Steroids?????

[Jared Ezzell]

can u take nitro tech tooo????

[The Big Matt]

what kind of steroids? That's a pretty vague question.

But if you are talking about taking Muscletech's Nitro Tech Whey Protein, then definately yes you want to take in as much protein as you can while cycling, and mass building. Protein is essential to muscle growth.

But if you are asking these questions, i'd probably do a lot more research on steroids, cycles, stacking, types, ammounts, etc. before you start sticking needles in your body.

[The Raven]

If you are asking such an elementary question you do NOT need to be taking anabolic steroids. Do you even have a post-cycle stack planned out?

[ls1eater]

protein is a must while on steroids, and got boost is right about the post cycle but steroids are ok if taken properly.

[AndyMc]

I wish I had a doctor that would set me up a cycle :eek:

[zcs626]

what all is involved in the post cycle? i know you have to take estrogen or somethign like that

[The Raven]

what all is involved in the post cycle? i know you have to take estrogen or somethign like that


Just the opposite actually. Taking steroids shuts down your natural testosterone production, so it's necessary to take a post-cycle mix that will both kick-start your testicles into making testosterone, and combat the over-abundance of estrogen in your body to prevent gynocomastia (the enlargement of the breast glands, also known as bitch tits).

I say again, if you are just now learning about any of these things in this thread, you do not need to be contemplating using anabolic steroids without much more extensive education.

[zcs626]

Just the opposite actually. Taking steroids shuts down your natural testosterone production, so it's necessary to take a post-cycle mix that will both kick-start your testicles into making testosterone, and combat the over-abundance of estrogen in your body to prevent gynocomastia (the enlargement of the breast glands, also known as bitch tits).

I say again, if you are just now learning about any of these things in this thread, you do not need to be contemplating using anabolic steroids without much more extensive education.
thats what it was, one of the guys i know has the man bewbies and we make fun of him b/c he fucked up on his post cycle. thanks for the info

[JMAC]

so it's necessary to take a post-cycle mix that will both kick-start your testicles into making testosteroneSo could you give a example of a post cycle mix?

[OMEGA DOOM]

whats the safest stuff that you can buy over the counter that would be like steroids or closest to it? :confused:

[5111]

So could you give a example of a post cycle mix?
That will depend greatly on the kind of steroid you took and for how long you took it. Nolva, Clomid, etc. are great for PCT.

[dewayne6243]

I wish I had a doctor that would set me up a cycle :eek:


There are many doctors that will set you up on some hard core cycles. Look on the internet and type in "hormone therapy" or you can use the place I use. Prices are not that bad unless you want some HGH. Don't let these guys scare you about roids. Taken right they work well. Ask the doctor. Not the kids.

Advance Modern Therapy
1-888-663-1777
Talk to Eddie

[Cooter]

let these guys scare you!!! done right, steroids work... done wrong, it's bad news... let them scare you, and use the fear to fuel your research...

[davbrucas]

post cycle therapy for ANY mild to moderate 8-12wk cycle should be as follows...

starting 10days after your last injection:
HCG 1000IU MWF for 3wks along with 20mg nolvadex every day (ed) (can increase the nolva to 40mg in the middle wk of the 3wks)...after this 3wks stop the HCG and continue nolva 20mg ed for an additional 2-3wks. then get some bloodwork to evaluate your recovery 2wks after PCT...you should get some baseline bloodwork prior to starting the cycle as a check to see when you have recovered.

for extended cycles (12+ wks) or very heavy cycles (high doses of multiple drugs) you should add 50mg of clomid every day to the above PCT. if you are asking advice about these drugs on a mustang website then you should not be taking heavy or long cycles...if any at all. it is best to stay with one drug for your first cycle...ie...testosterone enanthate at 500mg/wk injecting every 5days for 10wks. you can add dbol at 20-30mg every day the first 4wks to jumpstart the cycle but i highly suggest you add 0.5-1mg arimidex every day to prevent the bloat and increased estrogen that you will see with these drugs...not everyone is prone to getting gyno/bloat at these low doses but why take the risk?


