of future HPP customers. So the out come now isn't going to change that, I never thought I would see the day when Bill bashed HPP. In the end I hope everything gets resolved and then everybody can go their seperate ways.

I think you're wrong. One, if I were going to drop some major cheddar of fixing up my car, I'd do some big time research. If I stumbled across an HPP thread where someone, AKA Colonel "Wild Bill" Sanders, I'd quickly find at least 2 times more "HPP is great!" threads than one like this one that bad mouths them.

Secondly, I personally wouldn't trust anything an unknown keyboard warrior said (good or bad), so I'd go check the shop out myself. I'd talk to the owner/manager, and I'd walk through the shop. I'd look closely at cars they are currently working on, and even ask to see some they had finished too. Then I'd ask for pricing on a certain part of the project to see how quickly they responded, their suggested build, and then the price/value of the quote. AFTER all of that, I'd make a decision based on my experience with the shop IN PERSON -- not because someone nuthugged or bashed them in a car forum.

That's just my personal modus operandi. Like I said earlier, I have no allegiance to HPP, but if I were to decide and change shops, I'd go visit them first based on my phone conversations there and with face to face experiences at the track. Now, get back to flaming whomever it was you were flaming!

[MustangVilla]

sounding like the moral of the story is: BILL NEEDS TO PAY FOR HIS PARTS AND STOP THE SHIT

Yep, that and always sign an agreement.

[8mpg]

Yep, that and always sign an agreement.

well...just read the 11 pages on SVTperf and it looks like they came to an agreement. Bill is paying HPP some amount that wasnt disclosed and HPP is gathering all his shit so he can take it all home.

So, i guess it worked out. I hope Bill does the right thing and deletes all this HPP threads and stops the crap

[MustangVilla]

well...just read the 11 pages on SVTperf and it looks like they came to an agreement. Bill is paying HPP some amount that wasnt disclosed and HPP is gathering all his shit so he can take it all home.

So, i guess it worked out. I hope Bill does the right thing and deletes all this HPP threads and stops the crap

It would probably be wise for a mod to blow this thread away as well.

[Samhain]

It would probably be wise for a mod to blow this thread away as well.

No, I think this thread serves as a good reminder of just what can happen.

[Samhain]

SEB, what are we suppose to do? Give him parts that he has not paid for?

This guy, that few think is a stand up guy, is now calling our customers talking trash to them. I have heard from 2 different customers that he called them and told them that we were going to use used parts on his car, and weren't going to use the parts that we told him we were. This guy is from LA. and was seriously worried, I just spent 1.5hrs on the phone with him explaining the real story.
I am way to proud of the business & reputation we have built over the last 10 years doing this, to scam anyone. Not once have we scammed, misled, or ripped some one off. That is not how we do business.
He had stickers on his car from back in the day when it just had a few bolt ons. He did that cheering for the shop he liked just like others cheer for the shop they like, except he always took it to another level. He likes the stickers so people think it's an important race car, we had no deal with him at all till his car broke and wanted a built motor.
Every one here has seen how crazy he can get if you don't agree with him. The whole time he was cheerleading it was all on his own, I even asked him several times to settle down. I told him in several cases he was doing more harm then good, when threatening people or calling names.
At this point I wish I had never met the dude or done any work on his car. He has done way worse for business then any good he could have done. He got hooked up from the begining.
All of this because he never got the oil money he thought he was going to get. It boils down to he doesn't have the money to even pay cost on his parts.
He figured if he did his internet trashing we would just give it to him. Wrong, you still have to pay for your parts!
Most people know how he can be, the ones that don't are finding out. I don't see how any one would ever want to sponsor someone like this.
Sorry for the rant.

Manny, you know the moment that his car leaves your shop it's going to be an all out bash-fest on you guys. HPP letting him leave with only paying 10% over cost is a joke. That couldn't even cover your overhead, much less turn one cent of profit. Sorry, but Bill acted like a high roller and turned out to be just another DFWStangs 30K a year millionaire. This just goes to prove that HPP is a quality shop that just wants this mess out of their hair so they can continue to do what they do best, putting out top notch cars.

[manny]

It is a smoking deal and I know he will bash. Hopefully it will go on deaf ears because of who it's coming from. I just want it to go away! A whole bunch more people have now seen his true colors. The agreement we now have come to is the same as Fri. night, pay your bill & get your stuff out of here. From the begining he was talking about a shop helping him in Phoenix, then he denied it and now it looks like they have come out on SVTP.
Either way good luck to him and the guys in Phoenix that have to deal with him.

