Debate 10/13

[Pro Trash]

It seems once again that Bush was edged out in the debate by Kerry. He did have some good points but was out gunned a little by Kerry.

[utdbear]

Kerry may have won the debate, but he has no valid stance on anything, so he lost the argument

[Trip McNeely]

Kerry may have won the debate, but he has no valid stance on anything, so he lost the argument
word. Bush is a man of conviction, and he shows it everytime.

[KJ94GT]

... while Kerry makes promises he can't possibly provide. Bush is going to take this one with no problem.

[Pro Trash]

Kerry may have won the debate, but he has no valid stance on anything, so he lost the argument

You didn't listen did you? Why don't you go back over the small parts like the part about the border issue. If it goes to fast for you let me know and I'll summarize.

[Pro Trash]

word. Bush is a man of conviction, and he shows it everytime.

Actually, he is a man who should be convicted.

[Pro Trash]

... while Kerry makes promises he can't possibly provide. Bush is going to take this one with no problem.

You didn't listen to it did you?

[Trip McNeely]

I dont think YOU listened to it. Again Kerry dances around the issues. Bush retracted with ease. Bush got this on Lockdown.

[KJ94GT]

You didn't listen to it did you?
Of course I did, oh wise one. Face it, not everyone is going to agree with you. Stop with your BS about everyone who doesn't agree with you is wrong.

[mattv]

wanna see something VERY interesting.....
do the vote here
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3036697/

then vote here
http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2004/

its complete opposites....... kinda weird

[mattv]

http://www.foxnews.com/index.html
near the bottom........ and the vote is lopsided too kinda weird you would think it would be even all over

[Pro Trash]

I dont think YOU listened to it. Again Kerry dances around the issues. Bush retracted with ease. Bush got this on Lockdown.

I listened but you had your conservative ear plugs plunged in a little to deep. Were they sticking out of your ass?LMAO Bush was blinking more than a strobe light, he got beat up on the unemployment stats, national debt, health care. Here are a couple of Kerry's quotes:

"The American health care system... [is] not working for the American family. And it's gotten worse under President Bush over the course of the last years."

"Being lectured by the president on fiscal responsibility is a little bit like Tony Soprano talking to me about law and order."

[Pro Trash]

Of course I did, oh wise one. Face it, not everyone is going to agree with you. Stop with your BS about everyone who doesn't agree with you is wrong.

If you can't handle a simple debate with me about this issue I understand. You seem like you are getting your feelings hurt when I question your knowledge about the debate. If this is painful just click the red box with x in the upper right corner and all your pain will disappear. :D

[Trip McNeely]

I listened but you had your conservative ear plugs plunged in a little to deep. Were they sticking out of your ass?LMAO Bush was blinking more than a strobe light, he got beat up on the unemployment stats, national debt, health care. Here are a couple of Kerry's quotes:

"The American health care system... [is] not working for the American family. And it's gotten worse under President Bush over the course of the last years."

"Being lectured by the president on fiscal responsibility is a little bit like Tony Soprano talking to me about law and order."

You have no clue what youre talking about. LOL I laugh at ignorant people.

At least your screen name has meaning now, you are definately, PRO TRASH.
Keep up the good work.

[Kaji]

"The American health care system... [is] not working for the American family. And it's gotten worse under President Bush over the course of the last years."


So you want a guy that wants a trillion dollar health plan? You think this is going to be free or something?

[KJ94GT]

If you can't handle a simple debate with me about this issue I understand. You seem like you are getting your feelings hurt when I question your knowledge about the debate. If this is painful just click the red box with x in the upper right corner and all your pain will disappear. :D
If you're too blinded by your little, tiny liberal brain, then please click the LOG OFF link in the lower righthand corner of your screen. If you are unsure which side is the right side, please consult a 4 year old child to teach you. Isn't it about time that you remind us all that you're ex-military and know more than everyon else? I think it is. Oh, I'm ex-military too.

[KJ94GT]

So you want a guy that wants a trillion dollar health plan? You think this is going to be free or something?
Apparently it is free because Kerry has no idea where it's coming from!

[mopar63]

"Being lectured by the president on fiscal responsibility is a little bit like Tony Soprano talking to me about law and order."


I will be glad when Bush wins so you will STFU.

[SlowLX]

I listened but you had your conservative ear plugs plunged in a little to deep. Were they sticking out of your ass?LMAO Bush was blinking more than a strobe light, he got beat up on the unemployment stats, national debt, health care. Here are a couple of Kerry's quotes:

"The American health care system... [is] not working for the American family. And it's gotten worse under President Bush over the course of the last years."

"Being lectured by the president on fiscal responsibility is a little bit like Tony Soprano talking to me about law and order."
That shows so much proof that Bush failed :rolleyes: I know I know lets give it to Kerry so we can all have Govt. healthcare. While we're at it let's socialize everything else, and we might as well make Castro our Sec. of Def.

[KJ94GT]

And we can have someone who goes by Pro Trash as our Secretary of State! Woohoo!

[SlowLX]

I call Toolman as treasurer!!!
If for some ungodly reason, this ever happens shoot me in the head!

[Toolman]

kerry won all 3 debates and we will soon see bush gone..

[99SVTour]

Kerry did not win this debate. He's a good debater as I'd hope anyone that's been doing it since junior high would be, but he did not win tonight. Bush explained his stance on many things tonight, and did it well I might ad, while kerry kept on talking about his mysterious plans that he cant explain. He couldn't even explain how he would pay for his version of healthcare.

The Dems have screwed themselves by bringing up Cheney's(sp) daughter on several occasions. They're trying to disenfranchise(sp) conservatives from Bush and imo they're disenfranchising themselves from their gay backers much more than anyone from Bush.

Bush hit a homerun tonight. :cool:

[SlowLX]

Hey speaking of fucking misled idiots, ladies and gentleman Toolman is the result of the hippie movement. He is the sole reason Tricky Dicky wanted to get rid of Heroin use, to prevent retards like this from being b orn. Yay for JD and Coors.

[Toolman]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3036697/


looks like half a million think kerry won so far..

[SlowLX]

Im not doubting the fact that Kerry did good tonight, Bush faltered a little in his speach, but Kerry still has no solid issue to make a run for the most powerfull spot in America and the world.

