Libby was convicted... [Archive]

Walsted

03-06-2007, 09:02 PM

...a pretty ugly scandal for the bush administration who is doing it's best to maintain credibility.

Credibility?

Assuming I remember everything correctly-
The irony is that the whole thing happened because of Joe's improper behavior, and yet he is the first in front of the press to make a statement. The low-life scum didn't fully complete the investigation he was hired to do, used incomplete work to support his political position, (since he quit once he found what he wanted without further investigation,) and went to the press with findings that weren't supposed to be released to the press, and yet he is one of the first to say that justice is being done. His credibility is so low that mathemeticians can't even comprehend those numbers. Even if I agreed with the low-life scum's politics, I could not bring myself to trust him, since both he and his wife have shown that they let political leanings get in the way of their properly accomplishing the job they were hired to do. Joe and Valerie commenting on the trial seems to me to be the height of hypocracy. Although his opinion regarding the yellowcake wasn't classified, he violated public trust since he divulged the report without following proper channels. If life was fair, whatever happens to Libby should happen to Joe Wilson, and Valerie should lose her job due to violation of public trust for recommending her husband for the position without disclosing that it was her husband.

I sort of think that Libby was unsure of what was going on, and got caught up in the crossfire, but haven't been following the Libby case close enough to make intelligent comments as to what he knew or said or was confused about. And yes, I would feel the same if the Republican/Democrat situation were reversed - One shouldn't betray those paying you just to advance your own political agenda. Joe and Valerie did that. I don't think anything that Libby did lowers his credibility below Joe or Valerie's because of this, but again, I didn't follow the Libby case real close.

By the way, I did not mean to insult scum, which do have a purpose, by equating Joe with scum. Unfortunately, my mind is not extensive enough to come up with an appropriate equivalent to Joe, who took money from the government under false pretenses, (those pretenses being that he wasn't biased and would do a complete investigation,) and then used the results of a poorly done job to forward a political agenda.

Of course, others may disagree, which is encouraged. But you won't change my mind about Joe Wilson. He and Valerie should both lose their government pensions at minimum.

Paladin

03-06-2007, 09:19 PM

pretty damn scary considering this guy was the white house chief of staff and basically a security advisor to dick cheney.

a pretty ugly scandal for the bush administration who is doing it's best to maintain credibility.

This is no such thing. Get off moveon.org for awhile and see what this really was.

There was some prior counsel for Gore on Hannity and Colmes and even he admitted this was not anything to do with the administration, it was a conviction for Libby not remembering something. If his liberal ass can see it, why can't you?

I remember quite a few of you liberals talking about how insignificant Clinton's lies were and defending him, but you accuse Libby of being some major criminal? You have no credibility you idiot.

black01gt

03-06-2007, 09:28 PM

, it was a conviction for Libby not remembering something.
Unbelievable :confused: Fucking unbelieveable....

The prefect zombie.

Slowhand

03-06-2007, 09:34 PM

can someone remind me what the implications for him revealing her name were?

Mustangman_2000

03-06-2007, 09:36 PM

This is no such thing. Get off moveon.org for awhile and see what this really was.

There was some prior counsel for Gore on Hannity and Colmes and even he admitted this was not anything to do with the administration, it was a conviction for Libby not remembering something. If his liberal ass can see it, why can't you?

I remember quite a few of you liberals talking about how insignificant Clinton's lies were and defending him, but you accuse Libby of being some major criminal? You have no credibility you idiot.

ok sean hannity.......

i just was sitting back reading this post and i just realized what a complete radical right conservative you are.

you said he was convicted for not remembering something?

wow! do you hear the SPIN bullshit that is coming out of your keyboard?

scooter libby was convicted for a very serious crime my friend in a court of law.

scooter libby was white house chief of staff in the bush administration and he is now convicted of a serious crime.

He was convicted of perjury, obstruction and lying to the FBI in the 2003 leak of CIA operative Valerie Plame's identity.

there is no SPIN cycle that will wash this stain out the pants of the bush administration.

I remember quite a few of you liberals talking about how insignificant Clinton's lies were and defending him, but you accuse Libby of being some major criminal? You have no credibility you idiot.

you just exposed how clueless you really are right here ^.

you will not find anywhere where i said bill clinton lying under oatch was insignificant. as a matter of fact, i have admitted that he lied and said i was very disappointed and disgusted in him.

you just showed me you pull this crap out of your ass with no grasp of what has really been said or proven.

Sean88gt

03-06-2007, 10:52 PM

This case should have never happened and only came to trial because of Fitzgerald's hunger for a fall guy.

Mustangman_2000, you are helping your cause. You simply come off as an extremely left leaning ass.

Libby was the Chief of Staff to the VP, no the Chief of Staff for the white house.

Mustangman_2000

03-06-2007, 11:07 PM

This case should have never happened and only came to trial because of Fitzgerald's hunger for a fall guy.

^^that's funny.

that's exactly what a lot of democrats said about bill clinton when ken starr nearly got him impeached for lying under oath about monica lewinsky.

and what would your reaction be to that statement?

probably the same reaction i have to your statement above.

Vertnut

03-06-2007, 11:14 PM

Bill lied about more than Monica. Please put that weak-ass shit up...

Sean88gt

03-06-2007, 11:18 PM

^^that's funny.

that's exactly what a lot of democrats said about bill clinton when ken starr nearly got him impeached for lying under oath about monica lewinsky.

and what would your reaction be to that statement?

probably the same reaction i have to your statement above.

It's different. He flat out lied and did so about something that was more degrading to the office than what Libby did (not the president btw)

You remind me of Ed Schultz. Did you vote for Reagan and then cancel your moral standings to become progressive as well?

Mustangman_2000

03-06-2007, 11:25 PM

It's different. He flat out lied and did so about something that was more degrading to the office than what Libby did (not the president btw)

your logic is scary.

a lie is somehow different because of the rank of the individual?

that's laughable.

and i'm sorry to break the news to you, but exposing a covert CIA agent can be potentially a death sentence for an operative in the field. and not to mention the security concerns of an exposed agent.

that in no way is tantamount to a blow job in the oval office that doesn't hurt anyone except your self-righteous moral standards.

scooter libby perjured himself (lied) ,obstructed justice, and lied to FBI.

he's been convicted of a serious crime and that's the end of story.

his case is an example the corruption that was cited as a concern for the voters back in novermber.