[livinglegend_86]

This thread still here? Anyways, I just want to applaud Manny for handling this in a professional manner. I know neither Bill nor anyone at HPP, but they have all kept this professional and sane.

Let's move on people... like WL said:

unless you are bill or hpp you will never know the 100% full story. so IMO let this go

[Super Coupe]

GHP doesn't add 8% for drivetrain loss on their dyno numbers. It's a dynojet you can't add drivetrain loss. I will tell you one thing though, when using N20 the numbers can very depending on what RPM you hit it, PSI in the bottle, ect. And IMO 375rwtq is kinda low for a 75 shot. I would figure it would be in the 4xx range. On my old 125 shot back at hpp my tq was 520 on the stock motor, but that was a couple years ago.

X2. One dyno pull at hpp at 900 psi i made 460 tq the next pull with 1k not 5 minutes later it did 503 tq. I had issues with my car going lean on the dyno and manny would not run it. I was not paying for a dyno tune and manny himself was trying to help me figure out the problem and we tried a bunch of different things to try to get some fuel to it. Turns out it was it was a simple fix and wasn't really running lean at all. I was probably on the dyno for 2 hours and he was very fair with the price of my dyno time and was very helpful with all my questions.

[Lason]

Manny, I gotta give you props man. You are handling this in a very mature manner. I was pretty much on the fence on this one even though I have seen Bill act like a child just because his story made me believe he was getting ripped off but Im glad a resolution has come and hopefully you guys can get back to buisness.

[Cooter]

Geez... what a mess. If its $2k worth of 10% mark up, I think HPP should just let it go. Ordering parts and letting them sit there isnt a big deal. Now if its $2000 out of pocket, Bill just needs to pay up and let it go. part your ways and both act like grown men. Things dont always go right and this is one of those.

They just need to hurry up and part ways and leave each other alone.

the thing about ordering parts and letting them sit there is that they have to be paid for

[Cooter]

It is a smoking deal and I know he will bash. Hopefully it will go on deaf ears because of who it's coming from. I just want it to go away! A whole bunch more people have now seen his true colors. The agreement we now have come to is the same as Fri. night, pay your bill & get your stuff out of here. From the begining he was talking about a shop helping him in Phoenix, then he denied it and now it looks like they have come out on SVTP.
Either way good luck to him and the guys in Phoenix that have to deal with him.

it will fall on deaf ears... and the listening ears it might happen to fall on are probably attached to dipshit customers that you wouldn't want to deal with anyhow!

[MustangVilla]

it will fall on deaf ears... and the listening ears it might happen to fall on are probably attached to dipshit customers that you wouldn't want to deal with anyhow!

Werd!

[JeckTurbo]

Manny, I gotta give you props man. You are handling this in a very mature manner. I was pretty much on the fence on this one even though I have seen Bill act like a child just because his story made me believe he was getting ripped off but Im glad a resolution has come and hopefully you guys can get back to buisness.


I am impressed with your comment there lason. I kinda see you in a different light.

mk

[JKD]

Are we really wasting bandwidth on Bill again?

[Juiceweezl]

I've got a hurt motor right now. Does anyone know where of a shop where I may be able to store my car while I scrape up change to buy some high performance stuff and fix it? I'd prefer somewhere that will go ahead and order the special parts for me so that the parts are there whenever I want to go work on the car at my leisure. Oh, and if they can provide some free labor, that would be awesome too. In return, I'm willing to piss every user on every forum off by shouting out loud what a great shop they are. Thanks in advance for your help.

[Da Prez]

lol...

its good to hear that HPP and bill may have this resolved...

[JMAC]

This thread still here? Anyways, I just want to applaud Manny for handling this in a professional manner. +1

[Beenfetchedlately]

With the bill being only 2k, id pay it and get my car back and consider it a lesson learned on verbal contracts, no matter how much you think you know the person or how easy the contract could go sour.

This shit happens all the time. UNfortunately renigging on a verbal agreement will catch you in the end because he was more then helpful. i say go back and jack up his prices for the work he was being credited for and I bet it will come out even.

Anyone hear of AMS? If its not straightened out soon, this could be another episode of them. Friends and business never works out.

[Boost Addict]

I've always heard great things about Manny and crew, met him once but I'm sure he doesn't remember me.