[NoSlix]

Bush had Kerry going backwards! 1/2 the questions Kerry got asked, he had to go back and make a point for a previous question that he couldn't make then. Kerry one the first, the 2nd was a tie, and Bush one this one.

[Toolman]

name every issue Kerry isnt solid on and back it up with proof from tonights debate..

[Pro Trash]

You have no clue what youre talking about. LOL I laugh at ignorant people.

At least your screen name has meaning now, you are definately, PRO TRASH.
Keep up the good work.

You speak of ignorance but you have no idea what the title Pro Trash even refers to. Keep saving Jr. you'll have enough to buy that 89 4 banger with centerlines any day now. LMAO

[Pro Trash]

Bush had Kerry going backwards! 1/2 the questions Kerry got asked, he had to go back and make a point for a previous question that he couldn't make then. Kerry one the first, the 2nd was a tie, and Bush one this one.

Have you been drinking bubba, the word is "won" and Kerry is shown to have carried all three in most polls.

[mschmoyer]

Well one would be where his trilliion dollar health care is coming from.

I'm sure nobody that owns a small business will go for his 7 dollars an hour minimum wage.

[Toolman]

Kerrys minium wage thing was crap I will admit that.. 5 bucks is good enough for people who dont want to go to school and learn a career..

[Pro Trash]

And we can have someone who goes by Pro Trash as our Secretary of State! Woohoo!

Well I do have a degree in history, 9 1/2 years of honorable service in the Army, almost finished with my Masters, certified to teach Economics, History, Geography and Government, I have served the nation in 17 foriegn countries doing various things and served this state as a teacher for 4 years now. I could be comfortable in the political arena. Thanks for the vote of confidence I accept the nomination.

[SlowLX]

name every issue Kerry isnt solid on and back it up with proof from tonights debate..
Kerry doesnt have any issues to base a plan off of, what socializing our healthcare? (Commie) Making two army divisions out of thin air, ok Commie. His fucked up tax plan, he's like a kid with his moms credit card, the skies the limit to his fucking budget. Whats he gunna do live off his sugarmomma? Or hell he even ventured to say he knew more about imigrations than the former Gov. of Texas. HMMM I think ... No.

[Pro Trash]

If you're too blinded by your little, tiny liberal brain, then please click the LOG OFF link in the lower righthand corner of your screen. If you are unsure which side is the right side, please consult a 4 year old child to teach you. Isn't it about time that you remind us all that you're ex-military and know more than everyon else? I think it is. Oh, I'm ex-military too.

That was weak LMAO you need to not modify what I said and play it like your own, loser. :rolleyes:

[Kaji]

Well I do have a degree in history, 9 1/2 years of honorable service in the Army, almost finished with my Masters, certified to teach Economics, History, Geography and Government, I have served the nation in 17 foriegn countries doing various things and served this state as a teacher for 4 years now. I could be comfortable in the political arena. Thanks for the vote of confidence I accept the nomination.

There is his military/teacher card again for the millionth time. Guess all it takes to be secretary of state is to be a certified history teacher and have military service.

[Pro Trash]

I will be glad when Bush wins so you will STFU.

Really well I won't so get used to Rush complaining about Kerry LOL

[Pro Trash]

There is his military/teacher card again for the millionth time. Guess all it takes to be secretary of state is to be a certified history teacher and have military service.

Well when nominated one must send out their resume, but your welcome to just piss off if you'd like :D

[Toolman]

I know he wants to spend a lot, but he did make a good a point.. if he rolled back the taxes for the top 1 percent who dont need the money anyways you could pay for things like this.. if being a commie is trying to help people then I think being a commie is a good thing..


We are the most powerful and richest country in the world and our medical system is far from the best.. The care may be good, but who cares when people cant get it..

[Toolman]

I have heard many times from republicans that they think Bush is a liberal and they still like him..

[Pro Trash]

Kerry doesnt have any issues to base a plan off of, what socializing our healthcare? (Commie) Making two army divisions out of thin air, ok Commie. His fucked up tax plan, he's like a kid with his moms credit card, the skies the limit to his fucking budget. Whats he gunna do live off his sugarmomma? Or hell he even ventured to say he knew more about imigrations than the former Gov. of Texas. HMMM I think ... No.

Well if you haven't noticed we don't exactly control our border here bubba so what did Bush do for that as governor? oh yeah nothing

Talk about communist, can you say "Patriot Act"

Kid with credit card? we have lost jobs on his watch, when deep into debt and of all things had what 5 tax cuts, no President before Bush ever enacted a tax cut during a war. Kepp trying Rooty Poot

[Pro Trash]

I have heard many times from republicans that they think Bush is a liberal and they still like him..

No he is a compasionate conservative :confused:

In the words of Robin Williams "that is like a Vovlo with a Gun Rack" :D

[SlowLX]

I know he wants to spend a lot, but he did make a good a point.. if he rolled back the taxes for the top 1 percent who dont need the money anyways you could pay for things like this.. if being a commie is trying to help people then I think being a commie is a good thing..


We are the most powerful and richest country in the world and our medical system is far from the best.. The care may be good, but who cares when people cant get it..Helping ppl doesn't classify u as a commie bastard, trying to socialize healthcare does. And our healthcare is no where near as bad as most of the world.

[Kaji]

we have lost jobs on his watch

That domino was pushed before Bush got into office. I thought the economy has been getting better? I guess recovering from a recession isn't good.

Toolman, somebody needs to drag you out infront of a firing squad if you think communism is a good thing.

[Denny]

I know he wants to spend a lot, but he did make a good a point.. if he rolled back the taxes for the top 1 percent who dont need the money anyways you could pay for things like this.. if being a commie is trying to help people then I think being a commie is a good thing..


We are the most powerful and richest country in the world and our medical system is far from the best.. The care may be good, but who cares when people cant get it..

Richest country?!?! Who's world are you in? Your first statement doesn't even make sense. Good luck getting a coherent statement out in the future...

[Toolman]

I thought kerrys plan is optional you dont have to take it.. you can keep your high insurance if you want it..