99SVTour

03-07-2007, 01:12 AM

you just showed me you pull this crap out of your ass with no grasp of what has really been said or proven.

In other threads you have been given facts that disprove your opinions, you have been given facts that disprove your "facts" on some occasions, and some of your facts have been proven to be nothing but left spun propaganda that you've bought into, and you have either stubbornly, or blindly refused to acknowledge that any of it has been dis-proven so I really dont think you should be the one telling others about grasping reality.

Mach1Marauder

03-07-2007, 02:14 AM

can someone remind me what the implications for him revealing her name were?
Ummmmmm....HE didn't reveal her as a agent.

Paladin

03-07-2007, 08:10 AM

Unbelievable :confused: Fucking unbelieveable....

The prefect zombie.

As Gore's fromer counsel pointed out, Libby didn't out her, he wasn't even involved in the outing. He apparently did a Martha Stewart, at least that is what he compared it to.

Sean88gt

03-07-2007, 08:13 AM

your logic is scary.
Brilliant, ain't I?

a lie is somehow different because of the rank of the individual?

that's laughable.
Lying is no different, but the position absolutely is. Clinton was receiving oral treats from that sow while in the line of duty. He made decisions around that and also launched weapons to cover it up.

and i'm sorry to break the news to you, but exposing a covert CIA agent can be potentially a death sentence for an operative in the field. and not to mention the security concerns of an exposed agent.

Are you insane???? He didn't reveal anyone. The guy that revealed the CIA Agent, who wasn't even in the field at the time went to Patrick Fitzgerald and admitted he was the leak, albeit accidental. This trial was not about the outting of the CIA agent, but more so about how Libby had come into the knowledge of her.

that in no way is tantamount to a blow job in the oval office that doesn't hurt anyone except your self-righteous moral standards.
I don't give a shit if he was pulling a train on Algore. It has nothing to do with my morals. What it does have to do with is 1) Disrespect and disregard for the Office, 2) Shelving national security, 3) Trying to take the heat off by starting a conflict.

scooter libby perjured himself (lied) ,obstructed justice, and lied to FBI.
You're right, he was, although he wasn't convicted on lying to the FBI, so you should recant your blatantly false statement. But as I've said, this trial never should have happened, and never would have if the original trial about the outting of the agent would have resulted in a conviction.

he's been convicted of a serious crime and that's the end of story.
Yes he was, but once again, it was bullshit and based around Fitzgerald wanting blood.

his case is an example the corruption that was cited as a concern for the voters back in novermber.
And you called me a self-righteous moralist - are you kidding me? The democrats lie, cheat, and steal more than the republicans ever have. Quit toting the company line and taking every talking point hook, line, and sinker. You are intolerant. That isn't the liberal way that King Bill showed you in the 90's :rolleyes:

Mach1Marauder

03-07-2007, 08:24 AM

and i'm sorry to break the news to you, but exposing a covert CIA agent can be potentially a death sentence for an operative in the field. and not to mention the security concerns of an exposed agent.

WTF you YOU know of exposing a CIA agent? :rolleyes:

You need to read about when it becomes an offense to reveal an agent. The judge said several times in the trial that he didn't know if she was covert or not and no one testified to that fact. BESIDES .......Libby DIDN'T leak it that she was an agent.

black01gt

03-07-2007, 08:26 AM

Brilliant, ain't I?

Lying is no different, but the position absolutely is. Clinton was receiving oral treats from that sow while in the line of duty. He made decisions around that and also launched weapons to cover it up.

Quick...pull the Clinton card! Yessir, brilliant.

Cheney/Bush/Rove don't need no stinking weapons for a coverup. They've lucked on to Anna Nicole Smith dropping dead and we can watch re-runs of her funeral everyday til this passes from the so called "liberal" media. :D

OneFastCat

03-07-2007, 08:34 AM

but wait for the curtain call, when the Pardon comes down from 1600 Pennsylvania Ave later this year. You gotta love a lame duck.

Mustangman_2000

03-07-2007, 09:15 AM

WTF you YOU know of exposing a CIA agent? :rolleyes:

You need to read about when it becomes an offense to reveal an agent. The judge said several times in the trial that he didn't know if she was covert or not and no one testified to that fact. BESIDES .......Libby DIDN'T leak it that she was an agent.

yep, he did nothing wrong.

there is just this pesky issue of him perjuring himself and lying to the FBI.

oh wait...that's right, that's why he was convicted and will be going to jail.

unless bush pardons him at the last minute.

Mach1Marauder

03-07-2007, 09:21 AM

yep, he did nothing wrong.

there is just this pesky issue of him perjuring himself and lying to the FBI.

oh wait...that's right, that's why he was convicted and will be going to jail.

unless bush pardons him at the last minute.
Hey dinglehead!
Can you ONCE drop the stupid liberal bull shit and address the actual subject to that YOU reply to??
FUCK I HATE THAT! :mad:

Mustangman_2000

03-07-2007, 09:37 AM

Hey dinglehead!
Can you ONCE drop the stupid liberal bull shit and address the actual subject to that YOU reply to??
FUCK I HATE THAT! :mad:

well, i don't know of any way else to put it.

he's been convicted of a serious crime.

anyway you look at it he did something wrong during his tenure in the bush white house.

you can spin and alter the meaning of the words, but at the end of the day he is a convicted felon.

Mach1Marauder

03-07-2007, 09:43 AM

well, i don't know of any way else to put it.

he's been convicted of a serious crime.

anyway you look at it he did something wrong during his tenure in the bush white house.

you can spin and alter the meaning of the words, but at the end of the day he is a convicted felon.
Fine.....You continue to make statements, yet refuse to address what people call you out on. No wonder everyone calls you a tard.
Dude, You need to start thinking for yourself and get off the liberal high horse.
I predict he'll get a new trial on the motion or appeal and Bush WILL NOT pardon him.

Mustangman_2000

03-07-2007, 09:54 AM

Fine.....You continue to make statements, yet refuse to address what people call you out on. No wonder everyone calls you a tard.
Dude, You need to start thinking for yourself and get off the liberal high horse.
I predict he'll get a new trial on the motion or appeal and Bush WILL NOT pardon him.

we'll see how things work out with the appeal.

it doesn't look good for him right now.

aceman85turbo

03-07-2007, 10:05 AM

we'll see how things work out with the appeal.

it doesn't look good for him right now.