This thing sounded waaaaay bad when I first read it, but I'm incredibly impressed with the moderate level of frustration and great deal of professionalism that's been displayed by HPP.

I won't mind if you guys want to give me a written quote for twins on the GT500 though...seriously! haha

[Beenfetchedlately]

everyone is going to have their opinions and personally ive been to dallas mustang slims gearheads and hpp, and yestereday manny treated me exceptionally well all i wanted was to fill my botte up and see what the air fuel was on the dyno but he went to greated links he did 4 pulls on the dyno data logged them even put a bottle heater on my car just for the pulls and gave me a nitrous jet all for 75 bucks now come on u cant ask for much better than that and i i paid gearheads 35 for 2 pulls and when i saw my #'s i was impressed i did 433 tq on a 75 shot and yesterday hpp's dyno was 375 big differnce well gearheads adds 8% for drivetrain loss i mean come on lets get real hpp knows whats up THATS MY OPINION
You are a fool for even trying to compare two totally different dynos in the first place.

[Fordboy91]

Sorry, but Bill acted like a high roller and turned out to be just another DFWStangs 30K a year millionaire.



You mean everyone here doesn't make 75k a year working 2 hrs a day 3 times a week? I guess that's what I get for believing everything I read on the board! hint hint

[wayne fontenot]

You mean everyone here doesn't make 75k a year working 2 hrs a day 3 times a week? I guess that's what I get for believing everything I read on the board! hint hint


or you can be like me and "dream" of 60k cars ;) ;)

whats up eddie...

[Fordboy91]

nothing just watching as "The days of our lives unfolds"

[wayne fontenot]

nothing just watching as "The days of our lives unfolds"

that stuff will fry your brain

[Fordboy91]

it has in this thread!

[360 Notch]

I dont go to the local ferrari shop and ask for a payment plan.

Its funny all the broke kiddos that want the million dollar toys for craigslist prices.

This story boils down to someone that had bigger eyes than their wallet.




HPP shouldnt loose any customers or keep from getting any customers out of this because the whole thread is about HPP doing the normal, rational thing in a professional business like manner.


If you dont like HPP thats too damn bad. This thread is about a subject other than you so loose the negative posts unlesss your Bill or work @ HPP. Start your own thread after you talk to HPP person to person.

What the hell is wrong with folks these days?

[SVT Lurch]

What the hell is wrong with folks these days?
Their parents weren't allowed to spank them for fear of child services taking them. :rolleyes:

[bobs94formula]

Their parents weren't allowed to spank them for fear of child services taking them. :rolleyes:


HAHA Hell I spanked my 4 year old today in front of everyone at the grocery store :D. I told him not to run in front of me and trip himself, and ofcourse he had to learn the hard way.

[Turbo5.4]

sig check...

[SVT Lurch]

HAHA Hell I spanked my 4 year old today in front of everyone at the grocery store :D. I told him not to run in front of me and trip himself, and ofcourse he had to learn the hard way.
I'm with you, kids have to learn sometime, and sooner is better than later.

[Fox466]

I was also initially skeptical of this, but have had my opinion of HPP changed a bit due to the way that Manny has handled this trainwreck of a deal gone bad. I can totally see Bill wanting the stickers in order to appear a bit more of a high roller racer, as that fits with the image he tried to sell here on the board.

Well done Manny, and shame on you Bill for not handling this in a more discreet and professional manner.

They always say that if you want to play you have to pay, which is what should be done at this point.

[blownaltered]

I think you're wrong. One, if I were going to drop some major cheddar of fixing up my car, I'd do some big time research. If I stumbled across an HPP thread where someone, AKA Colonel "Wild Bill" Sanders, I'd quickly find at least 2 times more "HPP is great!" threads than one like this one that bad mouths them.

Secondly, I personally wouldn't trust anything an unknown keyboard warrior said (good or bad), so I'd go check the shop out myself. I'd talk to the owner/manager, and I'd walk through the shop. I'd look closely at cars they are currently working on, and even ask to see some they had finished too. Then I'd ask for pricing on a certain part of the project to see how quickly they responded, their suggested build, and then the price/value of the quote. AFTER all of that, I'd make a decision based on my experience with the shop IN PERSON -- not because someone nuthugged or bashed them in a car forum.

