Does anybody here really believe in God?

[PWTRTXSS]

Like enough to blow up an abortion clinic or throw themselves off of a cliff in God's name?

[Denny]

God wouldn't ask or expect it from me.

[JimD]

Apparently there is, buncha fvckin wacko's in this world.

[goatman]

Originally posted by Denny
God wouldn't ask or expect it from me. Exactly.

[Gaber]

Originally posted by Denny
God wouldn't ask or expect it from me.

[PWTRTXSS]

Originally posted by Denny
God wouldn't ask or expect it from me.

Then why do some people get that message?

You would think that a loving God would not broadcast that type of thing.

Maybe that's a different God.

[Lane]

Originally posted by PWTRTXSS
Like enough to blow up an abortion clinic or throw themselves off of a cliff in God's name?

No, I wouldn't do anything crazy like that, but God did send His Son to die for you and me. THAT's pretty crazy.

[Monsoon X]

Originally posted by PWTRTXSS

Maybe that's a different God.

That's Allah! :eek: Did I just say that?

[Girls can too]

Originally posted by Monsoon X
That's Allah! :eek: Did I just say that?

Tsk-Tsk! hahaha! I do too but have never been told to do anything but supportive things. Even in my darkest hours, and I've had many, I've heard His voice telling me to be strong for a better time was ahead. He never lied once. :) I know of NO ONE else who's lived up to that. :cool: It's hard for me NOT to believe.

[Tommy Tutone]

Originally posted by Monsoon X
That's Allah! :eek: Did I just say that?

Maybe it is the decietful Lucifer?

[The Big Matt]

Originally posted by Monsoon X
That's Allah! :eek: Did I just say that?

Allah is the same God as the Christian God, and the Jewish God

same guy

[Monsoon X]

Originally posted by The Big Matt
Allah is the same God as the Christian God, and the Jewish God

same guy


Jewish and Christian God is the same. Not Allah but, if that's what you believe then so be it? Glad to see that you believe in God finally, though.

[1994SilverGT]

whos this god fellow you speak of? is he some world leader somewhere? cant say i have ever met him...

[The Big Matt]

Originally posted by Monsoon X
Jewish and Christian God is the same. Not Allah but, if that's what you believe then so be it? Glad to see that you believe in God finally, though.

who said i believed?

Actually Allah is based upon the same God

re read

[Girls can too]

Originally posted by 1994SilverGT
cant say i have ever met him...

He's been outta town on business. ;) I hear He's really good at His job. :p

[Monsoon X]

Originally posted by The Big Matt

Actually Allah is based upon the same God




based




Thanks. :p

[PWTRTXSS]

Originally posted by Lane
No, I wouldn't do anything crazy like that, but God did send His Son to die for you and me. THAT's pretty crazy.

Well if that's the case, would anyone be willing to sacrifice their own for God if he asked? I know... it seems far fetched but I remember from Sunday school that it has happened before.

But if God asked me to bomb something, I would do it. All He would have to do is supply the materials because that shit ain't coming out of my pocket. My name isn't Noah. And extra over-time at work to make up for the expenses isn't going to cut it. And I want all of the logistics worked out beforehand.

[Girls can too]

Originally posted by PWTRTXSS
Well if that's the case, would anyone be willing to sacrifice their own for God if he asked? I know... it seems far fetched but I remember from Sunday school that it has happened before.

But if God asked me to bomb something, I would do it. All He would have to do is supply the materials because that shit ain't coming out of my pocket. My name isn't Noah. And extra over-time at work to make up for the expenses isn't going to cut it. And I want all of the logistics worked out beforehand.

God provides. I just don't think he does for terroristic supplies. :p I could be wrong tho........and you're scaring me. hahaha! ;)

[Monsoon X]

Originally posted by PWTRTXSS
Well if that's the case, would anyone be willing to sacrifice their own for God if he asked? I know... it seems far fetched but I remember from Sunday school that it has happened before.



No. It's not far fetched. God tested Abraham. He told Abraham to sacrifice Isaac. A went to do it and right when he was coming down on the stroke, God said "hol' up son, I was just playing LOL. Go get that ram that's caught in the thicket over there and sacrifice it instead." (Yes, I embelished, for your entertainment) but, the point is. God wouldn't have you do something like that for real.