as far as the HCG is concerned...it usually comes in a 5000IU pack. one vial with powder and one with a solvent. throw the solvent away. if you mix the HCG with the solvent it will only keep for a day or so. get some bacteriostatic water and 10cc sterile, sealed, empty vials from http://www.gpzusa.com. draw up 1cc of the bacwater and add it to the powder in the HCG vial. it will dissolve. next, add 4cc of the bacwater to the 10cc (or 5cc) sterile sealed empty vial using a needle to inject it into the vial. then add the 1cc that you mixed to this 4cc. this will equal 5cc of 1000IU/cc HCG. inject 1cc every MWF. keep this mixture in the fridge. it will keep for 30days at best. you will need a total of 9000IU so you will need two kits of the 5000IU HCG. these usually run $25-35 per kit. hope this helps. you can get the pins and syringes from the above site as well....

[davbrucas]

no, i am not a source. nor do i use these drugs. so please dont PM me asking for these drugs. i can help you design a safe cycle if needed.

[Sami]

There are many doctors that will set you up on some hard core cycles. Look on the internet and type in "hormone therapy" or you can use the place I use. Prices are not that bad unless you want some HGH. Don't let these guys scare you about roids. Taken right they work well. Ask the doctor. Not the kids.

Advance Modern Therapy
1-888-663-1777
Talk to Eddie

That's still illegal so if you can get it from black market, I bet it is cheaper that way.

http://www.steroid.com/steroidandlaws.php

[dewayne6243]

That's still illegal so if you can get it from black market, I bet it is cheaper that way.

http://www.steroid.com/steroidandlaws.php


There is nothing illegal about this place.

[Sami]

There is nothing illegal about this place.
If they are not prescriping steroids for non-medical reasons then what are they doing? Did you read the link I posted?

[davbrucas]

everything you needed to know about post cycle recovery...

Anabolic/androgenic steroids are used widely in human and veterinary medicine, and are increasingly useful to the training methods of elite athletes. Benefits of the intelligent use of anabolic/androgenic steroids include enhanced quality of life and the promise of greater longevity, as well as marked improvements in body composition, strength, and stamina. However, anabolic/androgenic steroids produce their benefits by interfering with the endocrine system, a complex system of glands and brain structures that are normally kept in an homeostatic state of balance by the action of countless subtle, sensitive feedback mechanisms. The perturbation in normal endocrine function that is introduced by the use of anabolic/androgenic steroids can, through these feedback mechanisms, elicit compensatory endocrine responses, such as up- or down-regulation of essential enzyme stores or of receptor molecules, in order to maintain homeostasis. When these compensatory mechanisms persist into the post-cycle era after steroids have been withdrawn, unwanted effects can occur, such as fatigue, depression, loss of sex drive, loss of size and strength, and others. Fortunately, both prophylactic and restorative measures that the athlete can take in this situation are now fairly well known.

Many athletes have agreed that androgenic/anabolic steroids render appreciable gains for a limited time only. As said gain period differs between individuals, this CS will refrain from any recommendations to the optimum time of such therapy but discuss methods of restoring optimum normal endocrine function.

It should be noted that the longer a cycle lasts past the eight-week mark, the harder testosterone recovery becomes. The best way of gauging ones hormonal milieu and planning compensatory measures is to have blood tests done prior to and following cessation of AAS therapy. For the purpose of this Consensus Statement and the awareness of a lack of testing athletes, the following universally accepted post cycle hormone status is assumed:

a) Luteinizing Hormone (LH): low to none, Luteinizing Hormone Releasing Hormone (LHRH): low to none
b) Testosterone (T): low
c) Estrogen (E): high in relation to T
d) Cortisol (C): high
e) Red Blood Cell (RBC) count: falling


While all of these hormone measurements are assumed on the low end of the scale, biochemical individuality will ultimately determine where a person’s levels fall. So assumption of low to substandard levels will not always be true in everyone.


1. What are the goals of testosterone recovery?

The return of hormonal balance is but one goal of this program. To create a transitional period of minimized muscle loss and sustained and/or increased motivation is another.