That's just my personal modus operandi. Like I said earlier, I have no allegiance to HPP, but if I were to decide and change shops, I'd go visit them first based on my phone conversations there and with face to face experiences at the track. Now, get back to flaming whomever it was you were flaming!
Actually I wasn't flaming anybody. I was just making the comment that Bill did more harm posting this all over the internet than he has ever done them good. Even I think this is retarded what Bill did. You don't fuck your friends like that, that doesn't show very good caracter. Some people take this shit on the internet to serious ( no offence Seb ) and take what they read to heart. So yes some people will be influenced by these posts, most people no but some will. Everybody knows HPP and I haven't always gotten along and I realize lately I might have been a dick so I am trying to remedy that.

[Cooter]

BTW, lol @ the image of Bill the oil baron polishing wheels for cash like a shoeshine boy

[Andrew]

BTW, lol @ the image of Bill the oil baron polishing wheels for cash like a shoeshine boy

At least he's not too proud to work.

Edit: not a slam on you, just a reflection on his character.

[Nestromo]

At least he's not too proud to work.


You know what man... no shit.

[Cooter]

At least he's not too proud to work.

Edit: not a slam on you, just a reflection on his character.

he's very proud! I was under the impression that he was a friggin' oil tycoon the way he talked

[TOMMY]

he's very proud! I was under the impression that he was a friggin' oil tycoon the way he talked

x2

[Nestromo]

Does he still drive the red 'stroke? That was a damned nice truck.

[360 Notch]

just because you got property over the barnett shale dosent mean they will drill on your land.


<--------- wishes they would drill over my ranch in FT.W.

[Nestromo]

just because you got property over the barnett shale dosent mean they will drill on your land.


<--------- wishes they would drill over my ranch in FT.W.

Some people gave my parents $10,000 to look for oil on their property (obviously they get mass quantaties if oil is found) and after a certain amount of time they have to pay again to look. Time is 1/2 up and they still haven't looked... guess they will have to pay again. :confused:

EDIT: BTW I hope they don't find shit because I don't want the place to be a fucking dump. I love that land. My parents on the other hand want the money.

[Cmarsh93z]

I won't mind if you guys want to give me a written quote for twins on the GT500 though...seriously! haha

How about a Single PTE88.....I am wanting to see what the mod motors do with a nice single

[Fox466]

At least he's not too proud to work.

Edit: not a slam on you, just a reflection on his character.

Agreed to that point!

At this point none of us really have enough to cast the stone in any direction. After all, none of this is proveable as there is NO CONTRACT!

[360 Notch]

Some people gave my parents $10,000 to look for oil on their property (obviously they get mass quantaties if oil is found) and after a certain amount of time they have to pay again to look. Time is 1/2 up and they still haven't looked... guess they will have to pay again. :confused:

EDIT: BTW I hope they don't find shit because I don't want the place to be a fucking dump. I love that land. My parents on the other hand want the money.


yea, they did the same for me... this year is the last year of the contract.

[Nestromo]

yea, they did the same for me... this year is the last year of the contract.

Sweet. You pretty much hoping to keep your cash and have them leave your land the hell alone?

[Car-less Chris]

How about a Single PTE88.....I am wanting to see what the mod motors do with a nice single

we've got a single 91mm with a built 4v coming out soon..ill let ya ride with me cupcake.. ;)

[360 Notch]

Sweet. You pretty much hoping to keep your cash and have them leave your land the hell alone?


yup the only thing we did was clear a few fence lines for them to be able to drive the thump trucks thru.

We have it on our land... everyone seems too busy to pull it out, I see another contract comming this year.

[Cooter]

just because you got property over the barnett shale dosent mean they will drill on your land.


<--------- wishes they would drill over my ranch in FT.W.

I was under the impression he had mineral rights and active wells by the way he talked

[wayne fontenot]

How about a Single PTE88.....I am wanting to see what the mod motors do with a nice single


the mach 1 i have been referring to in this tread has a single 76 on it.