[SlowLX]

Well if you haven't noticed we don't exactly control our border here bubba so what did Bush do for that as governor? oh yeah nothing

Talk about communist, can you say "Patriot Act"

Kid with credit card? we have lost jobs on his watch, when deep into debt and of all things had what 5 tax cuts, no President before Bush ever enacted a tax cut during a war. Kepp trying Rooty Poot
Hes did a hell of lot more than most anyone ever has with the border there jackass. Its so fucking overwhelming for the manpower they have thats its damn near impossible most most anyone to ctrl. Going into debt, can still go all the way back to the Clinton era where the recession started. On top of 9/11 and going to war. I don't know of anyine that would have been able to keep this country out of debt after most of those events. If you do please tell God we'd like to nominate him for president and the JC can be hsi running mate.

[Toolman]

how does my first comment not make since..

if you roll back the tax on the top 1 percent.. it wont hurt them.. but it will help pay for things..

[Toolman]

if you were allowed to put your social security in your own account when you were 18.. what do you think would happen.. Bush never explained this one at all haha..

[BloodofJason]

Talking about Social Security read this.

Kerry-

In fact, we put together a $5.6 trillion surplus in the ‘90s that was for the purpose of saving Social Security. If you take the tax cut that the president of the United States has given—President Bush gave to Americans in the top 1 percent of America—just that tax cut that went to the top 1 percent of America would have saved Social Security until the year 2075.


I'm not going to take sides on this, but this was fucked.

[PaintitBlack95]

ok lemme get this straight...kerry wants to tax the top 1% or shall I say"roll back" because they dont need the money?????????? wtf who the hell is he to decide??? and this is somehow gonna come up with 2.6 Trillion dollars??? and he basically just ignored the question about how he was gonna come up with the money. In fact on most questions he would back up and bash bush then never come back to the question. I love what bush said about the litamcy(or whatever word he used) of complaints does not make a plan :)

and about this Surpluss from clinton?? I am not positive but from what I am told this so called 5.6 trillion dollar surpluss was a projection 10 years down the road had we stayed on the same path....and obviously 9/11 destroyed that path....so Bush really didnt have a surpluss that large to work with anyway.

And as far as tax cuts not working?? Raegan did it and doubled the surpluss.

just my .02 I might have more later but I have to think of them :)

[Toolman]

I think the point to that was to show that he was a poor republican, and that is an oxy moron..


Just how christian republicans are oxy morons.. I didnt think christians liked to be selfish and like killing..

[SlowLX]

I think the point to that was to show that he was a poor republican, and that is an oxy moron..


Just how christian republicans are oxy morons.. I didnt think christians liked to be selfish and like killing..
Riiight.... :rolleyes: Lets go look at the Crusades. :eek:

[KJ94GT]

That was weak LMAO you need to not modify what I said and play it like your own, loser. :rolleyes:
It was just thrown back in your face there GI Joe. 9 1/2 years? They put up with you that long? I'm shocked.
Loser? Hello pot, this is the kettle.

[Fobra]

Something everybody must realize is that both candadites don't tell the whole truth in most cases (especially in the ads), instead they usually run on a thin line of truth, if any at all.

Answer's to the Kerry health care plan.
http://www.factcheck.org/article264.html

Kerry Exaggerates Cost of War in Iraq
http://www.factcheck.org/article253.html

check out the archive
http://www.factcheck.org/archive.html

[Trip McNeely]

You speak of ignorance but you have no idea what the title Pro Trash even refers to. Keep saving Jr. you'll have enough to buy that 89 4 banger with centerlines any day now. LMAO
Ah, spoken like a true Democrat. You cant delegate an intelligent answer so you must steer off track and try to focus on non relevant things. Damn, you and John Kerry are 2 peas in a pod. Seriously, when your small brain can comprehend these debates, and you can make a decent argument come talk to me. Otherwise shut that shit feeder you call a mouth the fuck up.

[Stroked87]

http://www.cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLITICS/10/14/snap.poll/index.html

[scrapwave]

Actually, he is a man who should be convicted.
Actually, the one who SHOULD be convicted is Kerry....they should start with Treason...and go from there.

[Pro Trash]

Hes did a hell of lot more than most anyone ever has with the border there jackass. Its so fucking overwhelming for the manpower they have thats its damn near impossible most most anyone to ctrl. Going into debt, can still go all the way back to the Clinton era where the recession started. On top of 9/11 and going to war. I don't know of anyine that would have been able to keep this country out of debt after most of those events. If you do please tell God we'd like to nominate him for president and the JC can be hsi running mate.

I can tell you who would have been a better President and his name is McCain there "jackass" because if you feel George Bush did anything with the border or that giving a worker card will resolve anything you are beside him in La La land.

[Pro Trash]

Actually, the one who SHOULD be convicted is Kerry....they should start with Treason...and go from there.

You guys really suck at being creative come up with your own play on words don't use mine, Ass. Kerry opposed Vietnam and now everyone acts as though that was a great war. It was a war based on lies begun in the Tonkin Gulf when Congress wrote the blank check for LBJ. Everyone has spoken ill of it til recently when it became a way to check a box on your political agenda. My Dad did 4 tours in Vietnam and never said anything anything good about that place or that war. The soldiers got screwed in Vietnam and sent by our US government to fight a war not worth fighting. Sounds bit like a Iraq, same dance different music.

[46Tbird]

Kerry opposed Vietnam and now everyone acts as though that was a great war. Excuse me? You really are blinded..

The only person claiming that Vietnam was some great war IS JOHN FUCKING KERRY. He's the one that keeps talking about his four month stint in the war and self inflicted Purple Hearts. He's trying to have it both ways - I was against it, but I was a hero in it!!

No wonder you're so confused, you're following someone that's deliberately trying to confuse you.

[Pro Trash]

Ah, spoken like a true Democrat. You cant delegate an intelligent answer so you must steer off track and try to focus on non relevant things. Damn, you and John Kerry are 2 peas in a pod. Seriously, when your small brain can comprehend these debates, and you can make a decent argument come talk to me. Otherwise shut that shit feeder you call a mouth the fuck up.