2. Detailed Recommendations

If the athlete is ready to come off and is still taking long acting esters he shall switch to short acting drugs in order to have complete control of exogenous hormone levels. A “waiting period” for esters to clear is unacceptable and provides for a slow slide into the post cycle catabolic state. This period of short acting supplements shall last for a minimum of 2 weeks.

a) Luteinizing Hormone and shrunken testicles

H C G
If the testis have atrophied, the introduction of H C G at 1000iu x 14 days is necessary. To prevent this atrophy from happening, the use of H C G at 500-1000iu x 4-7 days every 2-3 weeks of the AAS cycle is recommended. This will provide exogenous LH and must only be used to restore/keep proper testicle size.
Week 1-2: H C G, 500-1000iu ed


C l o m i d
The practice of using Clomid at 50mg throughout the AAS cycle or 100mg a day for 3-5 days every 4th week has been used successfully to maintain proper testicle size.

b) Low testosterone and lack of motivation

The introduction of exogenous hormones to compensate for the low endogenous testosterone levels may help to keep loss of drive, strength and muscle at bay but may also slow the recovery process. The below drug and application was chosen for its limited impact on the HPTA

D i a n a b o l
Studies and empirical evidence have shown Dianabol to be beneficial to keep Cortisol in check and provide some intermediate relief from the symptoms of low testosterone via an increase of dopamine, IGF-1, and Central Nervous System stimulation. The heightened dopamine will combat Prolactin and help raise the levels of endogenous Human Growth Hormone. Other studies point to a lack of LH suppression when taken first thing in the morning. It shall be noted that only a low dose upon rising is recommended in order to avoid further disruption of the HPTA
Week 1-6: 10mg dbol am, ed

c) High Estrogen and suppressed Hypothalamus- Pituitary- Testicular- Axis (HPTA)

Estrogen acts as the primary messenger of testosterone production. Testosterone is aromatized into estrogen, which signals the Hypothalamus to stop producing the proper testosterone release hormones. Estrogen must be kept low.

A r i m i d e x
A powerful aromatize inhibitor shall be part of every cycle. For testosterone recovery it is used to keep the testosterone/ estrogen balance in favor of testosterone. It is also of help to keep any additionally occurring estrogen from dbol and Androgel low to none. Studies have shown a 54% increase of testosterone in eugonadal patients
Week 1-10: ½-1mg ed
C l o m i d
Universally accepted as THE testosterone recovery tool. It blocks estrogen from the HPTA and stimulates the production of LHRH. LHRH then initiates the production of LH, which in turn signals the testis (if not atrophied) to produce testosterone.
Week 3-5: 100mg ed
Week 6-8: 50mg ed
N o l v a d e x
A volume of research and empirical evidence suggest the usefulness of this estrogen blocker for recovery. Its action is very similar to Clomid but may be better suited for individuals who experience side effects from Clomid.
Week 1-8: 20mg ed

d) High Cortisol, suppressed HPTA and catabolism

Cortisol is catabolic. It is the enemy of all anabolism and must be kept in check. While it is blocked when under the influence of AAS, it is free to attach to the Anabolic Receptors (AR) once the steroids leave. Due to this blockage Cortisol tends to accumulate and increase when on. A low level is desirable however since it is important for other vital functions such as control of inflammation. Balance is the key.

V i t a m i n C
At 3-5g before heavy workouts, it keeps the exercise induced rise of Cortisol in check
Always: 3-5g before workouts
D H E A
A useless pro-hormone as far as anabolism is concerned, this substance is great to keep Cortisol within normal levels. There is a correlation between high Cortisol and low DHEA levels.
Week 1-6: 150mg am and pm
H u m a l o g
It is well known that insulin possesses powerful anti Cortisol/anabolic properties, specially when used at times when Cortisol is high, such as early morning and post workout.
It is of utmost importance to be educated about insulin and its proper use. However, this CS defers to other available research material for more detailed recommendations and cautionary measures.
A minimum of 10g of dextrose/Maltodextrin per iu with a high carb/mixed glycemic index meal 45 min after insulin injection is suggested as a rough guide line for Humalog use only.
Perfect with dextrose/malto and Creatine.
Week 1-5: 10iu am and 10iu post workout
Caution: DO NOT EXCEED THESE RECOMMENDATIONS
D e x t r o s e a n d M a l to d e x t r i n
It is neither a supplement nor a drug, but these carbohydrates have a very high glycemic index and keep Cortisol levels low by increasing endogenous insulin or keep blood sugar normal when used with exogenous insulin. They also provide excellent energy for heavy workouts. In order to not gain unwanted fat, dextrose and/or maltodextrin shall be ingested during your workout and with your post workout shake only.
Always: 100g with workout water and 100g with post workout shake