Now he did command the children of Israel to do stuff but that's another story and you gotta look at it from a whole. :D

[Christina03GT]

People belive in an afterlife where our "souls" will go after we die. I'll refer to this place as heaven, and it will stand for any afterlife location for any belief. Why do people belive in this? There is an easy explanation. We are a curious species,wanting the answers to everything, and wanting them now. But being raised gullible and fearful as well, we end up jumping to conclusions. If the answer to an important question isnt known, it's only a matter of time before people create their own answers to satisfy themselves.
It seems logical to say that we are going to a better place after we die, because that means our species has a purpose. "So even though it has no evidence, it is logical to assume we are going somewhere because we must have a purpose right?" Wrong! Everything would still be the same. Weather you lived on Earth or in Heaven, There still isnt really a point to that life that would satisfy us. You will be living just in a different place. And serving a God is no purpose-giving than serving our goverment. I'm not saying that some peoples beliefs are wrong. Facts are facts no matter what belief says. You're a machine built by a factory called society, and you will act and believe however they've raised you to. If your beliefs make you happy in your life,fine. Keep them. But make sure they are giving you a true sence of happiness and not ignorance. Ignorance is a bliss, but not truebliss. Dont let yourself be controlled by the theologies of this world. A god did'nt create religion; People created religion.

[nitrofreak]

Dont let yourself be controlled by the theologies of this world. A god did'nt create religion; People created religion.

I can only agree with part of this. If you get caught up in which religions are going to heaven, you've lost the point. I beg to differ on the creation of religion, though. Since the begining of time all we were asked to do is believe in God. We failed miserably in the begining, that's why we have to suffer. God cast his people about the earth not only to believe in him but to share the beauty of his grace with the world. People appear to have built the church, but people have no power on earth, only God. The truth is that nothing is here because people put it here. All things are created by God for God's glory. Anything that is not created in his name will be destroyed. The choice we are left with is whether or not we have faith in this fact.

I go to prepare a place for you in my fathers house. If I go ahead of you to prepare this place I will surely come back to bring you home.

I paraphrased this, but you get the idea. Who here wants to miss the chance to go HOME??

[Da Prez]

i wanna go home...:D

[TexasDevilDog]

Originally posted by The Big Matt
Allah is the same God as the Christian God, and the Jewish God

same guy

jehovah

\Je*ho"vah\, n. [Heb. usually y[e^]h[=o]v[=a]h (with the vowel points of [a^]d[=o]n[=a]i Lord), sometimes (to avoid repetition) y[e^]h[=o]vih (with the vowel points of [e^]l[=o]h[=i]m God); but only the four Heb, consonants yhvh are conceded to be certainly known.] A Scripture name of the Supreme Being, by which he was revealed to the Jews as their covenant God or Sovereign of the theocracy; the ``ineffable name'' of the Supreme Being, which was not pronounced by the Jews.

Yahweh \Yah"weh\, Yahwe \Yah"we\, n. Also Jahveh \Jah"veh\,Jahve \Jah"ve\, etc. A modern transliteration of the Hebrew word translated Jehovah in the Bible; -- used by some critics to discriminate the tribal god of the ancient Hebrews from the Christian Jehovah. Yahweh or Yahwe is the spelling now generally adopted by scholars.

allah

\Al"lah\, n. [ contr. fr. the article al the + ilah God.] The name of the Supreme Being, in use among the Arabs and the Mohammedans generally.

[TexasDevilDog]

Originally posted by PWTRTXSS
Like enough to blow up an abortion clinic or throw themselves off of a cliff in God's name?

I don't know of a place in the bible that Jesus says we should kill people that don't agree with us. So, no I would not do that.

[cobrajet69]

Does God exist?



The Bible says to have an answer for why you believe to those who ask you.



This is a good example of an answer to one of the most common reasons people give for ignoring God and His goodness.

A man went to a barbershop to have his hair and his beard cut as always. He began to have a good conversation with the barber who attended him.

They talked about so many things and various subjects. Suddenly, they touched on the subject of God.