Well I could say the same of yourself and ole George, both stupid, can't recall prior conversations and both cowards. I didn't steer off track by the way leg humper, you cut on my screen name which you still have no idea what it represents. I'll fill you in, it is the nick name of my car, you see after the Army I went to college and didn't have a lotof money. I had an 80 model coupe that ran 11's in the 1/4 but looked like crap inside and out. The name stayed but everything else has since been upgraded, ie interior all 90's, exterior all 90's, engine 500+ hp, etc. So with that I work a white collar job, grew up in a blue collar environment, like Bush's tax cuts, hate Bush's health care plans, like Bush's patriotism, hate the war in Iraq, think Bush is funny, think he is the least Presidential President we have had in years.

[Pro Trash]

Excuse me? You really are blinded..

The only person claiming that Vietnam was some great war IS JOHN FUCKING KERRY. He's the one that keeps talking about his four month stint in the war and self inflicted Purple Hearts. He's trying to have it both ways - I was against it, but I was a hero in it!!

No wonder you're so confused, you're following someone that's deliberately trying to confuse you.

Can you say swift boat vets against John Kerry, they are rasing hell and acting as though Vietnam was some honor. It was not it was hell for those poor bastards sent to fight a war ignored by the rich, protested by the hippies and smiled on by the commies. So go figure you again fired a blank didn't you?

[Pro Trash]

Something everybody must realize is that both candadites don't tell the whole truth in most cases (especially in the ads), instead they usually run on a thin line of truth, if any at all.

Answer's to the Kerry health care plan.
http://www.factcheck.org/article264.html

Kerry Exaggerates Cost of War in Iraq
http://www.factcheck.org/article253.html

check out the archive
http://www.factcheck.org/archive.html

We finally agree they both lie, I went to that site and found this. But unlike you RHC I'll begin with a bi-partisan comment:


Distortions Galore at Second Presidential Debate
Examples: Bush forgets he owns a tree-growing company. Kerry again inflates job-loss figures.

http://www.factcheck.org/article275.html

Pro-Bush Puffery on Economy, Medicare
New ad claims Bush inherited an economy "already in recession" and that 41 million seniors "now have access to lower cost prescriptions." Wrong on both counts

http://www.factcheck.org/article278.html

Bush Mischaracterizes Kerry's Health Plan
Bush claims Kerry's plan puts "bureaucrats in control" of medical decisons, "not you, not your doctor." But experts don't agree with that.

http://www.factcheck.org/article264.html

[46Tbird]

Can you say swift boat vets against John Kerry, they are rasing hell and acting as though Vietnam was some honor. It was not it was hell for those poor bastards sent to fight a war ignored by the rich, protested by the hippies and smiled on by the commies. So go figure you again fired a blank didn't you?Yet again, you are dead wrong.

The swift boat vets haven't made as much as a single political PEEP in 35 years. However, when one of their own that was viewed as a demoralizer and giving aid and comfort to the enemy decides to run for the most powerful position in the world, they decided to say something.

I want you to find me one quote where a swift vet mentioned that Vietnam was some great war. You said that "they are rasing hell and acting as though Vietnam was some honor"... well, I want to see your evidence of that. The only person considering it an honor to fight in Vietnam was John Kerry, when he thought he could steal away typically Republican votes from our ex-military members. It only worked on a few idiots ... apparently.

[Pro Trash]

It was just thrown back in your face there GI Joe. 9 1/2 years? They put up with you that long? I'm shocked.
Loser? Hello pot, this is the kettle.

Yeah 9 1/2 years on the ground leading troops for 7 of those years, unlike you mugging down with your buddies on a love boat in the Navy.

[46Tbird]

Yeah 9 1/2 years on the ground leading troops for 7 of those years, unlike you mugging down with your buddies on a love boat in the Navy.Aw man, I thought you were going to stop with the personal attacks. I guess your anger is too strong for you to control.

[Pro Trash]

Yet again, you are dead wrong.

The swift boat vets haven't made as much as a single political PEEP in 35 years. However, when one of their own that was viewed as a demoralizer and giving aid and comfort to the enemy decides to run for the most powerful position in the world, they decided to say something.

I want you to find me one quote where a swift vet mentioned that Vietnam was some great war. You said that "they are rasing hell and acting as though Vietnam was some honor"... well, I want to see your evidence of that. The only person considering it an honor to fight in Vietnam was John Kerry, when he thought he could steal away typically Republican votes from our ex-military members. It only worked on a few idiots ... apparently.

Read this entire article from fat check and make sure you pay attention to the last paragraph which has the date the swift boat vets organized.

Republican-funded Group Attacks Kerry's War Record
Ad features vets who claim Kerry "lied" to get Vietnam medals. But other witnesses disagree -- and so do Navy records.

August 6, 2004
Modified: August 22, 2004
eMail to a friend Printer Friendly Version

Summary



A group funded by the biggest Republican campaign donor in Texas began running an attack ad Aug. 5 in which former Swift Boat veterans claim Kerry lied to get one of his two decorations for bravery and two of his three purple hearts.
But the veterans who accuse Kerry are contradicted by Kerry's former crewmen, and by Navy records.

One of the accusers says he was on another boat "a few yards" away during the incident which won Kerry the Bronze Star, but the former Army lieutenant whom Kerry plucked from the water that day backs Kerry's account. In an Aug. 10 opinion piece in the conservative Wall Street Journal , Rassmann (a Republican himself) wrote that the ad was "launched by people without decency" who are "lying" and "should hang their heads in shame."

And on Aug. 19, Navy records came to light also contradicting the accusers. One of the veterans who says Kerry wasn't under fire was himself awarded a Bronze Star for aiding others "in the face of enemy fire" during the same incident.


Analysis



"Swift Boat Veterans for Truth" is a group formed March 23 after Kerry wrapped up the Democratic nomination. It held a news conference May 4 denigrating Kerry's military record and his later anti-war pronouncements during the 1970's. The group began running an attack ad Aug. 5 in which 13 veterans variously say Kerry is "not being honest" and "is lying about his record."

http://www.factcheck.org/article231.html

[Stacey]

name every issue Kerry isnt solid on and back it up with proof from tonights debate....

Well as always.... I must say... he is your candidate you back up what he says with proof... Why should we do your research for you... tell us how "his plan" (errr scheme to get elected) is going to help us...

It is clear Kerry can tell a shitload of lies and smile while doing it....

"I have a plan" my ass.

I heard one jackass who can lie and smile while doing it....

I still do not understand how his plan is going to work...