[1slocoupe]

A lot of you guys are talking about something you know nothing about. All the trash talking that he is doing and lieing is wrong, uncalled for, and will only make matters worse.
It all comes down to he doesn't have the money to finish what he started. He wanted to build an 8 sec. car, do some of you talking shit know what it takes to build an 8 sec. car. He was building off of another car we did for a guy. A car that was brought to us as a stock 01 cobra motor. The guy said I want to go 8's, never even been down a track. He now runs 5.5's in the 1/8th like nothing. You think you can build that for 20k???? That is the guy that spent 50k, he paid for it, and got what he wanted.
Bill talked a big game about all this oil he was going to be cashing in on. Which is the only reason 20-30k in parts were ordered for him. Everyone here knows how long bills car has been down. How many cars have been completed with similar setups, a ton. The problem with Bill is he did not have the money to finish his project. Not even with parts at cost.
We have had 20-30k out on this car for a year now. He only paid 8k out of his pocket. The rest he was trying to work off by polishing one turbo at a time. How many shops would let you do this? He made over 7k in credits towards his bill in transporting cars for us and polishing turbo's. He named his price and was paid. Sometimes even a little more to give him the oppurtunity to make credits for his bill.
We had a talk in early Dec., where we expressed to him that we needed for him to start making payments towards his bill. We have had to much money out to long, specially in a case where you are giving cost.
He got all mad, we talked about it some more, then he said all was cool. He waited for everyone to leave, took all his belongings and left. Nobody heard from him till just the other day. I tried calling him before christmas and new year with no answer or returned call.
Now all of sudden he shows up and says he is aborting the project and taking his car. He says to just take everything he still owes for off his bill. Stuff that has been special ordered for him and paid for.
At this point I removed as much as I could, close to 7k in parts. However I did change the price from cost to 10% over cost. Which is still a good deal. Why should we have to give cost on parts that were ordered a year ago and sitting around.
After all of this he was just going to owe another 2k to take all of his parts. Instead he chose to bash us, if we were going to have take all this BS. I should have raised it to retail. I don't owe him anything, he got paid for what he did and got plenty of other benefits.
I will give him his parts and car as soon as he pays for them.


To be honest with you after reading that post I think there is more to this story! You are VERY unprofessional in this post and I can tell you one thing if you represented MY company like that your ass would be out the door so fast you wouldnt know what happend. I think you should have really composed your thoughts before you posted this, but instead you decided to fly off the handle like I would and talk shit to someone. Representing a business and talking shit on your own behalf are two different things. Maybe you should take a lesson from North texas Nissan in their forums because they are PROFESSIONAL!

Sounds like a crook to me ASSEMBLE THE LYNCH MOB!! :p j/k

[mikeb]

I was under the impression he had mineral rights and active wells by the way he talked

Yeah, he sure worked at giving the impression of being financially loaded.

[1slocoupe]

I dont know what goes on behind doors but I do try to help everyone if they are calling just to ask a technical question or to order thousands of parts. Granted, I do get behind at times but i've never recalled being a "dick" to anyone. If I have, I sincerely apologize.

There have been issues in the past but I stand behind HPP and I do look out for the companies best interest. If there is ever any question of fairness Manny, Ozzie, and myself always try to find out where the breakdown was and fix it.

------

As far as the Bill situation goes, Im talking to him in person tomorrow. I have talked to him at great length on my personal cell phone and on my days off/after hours. We just want whats fair. Thats all.

-Wade


This is how you handle business....EXCELLENT! Are you the owner??

[Cooter]

To be honest with you after reading that post I think there is more to this story! You are VERY unprofessional in this post and I can tell you one thing if you represented MY company like that your ass would be out the door so fast you wouldnt know what happend. I think you should have really composed your thoughts before you posted this, but instead you decided to fly off the handle like I would and talk shit to someone. Representing a business and talking shit on your own behalf are two different things. Maybe you should take a lesson from North texas Nissan in their forums because they are PROFESSIONAL!

Sounds like a crook to me ASSEMBLE THE LYNCH MOB!! :p j/k

how is this unprofessional? :confused:

special order parts are paid for and often carry a restocking fee... at the very least, they're going to cost time/headache/lost opportunity

[bottlefedstang]

I know both parties involved and dont think either are crooks or shady its just a misunderstanding NO MORE NO LESS dont make a mountain out of a mole hill $2000 isnt a lot of money when it comes to building these cars both sides should bend a little and work out a compromise and carry on.:cool:

[RED]

This is how you handle business....EXCELLENT! Are you the owner??