1300 posts bashing our government, you and that iranian-canadian moron can live together with the french in canada.

Mustangman_2000

03-07-2007, 10:13 AM

1300 posts bashing our government, you and that iranian-canadian moron can live together with the french in canada.

having the right to question your government is the very foundation of democracy.

and i don't live in canada.

Mach1Marauder

03-07-2007, 01:37 PM

and i don't live in canada.
You need to move! :p

Sean88gt

03-07-2007, 01:53 PM

having the right to question your government is the very foundation of democracy.

and i don't live in canada.

There are a lot of foundations of democracy and the Democrats are stripping them away one at a time.

Like trying to ban certain words because they are offensive, ban firearms, and on and on and on.

I think you are to liberal for even Canada.

Casper

03-07-2007, 01:55 PM

In other news, Joe Wilson has yet to be indicted for perjury during sworn testimony to a Senate Subcommitte.

Mach1Marauder

03-07-2007, 02:15 PM

In other news, Joe Wilson has yet to be indicted for perjury during sworn testimony to a Senate Subcommitte.
That Senate Subcommitte that found that his editorial full of lies too? ;)

mikeb

03-07-2007, 02:23 PM

This whole deal seems fishy (ie: witchhunt) to me. I see an appeal in the future.

And valerie plame is kind of cute. I thought she would look like janet reno or something.

Paladin

03-07-2007, 02:33 PM

and i'm sorry to break the news to you, but exposing a covert CIA agent can be potentially a death sentence for an operative in the field. and not to mention the security concerns of an exposed agent..

You don't even understand the allegations against Libby if you think he has been accused of outing a covert agent. Maybe that is why you look so stupid on this topic, you don't know the basic facts.

[QUOTE=Mustangman_2000]that in no way is tantamount to a blow job in the oval office that doesn't hurt anyone except your self-righteous moral standards.[QUOTE]

No one is saying the BJ hurt anyone, just that a sitting President lied to the country when he denied it and perjured himself in sworn testimony. I say any time Libby gets should have also been given to your hero. That would be fair, right?

I am not even going to go into Hillary wanting to run the country and yet she will allow her filandering husband to embarass her, disrespect her, and not honor his vow to her. Yeah, she seems like a good candidate for your liberal straight ticket voting Dems. :rolleyes:

Paladin

03-07-2007, 02:35 PM

we'll see how things work out with the appeal.

it doesn't look good for him right now.

How would you be in a position to assess Libby's situation? You still think he was accused of outing a CIA agent!

Mach1Marauder

03-07-2007, 02:37 PM

How would you be in a position to assess Libby's situation? You still think he was accused of outing a CIA agent!
Dee dee dee? :D

Paladin

03-07-2007, 02:38 PM

having the right to question your government is the very foundation of democracy.

and i don't live in canada.

Of course we do, but you Dems have gone way too far and have begun to border on treason for calling a sitting President, in a time of war, a liar and a murderer. Yeah, you have voted for people who have called President Bush a liar if you have voted straight ticket Democrat, and we all know you have.

shrp88lx's

03-07-2007, 03:01 PM

Bush SHOULD pardon him and I think he will!!!

Vertnut

03-07-2007, 04:03 PM

Bush SHOULD pardon him and I think he will!!!
Ever seen the list of shit-heads that Clinton pardoned?

Casper

03-07-2007, 04:04 PM

That Senate Subcommitte that found that his editorial full of lies too? ;)

That's the one. I wonder if anything is going to come of that?

Surely there isn't any bias in the law...

jyro

03-07-2007, 04:13 PM

http://www.washtimes.com/op-ed/20050412-095319-4664r.htm

Sandy Berger (served as the 19th United States National Security Advisor under President Bill Clinton from 1997 to 2001) --- stole some of the nation's most highly classified terrorism documents from the National Archives. He scissored them to pieces in his downtown Washington offices. Then he lied about it.

or Hillary
On May 16, 1996, the Senate Whitewater committee votes to subpoena FBI reports showing that Hillary Clinton's fingerprints were found on hundreds of pages of Rose law Firm documents found in the White House residence quarters in January. The records, subpoenaed in 1994, and had been missing. In a two-page affidavit to Senate Whitewater investigators on June 17th, Hillary Clinton states that she "does not know" how her Rose Law Firm billing records ended up in the White House.

Stevo

03-07-2007, 05:43 PM

http://www.pionusparrot.com/photogallery/AnimatedScreamingParrot.gif
Same ol' dribble from the forum parrot.

Stevo

Mustangman_2000

03-07-2007, 06:50 PM

you guys can spin this and try and rationalize this conviction all you want.

he was convicted of perjury, obstructing justice, and lying..

end of story.

you guys don't have the balls to admit when a member of your party is wrong or liable for any wrong doing.

it's hilarious and cowardly to deny the truth of your parties wrong doings.

Mustangman_2000

03-07-2007, 06:51 PM

There are a lot of foundations of democracy and the Democrats are stripping them away one at a time.

Like trying to ban certain words because they are offensive, ban firearms, and on and on and on.

I think you are to liberal for even Canada.

congrats!

you just listed the personal freedoms of all u.s. citizens.

sorry you can't handle it.

Mustangman_2000

03-07-2007, 06:57 PM

Libby is "the highest-ranking White House official convicted in a government scandal since National Security Advisor John Poindexter in the Iran-Contra Affair."[3]

After deliberating for ten days, the jury rendered its verdict at noon on March 6, 2007.[36] It convicted Libby on four of the five counts against him—two counts of perjury, one count of obstructing justice in a grand jury investigation, and one of the two counts of making false statements to federal investigators

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lewis_Libby

^^ :)

Stevo

03-07-2007, 07:03 PM

...... your party.... ......your parties...

Did a republican buttfuck you when you were a child? Why this daily right wing bashing? Do you not realize what kind of idiot you appear to everyone?

For the record, idiot, most all the people that have been countering your idiotic dribble are not republicans, they are just people , and they disagree with the shit you are spouting. Or, they have outright proof that the shit you are attempting to spread is just the mindless banter of another leftist parrot.