The barber said: "Look man, I don't believe that God exists."! "Why do you say that?" asked the customer"Well, it's so easy, you just have to go out in the street to realize that God does not exist. Oh, tell me, if God exists,

would there be so many sick people? Would there be abandoned children?

If God exists, there would be neither suffering nor pain. I can't think

of loving a God who permits all of these things."

The customer thought for a moment, but he didn't respond because he did not want to start an argument. The barber finished his job and the customer left the shop.

Just after he left the barbershop, he saw a man in the street with long hair and a beard. It was very long, and a long time since he had his hair cut and he looked dirty and unkempt.

The customer entered the barbershop again and he said to the barber:
"You know what? Barbers do not exist."

"How can you say they don't exist?" asked the surprised barber. "I am here and I am a barber..... Why I just worked on you!"

"No!" the customer exclaimed..... "Barbers don't exist because if they did there would be no people with long hair and beard like that man who is outside."!



"Ah, barbers do exist, what happens is that people do not come to me."

Exactly!"- affirmed the customer. "That's the point! God does exist. What happens is people don't go to Him and do not look for Him. That's why there's so much pain and suffering in the world."



*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*

[nitrofreak]

That's a perfect story.....thanks for sharing that :)

[32VfromHell]

interesting story. I am a christian who doesnt quite follow the mantra of a lot of the more serious mantra's. I just dont like someone preaching to me their version of god, and i think that turns off a lot of people to hear someone preach what THEY think the bible means, and so forth.


With that said, there are just too many unexplainable things in this universe that can be accreddited to flukes/myth/legends. There must be a higher power.

[Wild Stallion]

Originally posted by 32VfromHell
interesting story. I am a christian who doesnt quite follow the mantra of a lot of the more serious mantra's. I just dont like someone preaching to me their version of god, and i think that turns off a lot of people to hear someone preach what THEY think the bible means, and so forth.


With that said, there are just too many unexplainable things in this universe that can be accreddited to flukes/myth/legends. There must be a higher power.
I agree with ya Ryan, I was raised in the Church of Christ, where dancing, cussing snd drinking are taboo, but I personally am a Christian, yet my interpretation allows myself to have beer or twelve every so often, I love to dance, and after 8 years as a Marine Grunt, I can make a sailor blush with my vocabulary. But the original question stands as does anybody here really beieve in God?
Yes I do, even though I have broken about 2/3 of the 10 commandments and still have my wine, women, and song. God does love me, you and yes,even JC :D. Denny said it iin the first reply with the belief that God wouldn't ask or expect it of me.
BTW, Cobrajet, that was one of the best stories I've read in God's existence.

[Mach1Marauder]

Way excellent parable-like story there cobrajet69!

[JackFlash19]

That's a great story. I've never heard it told like that.

[99SVTour]

Originally posted by Mach1Marauder
Way excellent parable-like story there cobrajet69!

what he said


that rocked dude

[hotrod66stang]

i don't really believe in god....and that story would only seem great to a believer (not meant to sound offensive). stories like that are made up by religious propagandists to promote "the word" and to promote more reverance and faith among christians. i get emails like that every single day and they all sound like jibberish by now. i would never give you guys flack for believing, not believing or anything to do with your beliefs. they are your own beliefs and i respect that....but c'mon with the cheesy stories already. looking for a barber and looking for an invisible entity are 2 way diff things. and don't say that he is everywhere and in everything b/c a non-believer wouldn't see that. thanks for letting me share in the discussion, keep up the good word(k)

[cobrajet69]

Originally posted by hotrod66stang
........................looking for a barber and looking for an invisible entity are 2 way diff things. ......................(k)

Very diplomatic response hr66 !

I will say this to your quote above; They are not two different things. They are both based on needs. One is governed by esthetics and the other by faith, which is the foundation for Christianity. If you need to look good, you seek out a barber. If you (Christians) need direction or understanding for the miracles of life and death, you seek out Christ. It's all about faith my friend!;)

[hotrod66stang]

good POV.....i'm diplomatic cuz i'm not gonna knock you guys/gals' beliefs and i'd like to learn more too. i don't think people would be too open to helping someone out with that if they were nothin but rude about it. < bryan

[bwilli13]

Fully agree with Hotrod66, a barber and God are two totaly different thigs. That story, although well thought out, offers no substance to a guy who doesn't know what to believe. Not saying there is or isn't a God, just don't see how the story relates. The decision to believe or not to can't be based on that. So again, the question, how do you know there is a God?