You cant be that stupid? :confused: That or you are just a hater. :rolleyes:

[1slocoupe]

how is this unprofessional? :confused:

special order parts are paid for and often carry a restocking fee... at the very least, they're going to cost time/headache/lost opportunity


he could have left the part out about people talking shit ETC :rolleyes: This guy sounds like an asshole just from his post. I know what kind of guy wayne is, and what he told me was pretty shitty. I knew jeremy from the track he was one cool dude but there were a few douches that came out with him from time to time that almost got themselfs thrown out by acting like idiots (Drinking and talking shit). I wasnt questioning the parts part of it I was questioning his professionalism toward bill in the responses. No matter how mad you get at a person when you own a business you are supposed to address the situation without douchebaggery :rolleyes: I dont know either person involved I just threw my .02 in there like all of you other jackasses did that didnt know either party :p

[360 Notch]

reality check...

How was Manny unprofessional when someone is posting bad shit, smearing his companies name all over the internet.

I think Manny is showing great restraint.


badchev are you a GHP lackie or what?

[564826]

How old is this "bill" guy?

[fordracing19]

How old is this "bill" guy?
Antique.

[JKD]

How old is this "bill" guy?


He's in his 50's. Looks like he's in his 80's.

[JKD]

You cant be that stupid? :confused: That or you are just a hater. :rolleyes:

Actually, he is that stupid.

[crazy03]

the mach 1 i have been referring to in this tread has a single 76 on it.
WoW....60k in a mach with a 76 and a daily driver. The owner must have paid a shit load for the car in stock form...
Ive got every recipt for my 03 cobra that total 55k with a 76 and I only paid 21k for the car. And just droped another 8k for more parts...lets see = 63k :rolleyes:
And Manny will tune the car with the safest tune for the power. And I would really like you to post a dyno sheet of this car making 1k rwhp. Of course you can make the dyno read what ever you want...just saying :eek:

[Nestromo]

WoW....60k in a mach with a 76 and a daily driver. The owner must have paid a shit load for the car in stock form...
Ive got every recipt for my 03 cobra that total 55k with a 76 and I only paid 21k for the car. And just droped another 8k for more parts...lets see = 63k :rolleyes:
And Manny will tune the car with the safest tune for the power. And I would really like you to post a dyno sheet of this car making 1k rwhp. Of course you can make the dyno read what ever you want...just saying :eek:

Wayne seems like the kind of guy that will be honest about it if it doesn't make the power.

Wayne is a really cool guy. I had never even met the guy before and I was pulling my codes at O'Reilly and it turned out to be bad O2s. Wayne stopped and was like "Come on over to my place, I think I'vegot a couple of spares in an H-Pipe somewhere". He couldn't find the spare O2s but that is a pretty cool gesture if you ask me. :cool:

[SVT Lurch]

How about a Single PTE88.....I am wanting to see what the mod motors do with a nice single
Check this (http://www.musclemustangfastfords.com/features/mmfp_0609_1997_ford_mustang_svt_cobra/index.html) one out.

[MadScientist]

Waiting on Forensix to come to the rescue with the cash. Those pity fucks had to be worth a lot of cash.
I am taking up a collection now. PM me for my paypal info.

[01WhiteCobra]

How old is this "bill" guy?

He is so old I call him grandpa and I'm fucking old.

[manny]

he could have left the part out about people talking shit ETC :rolleyes: This guy sounds like an asshole just from his post. I know what kind of guy wayne is, and what he told me was pretty shitty. I knew jeremy from the track he was one cool dude but there were a few douches that came out with him from time to time that almost got themselfs thrown out by acting like idiots (Drinking and talking shit). I wasnt questioning the parts part of it I was questioning his professionalism toward bill in the responses. No matter how mad you get at a person when you own a business you are supposed to address the situation without douchebaggery :rolleyes: I dont know either person involved I just threw my .02 in there like all of you other jackasses did that didnt know either party :p