Also, I am still waiting for you to post all the wonderful things that the democrats have done for our country in the past thirty years. :rolleyes:

Stevo

Mustangman_2000

03-07-2007, 07:08 PM

Stevo

03-07-2007, 07:21 PM

lol...

i'm an idiot.

college graduate, retired paramedic rural metro ambulance, cancer survivor, cisco network engineer.

you got me dude.

i guess i'm done here.

Yeah, idiot. I see nothing in this post of yours that would change anything.

It is truly a shame you cannot step out of your hateful self, and read the shit you post from a truly neutral point of view.

Stevo

Mustangman_2000

03-07-2007, 07:37 PM

Yeah, idiot. I see nothing in this post of yours that would change anything.

It is truly a shame you cannot step out of your hateful self, and read the shit you post from a truly neutral point of view.

Stevo

who is neutral towards me?

and you want me to show you how democrats made positive impacts on this country in the last 30 years.

why? it would be dismissed and you know it.

so why even bother to ask me to do that?

black01gt

03-07-2007, 07:50 PM

Did a republican buttfuck you when you were a child? Why this daily right wing bashing? Do you not realize what kind of idiot you appear to everyone?

For the record, idiot, most all the people that have been countering your idiotic dribble are not republicans, they are just people , and they disagree with the shit you are spouting.
daaayum dude, you doth protest too much. But it will get ya points here. How many do you need?

"...they are just people". Aw...that's so sweet. What's that slurping noise...

"nuetral point of view..." On DFWStangs??? :D ...right :D

Mustangman_2000

03-07-2007, 07:57 PM

daaayum dude, you doth protest too much. But it will get ya points here. How many do you need?

"...they are just people". Aw...that's so sweet. What's that slurping noise...

"nuetral point of view..." On DFWStangs??? :D ...right :D

i'm glad to see i'm not the only one that got a laugh out of that statement.

mr. stevo talks about giving a neutral comment, but on dfwstangs we know that there is no such thing.

if you aren't pro-conservative then you are labeled all kinds of clever insulting and disparaging names to try and cover up the intolerance and anger over an outsider have a different opinion than the majority.

Stevo

03-07-2007, 08:06 PM

who is neutral towards me?

and you want me to show you how democrats made positive impacts on this country in the last 30 years.

why? it would be dismissed and you know it.

so why even bother to ask me to do that?

Not many people will be neutral with you when it is apparent that almost every thread you start only has one objective, to bash republicans. You are just a puppet, a mouthpiece for the hardline leftists that have no plan other than attack republicans.

You want people to vote democrat? Then tell your democratic leaders to LISTEN TO THE PEOPLE OF AMERICA! If they would actually get a plan, and do some good for America, instead of just bashing the other side, they might get a moderate vote or two.

Stevo

Stevo

03-07-2007, 08:07 PM

daaayum dude, you doth protest too much. But it will get ya points here. How many do you need?

"...they are just people". Aw...that's so sweet. What's that slurping noise...

"nuetral point of view..." On DFWStangs??? :D ...right :D

http://www.pionusparrot.com/photogallery/AnimatedScreamingParrot.gif

:rolleyes:

Stevo

Mustangman_2000

03-07-2007, 08:29 PM

Not many people will be neutral with you when it is apparent that almost every thread you start only has one objective, to bash republicans. You are just a puppet, a mouthpiece for the hardline leftists that have no plan other than attack republicans.

You want people to vote democrat? Then tell your democratic leaders to LISTEN TO THE PEOPLE OF AMERICA! If they would actually get a plan, and do some good for America, instead of just bashing the other side, they might get a moderate vote or two.

Stevo

i believe the people of america spoke up during last nov. elections.

i believe we won the house, senate, and majority governorships.

i think the majority of the america voters clearly expressed their dissatisfaction in the voting booths.

i think the politicians don't have to listen...i think they are being outright inundated by the expressed concerns and displeasure over our current government and presidential administration.

whens the last time you've looked at the presidents approval ratings?

and if you don't care about thost stats..who cares, because people in the white house sure do.

black01gt

03-07-2007, 08:32 PM

if you aren't pro-conservative then you are labeled all kinds of clever insulting and disparaging names to try and cover up the intolerance and anger over an outsider have a different opinion than the majority.
That's just it, I am pro conservative and there ain't a God damned thing conservative about this administration no matter how much they thump their chest and proclaim "DEAD OR ALIVE" type bullshit. Bush spends money like his daddy is still writing his allowance checks even tho he is not..we are. We're spending a fortune and not getting shit in return.

"...insulting and desparaging..." true (like I give a shit), "clever"... come on. When it's a topic that's hard to spin, it's like rattling the monkey cage. They like the tactic of name calling, bullying (gang mentality style), or pulling the Clinton card. Same principle as pulling the race card.

Here you go. Watch below for instant results:

black01gt

03-07-2007, 08:40 PM

whens the last time you've looked at the presidents approval ratings?

and if you don't care about thost stats..who cares, because people in the white house sure do.
Yeah but that 71% of the population don't know what the Gangleader of DFWStangs, 90 Notch and his good followers know!!!

They're all idiots, morons, fucktards, tards, liberals, democrats, liberal democrats, commies, ect. ect. ect. ect..... :rolleyes:

Stevo

03-07-2007, 08:42 PM

whens the last time you've looked at the presidents approval ratings?

I will address this first, the rest I will address when I have my facts straight.

The main reason for the low approval ratings, is the leftist leaning media. The things that mainstream media is spouting is obscene, totally twisted facts, reporting selective news to further the liberal left, and in alot of instances, reporting totally fabricated information. As an American, we are force-fed this half-ass reporting of selective information, and after so long, people start believing it. It is sad.

All democrats are pressured from their political leaders to 'spread the word', you are doing exactly what they want you to do.

Stevo

Stevo

03-07-2007, 08:44 PM

Yeah but that 71% of the population don't know what the Gangleader of DFWStangs, 90 Notch and his good followers know!!!

They're all idiots, morons, fucktards, tards, liberals, democrats, liberal democrats, commies, ect. ect. ect. ect..... :rolleyes:

http://www.pionusparrot.com/photogallery/AnimatedScreamingParrot.gif
:rolleyes:

Stevo

Paladin

03-07-2007, 09:10 PM

Bush SHOULD pardon him and I think he will!!!