[bwilli13]

By the way, I am the type of person that would like solid, tangible, proof of something in order to fully believe in it, but I wanted to share with you a response to my previous question. I think it is the most thought provoking answer I have heard to this date.
A believer an I were discussing the existance of God, an of course I asked "How do you know for sure there is a God?"
His response:
"I spend my whole life serving God, if I am wrong, then I lived a good, honest life, but if you are wrong..."
And he left it at that.

[JKD]

This board having a theology forum is the perfect example of Sunday Christians. First time I logged on and saw that I couldnt stop laughing. I guess all those views in the "Dont tell my husband" they felt guilty from thier brainwashed upbringing then had to come here to repent/preach LOL.

Simply put, there is no proof of heaven or hell. Religion is a man made thing from long ago to teach morality in a very basic way. Ever since you were young, you've been told certain things. Be it - if you do this, you are going to a bad place. If you dont believe, you wont go to heaven. If you repent, you will be forgiven etc etc etc. It's human instinct to self preserve and being told very scary things like that as a child has an effect ( each person reacts differently of course) Your brain spends its whole life keeping you alive and its hard to comprehend for some people that one day they wont exist and go on to some other glorious place to relieve their conscience.

All this faith put in a book written from a long time ago is really odd to me. Something magical happens with some people when they see something put into print "it just has to be true". The bible reminds me of that game you played in school. The whole class sits in a big circle. One person whispers something to the person's ear to their right and the next person passes it along to the next and so on until its made its way all the way back to the original person who repeats it outloud for all to hear and its never the original statement. The statement is lost, confused or ignorantly changed.

I believe in what we do have proof of- the human side of us. In all the faults of humans, you have the power to forgive, show compassion and understanding. Why live your life with these bonds of religion to make you a better person? You are human first and foremost. When something happens people give credit to "God" instead of themselves for having strength to endure whatever happened, but thats just human instinct to survive and go on. Someone cant explain something that happened "must have been God's will" thats just ignorance. It's also a little odd to me that religous people are so morbid. Ever notice how much of their life is based on death and where they are going afterwards? Wasting the life they know they have to prepare to go to a "better" place just seems to be a sad wasteof precious time.

Dont get me wrong, I'm not bashing anyone who is religous, I'm just giving a different viewpoint. If "God" is what someone needs to write their personal strength off to , to get through their day then thats ok with me. But it would be so much better if people would liberate themselves of the bonds of religion and give where credit is due for the strength and courage to live their lives - themselves- you would find the true definition of life.

[JackFlash19]

.......:rolleyes:

[MoonDog]

Originally posted by JKD
This board having a theology forum is the perfect example of Sunday Christians. First time I logged on and saw that I couldnt stop laughing. I guess all those views in the "Dont tell my husband" they felt guilty from thier brainwashed upbringing then had to come here to repent/preach LOL.
Good for them. Glad they are here.
Originally posted by JKD
Simply put, there is no proof of heaven or hell. Religion is a man made thing from long ago to teach morality in a very basic way.
Outside the moon and the sun have you seen another planet? You have seen images in books and tv but who says they are real? Do you believe they exist just because scientists say so, we all know scientists never lie. What proof do we have that there are other planets out there? I say Heaven and Hell are just as real as the other planets that no one has ever been to.
Originally posted by JKD
The bible reminds me of that game you played in school. The whole class sits in a big circle. One person whispers something to the person's ear to their right and the next person passes it along to the next and so on until its made its way all the way back to the original person who repeats it outloud for all to hear and its never the original statement. The statement is lost, confused or ignorantly changed.
I mentioned in another post about the Dead Sea Scrolls. They were written somewhere around 250 BC. When they compared them with the biblical texts that we use today they were 95% accurate down to the letter. The 5% error was nothing more that spelling errors. There we also no doctrinal differences between the two. These were men being led by God, not little first graders in a circle. :rolleyes: So much for your theory.
Originally posted by JKD
It's also a little odd to me that religous people are so morbid. Ever notice how much of their life is based on death and where they are going afterwards? Wasting the life they know they have to prepare to go to a "better" place just seems to be a sad wasteof precious time.
Here you are wrong son. Christians are obsessed with life. God gave His only Son to die for us so that we might live. It is the non-believers that are morbid. We tell them all the time that Christ is life but they would rather die eternally. That is what is odd.
Originally posted by JKD
Dont get me wrong, I'm not bashing anyone who is religous,
But you just did.