I could have left the part about people talking shit out, maybe I did lose my cool a little. I did lose my cool a little because I could not believe what was going on. The first time we discussed anything of him & his car leaving was last monday, he said take this and that off my bill and let me know what it is by Fri. Then we discussed it Fri. night, he flipped out because he expected to pay nothing. He was not reasonable to talk to, he was throwing out crazy options. Then he called the police, and they basically told him to go home. That ended discussion for the night.
I actually lost sleep that night thinking of what could be taken off the bill to make it square up. I didn't even know why he was getting so crazy with us, we had never had any issues prior as far as I new. I called him the very next morning to talk about a solution. Then everyone tells me to look at the internet. He was totally lieing and making a big scene to get his car back and some parts for free. Which is nobody's business to be on the internet. The reason there was no contract is because it wasn't a big racing contract like he thought I guess. It was us helping him with the cost of parts & labor, thats all it was. He was going to drive the truck & trailor with our race car & his, because he likes to drive. He cheered our name because I gave him good deals & he liked us from the begining. He had stickers because he liked them before we ever gave him cost on parts, just like plenty of customers have stickers. However he did take it one step farther on everything including shouting the name.
I could not believe he posted all that crap, after he stood in front of me 10hrs before. Saying I would never say a bad word about you guys, I still want to help, a whole bunch of BS. Then he goes to Full Attack on every board he is not banned from. I could not believe what I was seeing. I took it as a personal attack to me. He knows how much it would bother me to see him dragging our name. I have worked way to hard for over 10years for him to do that. This should have never come to the internet. It was his personal business, since he aired out a story. I felt the need to give mine. Some owners will stay silent some are very good at sweet sarcastic approach. I'm sure in the car business you have a lot of oppurtunity to work that. Rob definately could have worded my statements a little more "Proffesional".

I find it very hard to believe that they were going to throw me out of any track for talking shit. Specially for drinking, considering I rarely ever drink. I or no one that is pitted with us, is drinking at the track. I don't know where that came from.

BTW what was so shitty in Wayne's case? I wouldn't add more timing to the tune? I recomend he try Torco or race gas? So it is shitty for a tuner to not add any more timing then he feels comfortable with? Do you know the circumstances of that day? The car dictates when you should stop adding timing not the owner. If the car is showing signs of detonation or not picking up power for the added timing, why add it? I have talked to Wayne and we understand each other.
Benfecthed he was paid for what he did. He had to match a lot of prices because I could get them done for less.

BTW Bill has his car and his parts as of today. Good luck to him and his new sponsors in AZ. It sounds like they are anxious to get started.

[1slocoupe]

You didnt mention anything about calling the police!! Thats chickenshit!! Wayne is a GOOD guy, hes a police officer or ex police officer and hes the kinda guy that will stop and help someone in need, He's a really good guy Ive hung out with him I dont know how many times, and he not a liar thats for sure.... Well I was right, manny mentioned the police getting called and mr.bill getting a little bit on the crazy side but atleast he came back right. I might have to get a hold of you manny when I need to get my nitrous filled!!

[SEB]

I could have left the part about people talking shit out, maybe I did lose my cool a little. I did lose my cool a little because I could not believe what was going on. The first time we discussed anything of him & his car leaving was last monday, he said take this and that off my bill and let me know what it is by Fri. Then we discussed it Fri. night, he flipped out because he expected to pay nothing. He was not reasonable to talk to, he was throwing out crazy options. Then he called the police, and they basically told him to go home. That ended discussion for the night.
I actually lost sleep that night thinking of what could be taken off the bill to make it square up. I didn't even know why he was getting so crazy with us, we had never had any issues prior as far as I new. I called him the very next morning to talk about a solution. Then everyone tells me to look at the internet. He was totally lieing and making a big scene to get his car back and some parts for free. Which is nobody's business to be on the internet. The reason there was no contract is because it wasn't a big racing contract like he thought I guess. It was us helping him with the cost of parts & labor, thats all it was. He was going to drive the truck & trailor with our race car & his, because he likes to drive. He cheered our name because I gave him good deals & he liked us from the begining. He had stickers because he liked them before we ever gave him cost on parts, just like plenty of customers have stickers. However he did take it one step farther on everything including shouting the name.
I could not believe he posted all that crap, after he stood in front of me 10hrs before. Saying I would never say a bad word about you guys, I still want to help, a whole bunch of BS. Then he goes to Full Attack on every board he is not banned from. I could not believe what I was seeing. I took it as a personal attack to me. He knows how much it would bother me to see him dragging our name. I have worked way to hard for over 10years for him to do that. This should have never come to the internet. It was his personal business, since he aired out a story. I felt the need to give mine. Some owners will stay silent some are very good at sweet sarcastic approach. I'm sure in the car business you have a lot of oppurtunity to work that. Rob definately could have worded my statements a little more "Proffesional".

I find it very hard to believe that they were going to throw me out of any track for talking shit. Specially for drinking, considering I rarely ever drink. I or no one that is pitted with us, is drinking at the track. I don't know where that came from.