I do not understand how his party cut the military to nothing for 8 years and then dogs out the president for not having enought troops.... He has aplan to ad 40,000 to the active duty military. Perhaps it is going to be some of the shitload of military people who were paid to get out under his parties leadership or who bailed out becuase they cut everything so much you could not do your job anymore.

Plan for social security??? there is no fucking plan....

Plan to roll back tax cuts... even the dumbest jackass with a brain can see how tax cuts can help move the economy.... if you are to dumbassed to understand that let me speel it out for you again....

Okay..... the economy is in a recession...... so the president get a tax cut plan in motion that will put some money back into the pockets of the common man.... the common man takes that tax refund he got back and he goes out and buys a new tv... paints his house... buys a new car... he stimulates the economy and that helps get it moving again....

Under Kerrys plan.... roll back the tax cut to the wealthiest americans....
Sounds like a great plan unless your brain can think past your own front door.... lets see here.... those wealthy americans are the ones paying our wages for the most part.... those wealthy americans can also put that saved money back into the economy.... the may decide they want to build a new highrise building becuase they saved 68 millions dollars in taxes or whatever... so when they build the new building that employs a shitload of people and keeps them in jobs....

Roll back the tax cuts and you take money and jobs away in my opinion....

So vote for whoever you want toolman... your comments show me why you are not the sharpest tool in the shed...


I know he wants to spend a lot, but he did make a good a point.. if he rolled back the taxes for the top 1 percent who dont need the money anyways you could pay for things like this.. if being a commie is trying to help people then I think being a commie is a good thing..


We are the most powerful and richest country in the world and our medical system is far from the best.. The care may be good, but who cares when people cant get it..

This again shows your ingnorance.... How old are you??? Have you ever traveled around to other parts of the world??? We have one of the best health care systems in the world.... If you do not believe it hop in your car and hit 35 south and follow the signs to Mexico.... Hell even in Canada where they have "free" government sponsored health care... they have to go only to certain doctors etc... I do not know about you but when I need to see the doctors I can go see whomever I want and I don not have to wait in line or ask my government who my doctor is... The Kerry plan going to the doctor will be like waiting in line for a drivers.

On your falling for the top 1% (which by the way in the last debate was the top 2%...why did he suddenly switch that up???) please read above.


And BloodofJason

Talking about Social Security read this.

Kerry-

In fact, we put together a $5.6 trillion surplus in the ‘90s that was for the purpose of saving Social Security. If you take the tax cut that the president of the United States has given—President Bush gave to Americans in the top 1 percent of America—just that tax cut that went to the top 1 percent of America would have saved Social Security until the year 2075.

I'm not going to take sides on this, but this was fucked.

You missed something here Blood of jason.... Kerry lied and said quote"WE FIXED SOCIAL SECURITY" Bull fucking shit they fixed social security...

They had a plan if things went well in the country that there would be a surplus...They did not fix shit... they put a smoke screen on social security to get another dem elected.
What is Bush SSI plan I do not even know. However it needs to be fixed and Kerry looked blindsided by the SSI question becuase he does not have one idea about it.

Regards,

Stacey

[mikeb]

Anyone that thinks government control of the healthcare system is great should go look at canada's or england's system. I understand that it can take many, many months just to get in to see a doctor or to get required surgery done. The US has the best healthcare that is available. I will agree that rising healthcare costs are a big problem. My personal opinion is that litigation/insurance costs and greed of the drug companies are two of the big driving forces in the cost increases, along with hospitals passing the cost of treating uninsured people to people that can afford to pay.

Kerry has many, many plans. I'd like to see how he's going to pay for them.

Also, as bush pointed out - increasing taxes on entities making over $200k and raising the minumum wage will both hit small businesses particularly hard. Small businesses are major employers of a lot of people, and a tax/wage increase will likely result in more unemployment as small businesses can't afford to take the hit.

[scrapwave]

You guys really suck at being creative come up with your own play on words don't use mine, Ass. Kerry opposed Vietnam and now everyone acts as though that was a great war. It was a war based on lies begun in the Tonkin Gulf when Congress wrote the blank check for LBJ. Everyone has spoken ill of it til recently when it became a way to check a box on your political agenda. My Dad did 4 tours in Vietnam and never said anything anything good about that place or that war. The soldiers got screwed in Vietnam and sent by our US government to fight a war not worth fighting. Sounds bit like a Iraq, same dance different music.There's quite a difference between merely opposing/protesting the war and actively meeting with the enemy. Regardless of whether the war was just or not, Kerry-while still enlisted in the Naval Reserves-met on 2 seperate occasions with the Viet Cong (and this is by his OWN admissions!) and also appealed to Congress to give in to the VC to end the war. The US Constitution defines treason as "giving aid and comfort" to the enemy in time of warfare. He actively attempted to help the VC win the war. That constitutes treason.

[46Tbird]

Okay, so they organized as "Swift Boat Veterans for Truth" after Kerry decided to run for office. Sorry bud, but they were all in Vietnam, they all saw with their own eyes what happened, and they have chosen to organize and tell Americans that John Kerry has no business being President of the United States of America.

And the "love boat" Navy records were written by John Kerry himself. What would you expect them to say? He nominated himself for two of his Purple Hearts.

[scrapwave]

You guys really suck at being creative come up with your own play on words don't use mine, Ass.
One other thing, thanks for resorting to name calling. That's very mature of you. :( I don't recall calling you names when you state your opinion...I was merely stating mine in return. Apparently you need to resort to name calling to make a point? Such a shame. :(

[WhtEdge]

Of course I did, oh wise one. Face it, not everyone is going to agree with you. Stop with your BS about everyone who doesn't agree with you is wrong.

Funny, most of the GW people on here don't seem to get what you are saying as well.

[shrp88lx's]

Typical LIES stated by Travis he will not answer I think the fact he as a teacher is AGAINST it tells us all we need to know about him:


Also what about simple things like his legislation "No child let behind" where the administration is 128 million behind in funding. The legislation was signed into law in 2002 and placed a burden on the school system with it's many requirements/lack of funding to meet it's mandates. So if Bush is willing to place us in such debt and sacrifice our childrens education why should I vote him?


Fact Check :

Kerry claimed the "the president has underfunded [the No Child Left Behind law] by $28 billion," but that's an opinion and not a fact.