If he does, I sure hope the Clinton supporters keep their mouth shut.

I have no problem if he does, but I doubt Libby will get much more than a slap on the wrist. The reason I say that is because I just heard that Sandy Berger plead guilty to taking documents and got a 2 year probation and a 50K fine. If that doesn't warrant jail time, then Libby shouldn't get much IMO.

Paladin

03-07-2007, 09:21 PM

i believe the people of america spoke up during last nov. elections.

i believe we won the house, senate, and majority governorships.

i think the majority of the america voters clearly expressed their dissatisfaction in the voting booths.

i think the politicians don't have to listen...i think they are being outright inundated by the expressed concerns and displeasure over our current government and presidential administration.

whens the last time you've looked at the presidents approval ratings?

and if you don't care about thost stats..who cares, because people in the white house sure do.

Do you have any idea why NPR, Air America, MSNBC, CNN, and all the other liberal leaning media outlets can't stay self sufficient or are losing viewers? Can you explain why conservative talk radio and Fox 4, uh er, I mean Fox News have ratings that are going through the roof?

I say it is because you can't sell the liberal message when it is open and honest. Most Americans don't support gay marriage, open borders, unfettered abortion, opposition to the death penalty, increased government, increased taxes, support for the ACLU, and all the other unpopular things your party stands for.

It kind of contradicts your thoughts that the elections were positive for liberals, it makes me believe it was a wake up call for Republicans to get back on track. The next election will tell us what the majority of Americans think about how the country is going. I hope Hillary is your candidate because I think the message will be loud and clear if she gets it.

Mach1Marauder

03-07-2007, 09:23 PM

If he does, I sure hope the Clinton supporters keep their mouth shut.

I have no problem if he does, but I doubt Libby will get much more than a slap on the wrist. The reason I say that is because I just heard that Sandy Berger plead guilty to taking documents and got a 2 year probation and a 50K fine. If that doesn't warrant jail time, then Libby shouldn't get much IMO.
That am a conviction ain't it? Wuzn't he purdy high up?........I'm trying to make the Libs feel like they even MORE intelligent in their little minds. ;)

Stevo

03-07-2007, 09:24 PM

Mustangman_2000

03-07-2007, 09:29 PM

Do you have any idea why NPR, Air America, MSNBC, CNN, and all the other liberal leaning media outlets can't stay self sufficient or are losing viewers? Can you explain why conservative talk radio and Fox 4, uh er, I mean Fox News have ratings that are going through the roof?

I say it is because you can't sell the liberal message when it is open and honest. Most Americans don't support gay marriage, open borders, unfettered abortion, opposition to the death penalty, increased government, increased taxes, support for the ACLU, and all the other unpopular things your party stands for.

It kind of contradicts your thoughts that the elections were positive for liberals, it makes me believe it was a wake up call for Republicans to get back on track. The next election will tell us what the majority of Americans think about how the country is going. I hope Hillary is your candidate because I think the message will be loud and clear if she gets it.

well, regardless of the ratings of the programs you listed it does not really mean much when compared to the recent voting results.

i've listened a few times to air america because i thought al franken is a funny guy. however, you have to take it with a grain of salt just like when listen to it's far right equivalent of a show like sean hannity.

and do me a favor and don't remind me about the current top 2 presidential democratic candidates. i'm not 100% on board with either right now.

the 2008 presidential election is going to be tough for me personally.

black01gt

03-07-2007, 09:41 PM

The main reason for the low approval ratings, is the leftist leaning media. The things that mainstream media is spouting is obscene, totally twisted facts, reporting selective news to further the liberal left, and in alot of instances, reporting totally fabricated information. As an American, we are force-fed this half-ass reporting of selective information, and after so long, people start believing it. It is sad.

All democrats are pressured from their political leaders to 'spread the word', you are doing exactly what they want you to do.

Stevo
Now there is a mammoth sized set of double standards for ya. Ever hear of Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity, Bill O, Michael Savage, Ann Cuntler, ect, ect, with their constant spewing of hatred for anyone that isn't part of the so-called "conservative movement :D "? Course they're in it for the money that you faithful viewers generate for em.

"Twisted facts.."? Like Scooter Libby being convicted? And then the jury has the gall to feel like he is the fall guy for Cheney, Bush, and Rove. That's the jury, not the media. Probably a hand picked leftist leaning communist jury by our leftist leaning communist court system to come up with such nonsense as that to put on the leftist leaning liberal media...huh?
And then reporting about the sorry conditions that wounded servicemen from Iraq, that the White House is so concerned about by that leftist leaning media. Shame on them for ratting out your greedy assed heros and trying to improve conditions for our wounded servicemen. Bastards! "So what your legs are gone. Push aside the dead rats in your room and "man up" (as 90 Notch sez)!

And can you believe what poor relations Anna Nicole's friends and her Mom have? I'm just appalled I tell you. :eek: Thank God the leftist leaning liberal media is keeping us up on that...hourly.

Sean88gt

03-07-2007, 09:50 PM

congrats!

you just listed the personal freedoms of all u.s. citizens.

sorry you can't handle it.

This is a throwback for the old days, but did you used to go by the name Imouer on the Corral??

You completely miss the point. You have the common sense of a 14yr old girl. Seriously, your retorts remind me of some dumbass emo kid that is trying to find herself. No sense at all.

Stevo

03-07-2007, 10:00 PM

Mustangman_2000

03-07-2007, 10:02 PM

This is a throwback for the old days, but did you used to go by the name Imouer on the Corral??

never been a member there.

You completely miss the point. You have the common sense of a 14yr old girl. Seriously, your retorts remind me of some dumbass emo kid that is trying to find herself. No sense at all.

the feeling is mutual.

you want me to agree with your reactionary statement about democrats stripping our rights. ....i can't unilaterally.

that's kind of funny coming from someone who supports a president that violated privacy rights by illegally approving 30 roving wiretaps since 9/11, but went on tv and lied by stating that he would never seek a wiretap without a court order even in the pursuit of terrorism.

how about both parties are guilty of making mistakes or being overzealous.

this republican no accountability crap is sickening.

both parties have and continue to make mistakes.

stop pointing the finger to everyone else except your party.

it's not that hard to be honest.

Stevo

03-07-2007, 10:07 PM

...stop pointing the finger to everyone else except your party...