BTW what was so shitty in Wayne's case? I wouldn't add more timing to the tune? I recomend he try Torco or race gas? So it is shitty for a tuner to not add any more timing then he feels comfortable with? Do you know the circumstances of that day? The car dictates when you should stop adding timing not the owner. If the car is showing signs of detonation or not picking up power for the added timing, why add it? I have talked to Wayne and we understand each other.
Benfecthed he was paid for what he did. He had to match a lot of prices because I could get them done for less.

BTW Bill has his car and his parts as of today. Good luck to him and his new sponsors in AZ. It sounds like they are anxious to get started.

Good Job Manny!

You handled this well. Big props. I still think it is bad for your buisness for this to come on a board where you get alot of buisness from.

I like HPP & would use them again. IF I HAD A MOD MOTOR CAR> :D

[wayne fontenot]

i want to come on this thread and publicly appologize to manny for the sarcastic remarks. we have discussed the matter of the mach 1. i still disagree about the timing issue, the car picked up more power when the timing was added by another tuner. but we can agree to disagree. we have also discussed through pm's the owner of a saleen project i'm working on going to him for the tune. i have never and will never come on here and insult anyone. i will voice an opinion.
in closing, i am man enough to say i'm sorry to someone i have offended or wronged.


I'M SORRY :D :D

[1slocoupe]

i want to come on this thread and publicly appologize to manny for the sarcastic remarks. we have discussed the matter of the mach 1. i still disagree about the timing issue, the car picked up more power when the timing was added by another tuner. but we can agree to disagree. we have also discussed through pm's the owner of a saleen project i'm working on going to him for the tune. i have never and will never come on here and insult anyone. i will voice an opinion.
in closing, i am man enough to say i'm sorry to someone i have offended or wronged.


I'M SORRY :D :D


Im not as far as im concerned all of yall are bitches! :p

[BigShoe]

Man if I deleated this I could fuck up some post counts :D , BTW Im disappointed only 5 pages?

[Fordboy91]

You didnt mention anything about calling the police!! Thats chickenshit!! Wayne is a GOOD guy, hes a police officer or ex police officer and hes the kinda guy that will stop and help someone in need, He's a really good guy Ive hung out with him I dont know how many times, and he not a liar thats for sure.... Well I was right, manny mentioned the police getting called and mr.bill getting a little bit on the crazy side but atleast he came back right. I might have to get a hold of you manny when I need to get my nitrous filled!!


Wayne is a great guy. When I went to pick up my car in Wichita Falls, I stopped in Denton, my wife and kids stayed at his house and he jumped in the truck with me and rode the rest of the way on a Saturday. When we got back he started tinkering with my car. I bought a set of lower control arms from him and he called me back and said "instead of just lowers(BBK), I got some upper and lowers for ya.(Lakewoods)" He's also bringing me a box of parts on his way to Beaumont to pick up the Mach 1 that I can attest to. He's worked on my cars before and would hardly let me pay him if I helped out even a little. If you need someone to help you and you live in/around Denton, if he can, he will.

[8mpg]

Im not as far as im concerned all of yall are bitches! :p
I love that gif in your sig... I have to stop and watch it a couple times everytime I see you post.

[whiteboy]

To be honest with you after reading that post I think there is more to this story! You are VERY unprofessional in this post and I can tell you one thing if you represented MY company like that your ass would be out the door so fast you wouldnt know what happend. I think you should have really composed your thoughts before you posted this, but instead you decided to fly off the handle like I would and talk shit to someone. Representing a business and talking shit on your own behalf are two different things. Maybe you should take a lesson from North texas Nissan in their forums because they are PROFESSIONAL!

Sounds like a crook to me ASSEMBLE THE LYNCH MOB!! :p j/k

People who live in glass houses shouldnt throw rocks. What do you know about anything? :confused:

[Baron]

People who live in glass houses shouldnt throw rocks. :confused:
Unless they are locked in, and need to get out. Then, of course, only people who live in glass houses should throw rocks.

[Turbo5.4]

to be honest when you sit down and talk to manny person to person he is actually a okay guy....

[Stephen]

to be honest when you sit down and talk to manny person to person he is actually a okay guy....
personally i have ever met manny but i have heard nothing but things about him from my buddy who owns the plumbing company across the street fro him (enco). i also have seen his shop several times as i sometimes attend the auction behind his shop on wed nights and it always seems there is cool cars there

[Cooter]

everyone I've met and talked to at HPP has been decent and great to talk with one-on-one

sometimes when you go up there the reception can be a little more chilly if they're busy working on something, but that's to be expected with any shop that's busy