e) Red Blood Cell Count and Stamina

E P O
Causes the bone marrow to increase red blood cell production and may have anabolic, fat burning and rejuvenating benefits.
It is of utmost importance to be educate about EPO and its proper use. However, this CS defers to other available research material for more detailed recommendations and cautionary measures.
Week 8: 500-1,000iu ed for 7-10 days
Caution: DO NOT EXCEED THESE RECOMMENDATIONS
C r e a t i n e
The use of Creatine has shown to increase ATP metabolism and cellular water storage among many other things. This is very beneficial because it provides for heightened nutrient storage and a slight increase in anabolism as well as workout stamina. Perfect with dextrose/maltodextrin/.
Always: 5g with workout water and 10g with post workout shake
V i t a m i n B - 1 2 & I r o n
Prolongs the life of your RBC and may be beneficial for increased oxygen transport
Week1-8: 1,000mcg ed

Miscellaneous beneficial drugs, supplements and recommendations

H G H
Administration of exogenous HGH has been shown to help maintain an anabolic environment until natural testosterone levels have reached a satisfactory level.
Week 1-8: 2iu at mid morning and 2iu at mid afternoon
Z i n c
Assists with testosterone production and is always low in weight lifting subjects. Do not consume with calcium for ease of absorption
Week1-8: 50mg ed
M a g n e s i u m
Has too many benefits for weight lifters to list
Week 1-8: 800mg every evening
V i t a m i n B - 6
Assists with testosterone production, keeps Prolactin in check and is very relaxing
Week 1-8: 200mg every evening
M e l a t o n i n
May improve sleep pattern and help increase HGH. With this supplement, the less you take the more it works.
Always: 1.5mg at nite
D e p r e n y l
Known as one of the most favorite life extension drug this dopamine enhancer provides anti-depressant properties as well as possible IGF-1 increase. Do not take with Bromocriptine.
Week 7 & 8: 5mg eod in the morning
E p h e d r a
Ephedrine HCL and related products such as Clenbuteral or Nor-ephedrine (NYC) may offer limited anti catabolic and workout stimulating benefits.
Use as preferred, but do not combine with insulin due to similarities of hypoglycemic and Eph induced over stimulation episodes
N o o t r o p i c s
A course of these "smart drugs" may be beneficial to improve blood flow to the brain and HP. No specific drug, combination of drugs and/or drug course recommendations shall be made due to varying individual preferrences
W o r k o u t a n d c a l o r i c r e s t r i c t i o n
Workouts shall be brief and focus on retaining your newly gained strength after a week long layoff. A power lift routine may be advantages at this stage. Calorie intake shall match expenditure; a calorie-restricted diet shall commence only upon complete recovery of natural testosterone production.


3. Final word

This program is based on empirical evidence, research and experimentation and represents the maximum effort to recover one’s testosterone production. Some of the above supplements and drugs may not be required or may not agree with every individual and advances in medicine may provide newer and more useful drugs for the testosterone recovery following steroid therapy.
Furthermore, it must be noted that a period of 8 weeks of abstinence from all drugs (vitamins and supplements excluded) is the minimum time recommended and that a blood test to assess actual testosterone recovery act as the only gauge for the timing of the next hormone therapy.