Wow, did you really just type this referring to republicans??? Oh my....

Stevo

Mustangman_2000

03-07-2007, 10:11 PM

Wow, did you really just type this referring to republicans??? Oh my....

Stevo

i'm just saying there is accountability on both sides.

just need to find people that have a viable plan and vote for them.

black01gt

03-07-2007, 10:50 PM

My thoughts are my own, I am neither democrat nor republican, I am probably one of the few true neutrals, but like every true neutral, hearing the babble and banter of party bashing only pushes me away. You want to impress me? Lets here all the things your party plans to do to fix whatever issues you say need to be fixed. Lets here what your party has done to improve our country.

Stevo
Well if you can say it so can I. I am neither democrat nor republican. WTF is a "true neutral"? Horseshit!

No...I'm not interested in impressing you. :D WTF?

pssst...it's hear, not here.

99SVTour

03-07-2007, 11:06 PM

That's just it, I am pro conservative and there ain't a God damned thing conservative about this administration no matter how much they thump their chest and proclaim "DEAD OR ALIVE" type bullshit. Bush spends money like his daddy is still writing his allowance checks even tho he is not..we are. We're spending a fortune and not getting shit in return.

"...insulting and desparaging..." true (like I give a shit), "clever"... come on. When it's a topic that's hard to spin, it's like rattling the monkey cage. They like the tactic of name calling, bullying (gang mentality style), or pulling the Clinton card. Same principle as pulling the race card.

Here you go. Watch below for instant results:

that's funny, I dont recall participating in any name calling, throwing insults, bullying, or pulling any cards in any of my posts, and most of my posts aren't even responded to.
The posts that are responded to are usually the ones with name calling, insults,etc... that you two are supposedly tired of. If you're so tired of them then why dont you respond to anything other than those specific posts?

99SVTour

03-07-2007, 11:38 PM

pssst...it's hear, not here.

pssst... it's etc... not ect...

Stevo

03-07-2007, 11:39 PM

Well if you can say it so can I. I am neither democrat nor republican. WTF is a "true neutral"? Horseshit!

No...I'm not interested in impressing you. :D WTF?

pssst...it's hear, not here.

http://www.pionusparrot.com/photogallery/AnimatedScreamingParrot.gif

What is wrong, Polly want another cracker? :rolleyes:

Stevo

Sean88gt

03-08-2007, 12:06 AM

never been a member there.

the feeling is mutual.

you want me to agree with your reactionary statement about democrats stripping our rights. ....i can't unilaterally.

that's kind of funny coming from someone who supports a president that violated privacy rights by illegally approving 30 roving wiretaps since 9/11, but went on tv and lied by stating that he would never seek a wiretap without a court order even in the pursuit of terrorism.

how about both parties are guilty of making mistakes or being overzealous.

this republican no accountability crap is sickening.

both parties have and continue to make mistakes.

stop pointing the finger to everyone else except your party.

it's not that hard to be honest.
I'm not asking you to agree, just to open your eyes a little bit. Believe, I'm convinced the republicans are shit as well. Both parties are heading to the same place, the democrats are just heading there at 325mph while the republicans are heading there at 48mph.

Wiretaps are a sticky wicket. I can assure you that Clinton issued them, as well as Bush Sr. as well as Reagan, as well as Carter and so on down the line. They just said nothing about them. I detest the Patriot act. I am of the mind set that bad shit happens in a free society, but you take that risk because the good out weighs the bad.

Yes both parties are guilty of a lot. The last election was nothing but accountability. If the republicans would have eaten their own, the voters wouldn't have.

Don't assume the republican party is my party. I'm not sure it is anymore. I'm a Conservative, especially fiscally. I disagree with abortion as I feel it is murder, but I also feel that if it is outlawed then you'll have Hanger Paul in the alley taking care of it. I feel that global warming is BS science and everyone that is touting it is doing so for the huge financial benefit that comes along with it. I completely disagree with the attack on morals that the republicans are doing because I feel it compromises their smaller gov't ideals. They have more important things on the table than porn, what people surf on the internet and online gambling...they just don't realize it yet:rolleyes:

black01gt

03-08-2007, 12:10 AM

pssst... it's etc... not ect...
doh...you got me. Walked right into that one. :o

Mustangman_2000

03-08-2007, 12:20 AM

I'm not asking you to agree, just to open your eyes a little bit. Believe, I'm convinced the republicans are shit as well. Both parties are heading to the same place, the democrats are just heading there at 325mph while the republicans are heading there at 48mph.

Wiretaps are a sticky wicket. I can assure you that Clinton issued them, as well as Bush Sr. as well as Reagan, as well as Carter and so on down the line. They just said nothing about them. I detest the Patriot act. I am of the mind set that bad shit happens in a free society, but you take that risk because the good out weighs the bad.

Yes both parties are guilty of a lot. The last election was nothing but accountability. If the republicans would have eaten their own, the voters wouldn't have.

Don't assume the republican party is my party. I'm not sure it is anymore. I'm a Conservative, especially fiscally. I disagree with abortion as I feel it is murder, but I also feel that if it is outlawed then you'll have Hanger Paul in the alley taking care of it. I feel that global warming is BS science and everyone that is touting it is doing so for the huge financial benefit that comes along with it. I completely disagree with the attack on morals that the republicans are doing because I feel it compromises their smaller gov't ideals. They have more important things on the table than porn, what people surf on the internet and online gambling...they just don't realize it yet:rolleyes:

that is the most neutral and bipartisan post i have read yet.

it was refreshing.

the word idiot is uses quite a bit in this forum. the only time i consider someone to be an idiot is if they think they refuse to see the failings and mistakes of their own party.

denial is ugly and makes for a difficult debate.

Paladin

03-08-2007, 01:54 PM

well, regardless of the ratings of the programs you listed it does not really mean much when compared to the recent voting results.

i've listened a few times to air america because i thought al franken is a funny guy. however, you have to take it with a grain of salt just like when listen to it's far right equivalent of a show like sean hannity.

and do me a favor and don't remind me about the current top 2 presidential democratic candidates. i'm not 100% on board with either right now.

the 2008 presidential election is going to be tough for me personally.

Just like the recent election means alot when you think it supports your view, if the ratings of conservative talk radio and Fox 4, uh er, I mean Fox News was going down, it would mean alot to you I bet.