Actually, as we reported last March, funding for the federal Department of Education grew a whopping 58% under Bush during his first three years, and Bush proposed another 5% increase for the fiscal year that began Oct. 1, including sizeable increases in spending for children from low-income families and for special education for disabled children. Even the Kerry campaign's own data -- which they provided to FactCheck.org at our request -- shows funding for programs specific to the No Child Left Behind law have increased by $2.7 billion, or 12%, since the new law was enacted

[Toolman]

another weird part of the debate waas that both of them talked about there faith and how it guides them to do what they do.. But Kerry supports abortion and bush supports death penilty.. I could be wrong but doesnt one of the ten commandments say dont kill people.. I know jesus wouldnt want people to be killed..

[shrp88lx's]

another weird part of the debate waas that both of them talked about there faith and how it guides them to do what they do.. But Kerry supports abortion and bush supports death penilty.. I could be wrong but doesnt one of the ten commandments say dont kill people.. I know jesus wouldnt want people to be killed..
NO the word kill there is meant "MURDER" not the JUSTIFIED PUNISHMENT of killers. And Jesus teaching DO NOT contradict that. The Bible does however condem the killing of the unborn.

[Toolman]

ok so when the government kills someone it isnt murder.. so if the government did abortions then I guess it would be ok then..

[shrp88lx's]

ok so when the government kills someone it isnt murder.. so if the government did abortions then I guess it would be ok then..If you consider an abortion a JUSTIFIED PUNISHMENT then , I guess so, I dont think that the Baby has done anything to deserve said punishment.

[SlowLX]

ok so when the government kills someone it isnt murder.. so if the government did abortions then I guess it would be ok then..
Like he just said, justified, you jackass. Was bad for David to kill Goliath, I mean was one of Gods ppl and all.

[Toolman]

so its justified if a guy in a black robe says so..

[shrp88lx's]

so its justified if a guy in a black robe says so.. Man you really are grasping here:

NO the Guy in the black robe doesnt say so, the JURY OF PEERS who CONVICTED that person says so BECAUSE of the actions of THAT individual, not the actions of anyone else.

[SlowLX]

You guys really suck at being creative come up with your own play on words don't use mine, Ass. Kerry opposed Vietnam and now everyone acts as though that was a great war. It was a war based on lies begun in the Tonkin Gulf when Congress wrote the blank check for LBJ. Everyone has spoken ill of it til recently when it became a way to check a box on your political agenda. My Dad did 4 tours in Vietnam and never said anything anything good about that place or that war. The soldiers got screwed in Vietnam and sent by our US government to fight a war not worth fighting. Sounds bit like a Iraq, same dance different music.
Your dad didnt make any visits to N vietnam during the war.(while he was still commisioned in the reserves) Which should bring his ass up for treason no mattter who he is, end of story.

[Toolman]

lets say 1 percent of all the people put to death were really innocent would that be murder then..


also I thought the judge did the sentencing and the jury convicted him..

[shrp88lx's]

lets say 1 percent of all the people put to death were really innocent would that be murder then..


also I thought the judge did the sentencing and the jury convicted him..
Nope the Jury convicts then there is a sentenceing hearing where they decide that too.

[EW]

Kerry and Edwards make promises they can not keep and Kerry flat out LIED about the AWB last night. Kerry is a dirty Massachusetts liberal liar who has not accomplished anything in 20 years of sucking on the tit of the US taxpayer. FUCK KERRY and FUCK EDWARDS.

[Toolman]

so it isnt murder if an innocent man is put to death.. even if they say its justified when really he isnt the one who did it..

[shrp88lx's]

so it isnt murder if an innocent man is put to death.. even if they say its justified when really he isnt the one who did it..
I didnt say that, I said "Nope" to the jury sentencing part. IF and thats a BIG "IF" 1 percent end up being innocent then yes they were falsely punished. This is just the burden we have in our society that has to maintain order. NO society is perfect it doesnt exist it never will, but our system I believe is the best of any country.

[Toolman]

but if that 1 percent who is really innocent is murdered.. then Bush should be against it because innocent people are being killed..

[SlowLX]

You are about the biggest dipshit ever born. Did you stick to many crayons up ur nose or something? There is not a fucking person that could make the justice system perfect. Not Kerry, not Bush, not any president prior. And to end the death penalty would just burden the Tax payer with another idealistic plan that wouldnt work. Moral of the story is that one percent is part of the price we pay for democracy. WOuld you rather have a dictator that kills you at his wishes, or how about an anarchist society with no head of state that'll work. I gaurntee it. ;)

[Toolman]

how about we pick one.. either kill people or dont..

[SlowLX]

Your damn straight we should kill if thats what you want ot label to death penalty.

[utdbear]

For your older folks....Do you see a repeat of Reagan/Mondale in '84 or Bush/Dukakis in '88 happening here in 04?

[Toolman]

I see a repeat of 92 right here..

[The Punisher]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3036697/


looks like half a million think kerry won so far.. Why dont you consult the most watch news channel on the polls.
Fox News
Who won Wednesday night's presidential debate?

a. President Bush
(50%)
274,648

b. Senator Kerry
(48%)
261,622

c. I did not watch
(2%)
11,768

d. None of the above
(0%)
2,021

550,059 total votes

[Toolman]

I never watch fox.. either NBC or CNN..

[SlowLX]

I see a repeat of 92 right here..
Its absolutly useless arguing with you... :eek: I've never met anyone who could be so brainwashed by liberal bullshit, that they would make a branch davidian look sane. Pat yourself on the back, you fucking retard.

[The Punisher]

http://www.cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLITICS/10/14/snap.poll/index.html
Wonder why?
http://281r.no-ip.com/mustangtrends/members/upload/files/bat02.jpg

[Toolman]

3 weeks to go and we will find out..

[The Punisher]

I never watch fox.. either NBC or CNN..
So thats whats wrong with you, your brainwashed!

[sonic03gt]

Man, I can't wait 'till Bush wins this thing. :rolleyes:

Then there's a part of me that ALMOST wants Kerry to win, just so when things like unemployment get worse, I can say "told ya so". :p

But I'd rather not see things get worse.