Anabolic/androgenic steroids wisely used have many benefits, but they produce their benefits by perturbing the natural course of endocrine function, something that can have consequences for the athlete in terms of enduring dysregulation of said endocrine function upon the cessation of anabolic use. Fortunately, both prophylactic and restorative measures that the athlete can take to restore endocrine function and prepare the way for the next cycle of anabolics are fairly well known. Problems and their solutions include (a) low levels of Luteinizing Hormone and shrunken testicles, treated by H C G & Clomid, (b) low testosterone and lack of motivation, treated by Dianabol morning applications, (c) high estrogen and suppressed Hypothalamus-Pituitary-Testicular Axis (HPTA) function, treated by Arimidex and Clomid, (d) high Cortisol, suppressed HPTA and catabolism, treated by Vitamin C, DHEA, insulin, dextrose and Maltodextrin, and (e) suppressed red blood cell count and reduced stamina, treated by EPO, Creatine, Vitamin B-12 and iron. In addition, a variety of miscellaneous beneficial drugs and supplements, such as HGH, zinc, magnesium, Vitamin B-6, Melatonin, Deprenyl and misc. Nootropics can speed post-cycle recovery.

[dewayne6243]

If they are not prescriping steroids for non-medical reasons then what are they doing? Did you read the link I posted?

I guess you did not read my post. They are medical doctors and it is for hormone replacement therapy or anti-ageing therapy. Yada yada yada give them blood work and money and thay will give you anything you want. Legal!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

There is about 20 places in Flordia that do this.

[dewayne6243]

Ask davbrucas if these places are legal. He is a doctor.

[davbrucas]

yep, doctors can prescribe whatever med that they see fit...it is their license afterall. most men over 30-35 start experiencing what is referred to as andropause...ie low testosterone levels. physicians can use exogenous testosterone to treat this...as well as HGH therapy. perfectly legal.

[superlopez]

So could you give a example of a post cycle mix?


Hable me'

[davbrucas]

Ask davbrucas if these places are legal. He is a doctor.

beat ya to it.... :D

[dewayne6243]

http://www.moderntherapy.com

Check it out.

[JMAC]

D i a n a b o l
Studies and empirical evidence have shown Dianabol to be beneficial to keep Cortisol in check and provide some intermediate relief from the symptoms of low testosterone via an increase of dopamine, IGF-1, and Central Nervous System stimulation. The heightened dopamine will combat Prolactin and help raise the levels of endogenous Human Growth Hormone. Other studies point to a lack of LH suppression when taken first thing in the morning. It shall be noted that only a low dose upon rising is recommended in order to avoid further disruption of the HPTA
Week 1-6: 10mg dbol am, ed

Would you need a post cycle mix for D-bol? ^^^

[Sami]

I guess you did not read my post. They are medical doctors and it is for hormone replacement therapy or anti-ageing therapy. Yada yada yada give them blood work and money and thay will give you anything you want. Legal!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I guess I posted a wrong article. What you describe is exactly what is in many cases illegal, getting a prescription without a medical reason. Therefore the presciption is not valid and you're possessing an illegal drug.

http://www.deadiversion.usdoj.gov/fed_regs/notices/2001/fr0427.htm

* A patient has a medical complaint;

* A medical history has been taken;

* A physical examination has been performed; and

[[Page 21183]]

* Some logical connection exists between the medical complaint, the medical history, the physical examination, and the drug prescribed.


So does this clinic take medical insurance? If it is for medical reasons I can have my insurance cover the costs... ;)

[davbrucas]

Would you need a post cycle mix for D-bol? ^^^


all of these agents will suppress your HPTA, thus the requirement of a proper post-cycle therapy. read my post above for what you should use for this...however, i do not recommend using dbol alone. your gains will be transient in most cases. and more than likely the only gains you will see will be water weight and bloat which you will lose after the cycle...

[JMAC]

all of these agents will suppress your HPTA, thus the requirement of a proper post-cycle therapy. read my post above for what you should use for this...however, i do not recommend using dbol alone. your gains will be transient in most cases. and more than likely the only gains you will see will be water weight and bloat which you will lose after the cycle...I have a couple of gym buddies that have taken it and all they keep telling me is that they started lifting more in a really short period. Don't know how much truth there is to the claim.