BTW, if you were a person who didn't care what party a candidate was from and cared about what they stood for, you wouldn't have this "tough" issue with the 2008 election. That problem is reserved for you straight ticket sheep types.

Sorry, I can't help myself on the Fox 4 thing. LOL

Paladin

03-08-2007, 02:02 PM

Now there is a mammoth sized set of double standards for ya. Ever hear of Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity, Bill O, Michael Savage, Ann Cuntler, ect, ect, with their constant spewing of hatred for anyone that isn't part of the so-called "conservative movement :D "? Course they're in it for the money that you faithful viewers generate for em.

"Twisted facts.."? Like Scooter Libby being convicted? And then the jury has the gall to feel like he is the fall guy for Cheney, Bush, and Rove. That's the jury, not the media. Probably a hand picked leftist leaning communist jury by our leftist leaning communist court system to come up with such nonsense as that to put on the leftist leaning liberal media...huh?
And then reporting about the sorry conditions that wounded servicemen from Iraq, that the White House is so concerned about by that leftist leaning media. Shame on them for ratting out your greedy assed heros and trying to improve conditions for our wounded servicemen. Bastards! "So what your legs are gone. Push aside the dead rats in your room and "man up" (as 90 Notch sez)!

And can you believe what poor relations Anna Nicole's friends and her Mom have? I'm just appalled I tell you. :eek: Thank God the leftist leaning liberal media is keeping us up on that...hourly.

Maybe there is a left wing conspiracy towards Libby similar to the one Hillary proclaimed was coming from the right just before Bill admitted he was lying. I can't wait for Hillary to have to answer questions and all those skeletons start popping out of her mouth, closet, pockets, and everywhere else she has been hiding them.

BTW, that jury was polled and the majority of them say they have no problem with Libby getting pardoned. I also saw an interview with a juror and he doesn't think Libby should really get any jail time. I got the impression there was almost some talk among them about jury nullification becuase they thought it was a BS prosecution.

I also heard Fitzgerald has come out and said the investigation was over, and no more indictments or charges will be investigated on anyone. Sounds like they got their sacrificail lamb for the cause (insert your definition of cause here) and they have given up.

Paladin

03-08-2007, 02:06 PM

i'm just saying there is accountability on both sides.

just need to find people that have a viable plan and vote for them.

I am curious, since you voted for Kerry, what was his viable plan? Sorry, but no one from the Dems has demonstrated a viable plan that I have seen.

I also wonder if you now know how stupid your party's plan to cut and run from Iraq, while Al Quaeda is there, really is. You do see that now, right? (sticks out olive branch again)

Paladin

03-08-2007, 02:08 PM

Well if you can say it so can I. I am neither democrat nor republican. WTF is a "true neutral"? Horseshit!

No...I'm not interested in impressing you. :D WTF?

pssst...it's hear, not here.

Is there such a thing as a liberal independent? You may not be a Democrat, but you are a liberal.

Mustangman_2000

03-08-2007, 06:17 PM

Just like the recent election means alot when you think it supports your view, if the ratings of conservative talk radio and Fox 4, uh er, I mean Fox News was going down, it would mean alot to you I bet.

BTW, if you were a person who didn't care what party a candidate was from and cared about what they stood for, you wouldn't have this "tough" issue with the 2008 election. That problem is reserved for you straight ticket sheep types.

Sorry, I can't help myself on the Fox 4 thing. LOL

i don't watch fox 4 news or fox news.

and it will be difficult for me because i'm a devout democrat, but i'm not in agreement with some of the more liberal views of hillary and obama.

they may not get my vote if things don't change between now and election day.

Mustangman_2000

03-08-2007, 06:24 PM

I am curious, since you voted for Kerry, what was his viable plan? Sorry, but no one from the Dems has demonstrated a viable plan that I have seen.

I also wonder if you now know how stupid your party's plan to cut and run from Iraq, while Al Quaeda is there, really is. You do see that now, right? (sticks out olive branch again)

i'll answer the first part after i take time to verify a few facts.

i believe and support the 9/11 commission findings report that there was no credible evidence demonstrating a link between al qaeda and iraq. and that the initial reasons for going to war was based on erroneous and distorted evidence. it should have never have happened.

however, in regards to al qaeda being in iraq. i don't believe we should cut and run without eliminating the al qaeda threat in iraq. that's my moderate democratic opinion on the matter.

however, that does not change the masses opinion of this being a very unpopular war (regarding the bogus evidence for going to war) and the politicians will respond to the voting majority.

don't blame me. blame the glasses half empty media for reporting nothing but negative information to the american public.

Stevo

03-08-2007, 06:30 PM

they may not get my vote if things don't change between now and election day.

Bullshit, tow your line Polly.

Stevo

black01gt

03-09-2007, 08:19 AM

BTW, that jury was polled and the majority of them say they have no problem with Libby getting pardoned. I also saw an interview with a juror and he doesn't think Libby should really get any jail time. I got the impression there was almost some talk among them about jury nullification becuase they thought it was a BS prosecution.

That's true. Only because they could clearly see that Libby was being set up to take the fall for Cheney, Bush, and the slimiest little mother fucker to ever walk this planet, Karl Rove. But since those cheesy assed pieces of shit threw him out there like the chickenshits they are...the jury ate him. But they would have much rather have had Mr. Cheney.

Even you know that's true. All this shit for a schoolboy "payback".

Stevo

03-09-2007, 08:25 AM

Libby was being set up to take the fall

http://www.pionusparrot.com/photogallery/AnimatedScreamingParrot.gif

"CONSPIRACY! CONSPIRACY!" cries Polly.

Stevo

black01gt

03-09-2007, 08:28 AM

Is there such a thing as a liberal independent? You may not be a Democrat, but you are a liberal.
I've asked you this before and you always change the subject. Since you're obcessed with these catagories, it should be easy for you...

Define liberal. Then define conservative.

Paladin

03-09-2007, 11:30 AM

i don't watch fox 4 news or fox news.

and it will be difficult for me because i'm a devout democrat, but i'm not in agreement with some of the more liberal views of hillary and obama.

they may not get my vote if things don't change between now and election day.

Do they have any other views besides extreme liberal ideas?

Paladin

03-09-2007, 11:58 AM

I've asked you this before and you always change the subject. Since you're obcessed with these catagories, it should be easy for you...