[KJ94GT]

Yeah 9 1/2 years on the ground leading troops for 7 of those years, unlike you mugging down with your buddies on a love boat in the Navy.
Yea, whatever happened to your feable attempt at using educated terms instead of insults? I guess your little brain can't handle it.
Leading troops? To where, the latrine? Don't hate me because my job was more in-demand and rewarding than your's.
Shouldn't you be stimulating the minds of kids in Wylie right now instead of posting on here?

[utdbear]

Yea, whatever happened to your feable attempt at using educated terms instead of insults? I guess your little brain can't handle it.
Leading troops? To where, the latrine? Don't hate me because my job was more in-demand and rewarding than your's.
Shouldn't you be stimulating the minds of kids in Wylie right now instead of posting on here?
Please tell me that he is not teaching kids in Wylie.

[00ragtopGT]

Man, I can't wait 'till Bush wins this thing. :rolleyes:

Then there's a part of me that ALMOST wants Kerry to win, just so when things like unemployment get worse, I can say "told ya so". :p

But I'd rather not see things get worse.

Believe me, you DON'T, in any way, want Kerry to win. Before most of the forum members were born, there was a democrap president elected by the name of Jimmy Carter. He promised some of the same things that kerry is promising. After Carter took office, the country started on a downhill slide that had not been seen since the post-WWII recession. The military was nearly ruined, he let the USSR surpass us in strategic strength, and the inflation was the highest ever in US history. Some bonehead posted earlier about the deficit being Bush's problem. that is dead wrong. The deficit came about by the greatest president of all time, Ronald Reagan, fixing Carter's major mistakes. Reagan had to fix the military, fix inflation, and turn the country around. Well guess what, that take money. Blame Carter for the deficit and no one else. The presidents since Reagan could have done something to help reduce the deficit, but looking at the tendecies of the two parties, the dems history of tax-and-spend will never get us out of debt. Everytime the dems increase taxes, it slows down the economy, and royally screws the working class. If you don't agree, just look back at what happened in the first two years of the clinton administration. He and the dem controlled congress raised everyones taxes and the middle class buying power went downhill. The first conressional elections after clinton was president was a landslide for the republicans. The American voters sent a strong message to Washington that they didn't like the way clinton was doing business. With a republican controlled conress, that prevented clinton from totally ruining the country.

Kerry will be, by all indications, worse for the economy that Carter was. Worse for the military that both clinton and Carter. Worse for the protection of our own people against terrorists.

Kerry is a know liar, as are several of the democraps. Don't think so??? Look at the congressional record over the last eight years or so. Here is a website that proves or disproves e-mail rumors. It is not a political website by any means:
http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors/b/bushlied.htm
You have every opprtunity to verify for yourself who said what and when it was said. It is extremely obvious who the liars are when even the slightest research is done.

Uneducated people are dangerous to a democratic society. When one looks at the support base for the political parties, it becomes clear why the democrap policies are detrimental to the all the taxpaying citizens.

[Pro Trash]

Yea, whatever happened to your feable attempt at using educated terms instead of insults? I guess your little brain can't handle it.
Leading troops? To where, the latrine? Don't hate me because my job was more in-demand and rewarding than your's.
Shouldn't you be stimulating the minds of kids in Wylie right now instead of posting on here?

Both of my MOS's were in high demand and this is why, when I joined as an Infantryman I was given an enlistment bonus of $10,000. When I switched to the M1 series tanks four years later I recieved a 2 alpha re-up bonus of $20,000. Keep telling yourself whatever you want. I led troops in combat and peace time, you led yourself to the chow hall. Also I have no reason to hate someone I feel sorry for.

[Pro Trash]

Believe me, you DON'T, in any way, want Kerry to win. Before most of the forum members were born, there was a democrap president elected by the name of Jimmy Carter. He promised some of the same things that kerry is promising. After Carter took office, the country started on a downhill slide that had not been seen since the post-WWII recession. The military was nearly ruined, he let the USSR surpass us in strategic strength, and the inflation was the highest ever in US history. Some bonehead posted earlier about the deficit being Bush's problem. that is dead wrong. The deficit came about by the greatest president of all time, Ronald Reagan, fixing Carter's major mistakes. Reagan had to fix the military, fix inflation, and turn the country around. Well guess what, that take money. Blame Carter for the deficit and no one else. The presidents since Reagan could have done something to help reduce the deficit, but looking at the tendecies of the two parties, the dems history of tax-and-spend will never get us out of debt. Everytime the dems increase taxes, it slows down the economy, and royally screws the working class. If you don't agree, just look back at what happened in the first two years of the clinton administration. He and the dem controlled congress raised everyones taxes and the middle class buying power went downhill. The first conressional elections after clinton was president was a landslide for the republicans. The American voters sent a strong message to Washington that they didn't like the way clinton was doing business. With a republican controlled conress, that prevented clinton from totally ruining the country.

Kerry will be, by all indications, worse for the economy that Carter was. Worse for the military that both clinton and Carter. Worse for the protection of our own people against terrorists.

Kerry is a know liar, as are several of the democraps. Don't think so??? Look at the congressional record over the last eight years or so. Here is a website that proves or disproves e-mail rumors. It is not a political website by any means:
http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors/b/bushlied.htm
You have every opprtunity to verify for yourself who said what and when it was said. It is extremely obvious who the liars are when even the slightest research is done.

Uneducated people are dangerous to a democratic society. When one looks at the support base for the political parties, it becomes clear why the democrap policies are detrimental to the all the taxpaying citizens.


So once again you feel the republicans are never at fault for any debt?

[The Punisher]

Both of my MOS's were in high demand and this is why, when I joined as an Infantryman I was given an enlistment bonus of $10,000. When I switched to the M1 series tanks four years later I recieved a 2 alpha re-up bonus of $20,000. Keep telling yourself whatever you want. I led troops in combat and peace time, you led yourself to the chow hall. Also I have no reason to hate someone I feel sorry for.
You have a lot of nerve talking trash to a moderator

[TexasDevilDog]

So once again you feel the republicans are never at fault for any debt?

Republicans, democrats, it doesn't matter. The debt is caused by too much spending.

[Kaji]

You have a lot of nerve talking trash to a moderator

What's he going to do? Shoot him or something? It's a message board. People can have their own opinions about things.

[Pro Trash]

You have a lot of nerve talking trash to a moderator

When in Rome do as the Romans, I respect KJ for the fact he can dish it out as well as take it. You should follow his example, I guess you would have tried to have me banned for not agreeing with your ideals? That would be a communist type move and one of cowardice, he likes the conflict as much as I do, go back to the bench Jr., just because you agree with or like the opposing player doesn't mean you can't respect them.

[The Punisher]

What's he going to do? Shoot him or something? It's a message board. People can have their own opinions about things.True
;)

[Pro Trash]

What's he going to do? Shoot him or something? It's a message board. People can have their own opinions about things.

Thank you, the nice thing about this board is we get to push those opinions and insist they are the most correct :D

[The Punisher]

When in Rome do as the Romans, I respect KJ for the fact he can dish it out as well as take it. You should follow his example, I guess you would have tried to have me banned for not agreeing with your ideals? That would be a communist type move and one of cowardice, he likes the conflict as much as I do, go back to the bench Jr., just because you agree with or like the opposing player doesn't mean you can't respect them. I dont think attacking his military background is respecting him. And like you have any advice for me how to have a argument or debate on this site when you have been OWNED on this site more times than I can think of.

[Pro Trash]

Republicans, democrats, it doesn't matter. The debt is caused by too much spending.

Amen, all administrations do stupid stuff with our tax dollars.

[46Tbird]

So once again you feel the republicans are never at fault for any debt?I can tell you this, that historically, politicians offer handouts for votes. THAT is why we're in debt. The government is overburdened and underfunded because of social programs and entitlements.

I AM READY TO VOTE FOR A CHANGE TO THAT. I wanna slap the shit out of GWB for spending like he does, but I don't see Kerry being better. In fact, he's promised to SPEND MORE. Screw that. We need lower taxes and smaller federal government.

I look at the Dems pointing out all the social programs that aren't working in this country, and I have to laugh. It's no business of the federal government to be paying for them in the first place. We're taxed to death to fund them, there are no systems of oversight to ensure results, and the scope and number of individuals involved is too great for a single department to administer.

Remove the burden of these programs from the federal government, and move the responsibility to the states - just as the Constitution spells out.

[Pro Trash]

Man, I can't wait 'till Bush wins this thing. :rolleyes:

Then there's a part of me that ALMOST wants Kerry to win, just so when things like unemployment get worse, I can say "told ya so". :p

But I'd rather not see things get worse.

You are very warped :D

[The Punisher]

Amen, all administrations do stupid stuff with our tax dollars.WOW, I actually agree with you on something
:eek:

[Pro Trash]

I dont think attacking his military background is respecting him. And like you have any advice for me how to have a argument or debate on this site when you have been OWNED on this site more times than I can think of.

I only attack what is put on the field in front of me, don't put it there and I won't attack it. As for being owned, I know I own you little boy, don't you know it isn't polite to talk when grown folks are talking so I am afraid I am going to have to ask you to STFU. :p

[Pro Trash]

WOW, I actually agree with you on something
:eek:

And I am such a slut for bi-partisan resolutions :D

[99SVTour]

1. Rolling back taxcuts on the top 1 or 2%(whichever it is this week) will not pay for 10% of Kerry's health plan, let alone anything else. If he is elected he will eventually raise taxes across the board.

2. Raising taxes on those making over 200K a year plus raising minimum wage to 7 dollars an hour will put many many small businesses under and last time I checked putting small business under isn't how you further an economy.

some of Kerry's propaganda

1. We have not spent close to 200 billion on iraq, Kerry wants to lead the misinformed and his blind sheep to believe every dime we're spending on terrorism is going in some way to iraq. IT'S NOT. Almost half of this 200 billion is going to afghanistan and to major US cities.

2. 1.6 million jobs lost. BS. We have a job loss of somewhere between 500K and 800K depending on where you get your information. If you take into consideration the number of jobs lost due solely to 9/11 then it's clear that this administration is having little problem creating jobs unlike what kerry would like you to believe.

3. This admin. is outsourcing all our jobs. BS once more. We're currently outsourcing roughly 900K jobs. The countries we are outsourcing jobs too are currently employing nearly 3 million american workers here in our country. Do the dems suggest we take the jobs other countries are offering us here and keep all our jobs on this side of the pond as well? That sounds like a great incentive for other countries to continue sending us jobs from overseas and I'm sure that will make us a valued member of the global economy that is rising. or not...

[The Punisher]

And I am such a slut
Really? LMAO!

[The Punisher]

. As for being owned, I know I own you little boy,
Where and when? if you think handing out your phone number on the internet and making threats is OWNING a person, then you got a lot to learn young grasshopper.


don't you know it isn't polite to talk when grown folks are talking so I am afraid I am going to have to ask you to STFU. :p
Maybe you should take your own advice ;)

Man, I cant even count how many times Al P has owned you. LMAO!

[66Deuce]

It seems once again that Bush was edged out in the debate by Kerry. He did have some good points but was out gunned a little by Kerry.

I don't believe any of those claims. Even ABC news who recently was busted giving bias in favor of Kerry says on their poll that the debate was dead even.


http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/story?id=163784

[KJ94GT]

Please tell me that he is not teaching kids in Wylie.
He is. Ask him. He'll even give you his phone number.

[KJ94GT]

Both of my MOS's were in high demand and this is why, when I joined as an Infantryman I was given an enlistment bonus of $10,000. When I switched to the M1 series tanks four years later I recieved a 2 alpha re-up bonus of $20,000. Keep telling yourself whatever you want. I led troops in combat and peace time, you led yourself to the chow hall. Also I have no reason to hate someone I feel sorry for.
Wow. $10k. I was offer 5x that to stay in. What does this prove? Nothing. Move on.
You feel sorry for me? You have more reason to feel sorry for yourself.

[Cobra Commander]

I'd say Kerry had some things that made since, but seemed to be on the defensive about his record. I would say Bush won this debate by a fair margin. I did not like Bush's answer to the Assault Weapons Ban Question. It was questionable... I can't believe he said he was in support of extending the ban, but he was told that it wouldn't go through, so he neglected it by passing it through (ie para-phrasing)... He is not in support of the ban... From his body language, I felt he was lying and dodged the issue... The man has more guns than the North Korean Army... ;)