Define liberal. Then define conservative.

To me, you are a liberal. You will nitpick some of my definition of a liberal and claim you aren't one, but your self proclaimed Bush hating puts you right in the liberal extreme. I really don't think you know what a liberal is, but you sure are one. It took me realizing what they stood for before I decided to stop buying their rhetoric and beliefs about the below topics. If you are over 25 then you will never see it, becuase that is about when I started to come around.

They proclaim "I hate Bush", they have no solutions for todays problems but will tell you all the reasons why they think the current solutions wont work, they tend to believe that in unfettered abortion, are anti-death penalty, support the ACLU, don't support the military and see it as a necessary evil, believe Al Gore and his wacko enviromental views, want no guns owned by private citizens, want more government to make decisions for the individual, want more taxes to solve economic problems, pro-gay marriage, believe drug addiction is a disease, do not respect Christian views but want to force other religions on us (selective secularism), want to throw more money at public schools instead of doing what it takes to fix the schools (which isn't throwing money at them), typically vote straight ticket Democrat. That is a good start. You can also look to any of the majority of the Democratic leaders, Howard Dean, Pelosi, Murtha, Kerry, or any of the other high profile leaders for their views, and you will find more liberal ideals.

A conservative is a broad spectrum of people, it includes extreme religious believers, traditionalists, and people who just think our society has lost it's way.

I am more of a conservative traditionalist. I think marriage should be defined as between a man and woman, think there should be less taxes until the government is efficient with what I already give, think there should be law and order, think teachers should keep their personal views, especially extreme liberal ones which seem to dominate the teaching pprofession at all levels, to themselves, think schildren should be raised by two hetreosexual parents if possible, think a parent should stay at home to raise the child (which is the BEST way to raise a child, think children should be raised with God in their lives, think men should be respectful to women and women should act like women, think children should be well behaved and not sexualized so early, think that the military should be used when we are attacked and the best way to prevent further attacks is by leeting everyone know we will not let anyone kill our citizens without immediate and decisive action, I am pro-life, support the death penalty, and believe in the right to carry guns.

I have not seen a candidate from either side that meets my criteria perfectly, but so far my views are more closely aligned with the majority of the conservative candidates up for election.

Paladin

03-09-2007, 11:59 AM

That's true. Only because they could clearly see that Libby was being set up to take the fall for Cheney, Bush, and the slimiest little mother fucker to ever walk this planet, Karl Rove. But since those cheesy assed pieces of shit threw him out there like the chickenshits they are...the jury ate him. But they would have much rather have had Mr. Cheney.

Even you know that's true. All this shit for a schoolboy "payback".

It's a right wing conspiracy! :rolleyes:

Paladin

03-09-2007, 12:14 PM

i'll answer the first part after i take time to verify a few facts.

i believe and support the 9/11 commission findings report that there was no credible evidence demonstrating a link between al qaeda and iraq. and that the initial reasons for going to war was based on erroneous and distorted evidence. it should have never have happened..

Once again, we can discuss the reasons for the start of the war if you want, but everyone, including 2 of the 3 Democratic candidates for President, the majority of our allies, the CIA, the FBI, the Clinton administration, and most people thought the start of the war was justified and necessary, Hindsight has provided us with some new information that I wish we had had before the strat, but it didn't. get over it. We are there now, Al Quaeda is there now.

however, in regards to al qaeda being in iraq. i don't believe we should cut and run without eliminating the al qaeda threat in iraq. that's my moderate democratic opinion on the matter..

There are very few of your leaders in the Democratic party that agree with you on this. This is also why we make fun of you for being a staright ticket Democrat. I do not know how many self proclaimed Democrats like yourself jave gone down the list of your party's beliefs and realized how far left your party has become. To vote Democrat right now you have to agree with Murtha, Pelosi, Kerry, Howard Dean, and all the other extreme liberals who run your party. I say vote for a Democrat if that is what you believe in, but if you dont agre with the majority of what they stand for, you and anyone else who votes for them is an idiot IMO.

I thought you had come around on this topic, but imagine that, you have reverted back to your classic straight ticket rhetoric and thoughts.

however, that does not change the masses opinion of this being a very unpopular war (regarding the bogus evidence for going to war) and the politicians will respond to the voting majority..

If the masses you refer to thought we should go into Iran, or that we should change some core belief you have, would you care? The masses you refer to are right now watching the national news shows and getting nothing but the liberal rhetoric they spew at them. You know, the ones that have been proven to show about 20-1 negative to positive stories about Iraq.

The world masses think we should not attack Al Quaeda and should negotiate with them. Should we bow down to their wishes because the "masses" think so?

I don't care what the masses think, I have my core beliefs, and right now the masses don't support the war. I wonder if we changed some of the poll questions would it change the numbers some, but I am not going to do the research to show how slanted the majority of polls are.

don't blame me. blame the glasses half empty media for reporting nothing but negative information to the american public.

Then don't use the "masses" who agree with you as evidence.

black01gt

03-10-2007, 11:31 AM

your self proclaimed Bush hating puts you right in the liberal extreme.

A conservative is a broad spectrum of people, it includes extreme religious believers, traditionalists, and people who just think our society has lost it's way.

Well that makes it pretty simple for you doesn't it? I would really like to live up to your standards, but I just cant seem to muster an ounce of respect for Mr. Bush and his so-called administration.

Oh wait...I definately think our society has lost it's way by turning into a bunch of mindless sheep so...maybe there's hope for me yet?

I would like to see the future of this country CONSERVED before Bush LIBERALLY gives it away! Think...giving over our port security to the arabs. ;)

Mach1Marauder

03-10-2007, 12:24 PM

LIBERALS are the mindless sheep of the earth.

Paladin

03-12-2007, 11:10 AM

Well that makes it pretty simple for you doesn't it? I would really like to live up to your standards, but I just cant seem to muster an ounce of respect for Mr. Bush and his so-called administration.

Oh wait...I definately think our society has lost it's way by turning into a bunch of mindless sheep so...maybe there's hope for me yet?

I would like to see the future of this country CONSERVED before Bush LIBERALLY gives it away! Think...giving over our port security to the arabs. ;)

Pretty pathetic post after I put all that ammo out there for you liberal boy.

Now, give me your definition of a liberal and a conservative.