I see you are a wannabe Zen Master.
ZEN A school of Mahayana Buddhism that asserts that enlightenment can be attained through meditation, self-contemplation, and intuition rather than through faith and devotion.
Buddhism A religion based on the teaching of Buddha that life is permeated with suffering caused by desire, that suffering ceases when desire ceases, and that enlightenment obtained through right conduct, wisdom, and meditation releases one from desire, suffering, and rebirth.

I guess your a religious person yourself.
Originally posted by JKD
But it would be so much better if people would liberate themselves of the bonds of religion and give where credit is due for the strength and courage to live their lives - themselves- you would find the true definition of life.
Jesus said that His yoke is easy and His burden light. Doesn't sound like it is us that are bound, but the unbeliever that is bound by sin. He also said that He is the Way, the Truth, and the Life. So Jesus is Life, that is the true definition. Jesus is the answer for everything, you cant find the answer by looking within yourself because since man has flaws and is a liar how can you find out the meaning of life by looking within yourself. It doesn't add up.

[cobrajet69]

Originally posted by JKD
This board having a theology forum is the perfect example of Sunday Christians. First time I logged on and saw that I couldnt stop laughing. I guess all those views in the "Dont tell my husband" they felt guilty from thier brainwashed upbringing then had to come here to repent/preach LOL.

Dont get me wrong, I'm not bashing anyone who is religous


Sounds like bashing to me :confused:



When something happens people give credit to "God" instead of themselves for having strength to endure whatever happened, but thats just human instinct to survive and go on. Someone cant explain something that happened "must have been God's will" thats just ignorance.


You denying the "possibility" that it is God's will has/does intervene is ignorance on your part - yes or no? What if you're wrong?






Wasting the life they know they have to prepare to go to a "better" place just seems to be a sad wasteof precious time.

Opinion noted!
I tend to agree that many people give up too much of the "spice of life" to the fear that they won't get into heaven, but remember, it is their life and your opinion of a sad waist of time is your version of how they should be spending their time.



But it would be so much better if people would liberate themselves of the bonds of religion


Not bonds...........beliefs




......give where credit is due for the strength and courage to live their lives - themselves- you would find the true definition of life.



Do you believe that you have found the true defination of life, and do you believe that these Christians are wrong if they have a different opinion of the "true meaning of life"?

You've made a valiant effort in stating your views but I think you catagorize all Christians into one group of religious zealots and bible thumpers who have no "love for life" and come on here to repent and preach. I doubt anyone on here believes he/she is repenting by debating views of Christianity. As for preaching, some of that probably does go on in here but it's not my intent. ;)

[Monsoon X]

God punishes them, because what can be known about God is plain to them, for God himself made it plain. 20 Ever since God created the world, his invisible qualities, both his eternal power and his divine nature, have been clearly seen; they are perceived in the things that God has made. So those people have no excuse at all! R4 21 They know God, but they do not give him the honor that belongs to him, nor do they thank him. Instead, their thoughts have become complete nonsense, and their empty minds are filled with darkness. R5 22 They say they are wise, but they are fools; 23 instead of worshiping the immortal God, they worship images made to look like mortals or birds or animals or reptiles. R6 24 And so God has given those people over to do the filthy things their hearts desire, and they do shameful things with each other. 25 They exchange the truth about God for a lie; they worship and serve what God has created instead of the Creator himself, who is to be praised forever! Amen. 26 Because they do this, God has given them over to shameful passions. Even the women pervert the natural use of their sex by unnatural acts. 27 In the same way the men give up natural sexual relations with women and burn with passion for each other. Men do shameful things with each other, and as a result they bring upon themselves the punishment they deserve for their wrongdoing.

[01WhiteCobra]

Originally posted by JKD

Dont get me wrong, I'm not bashing anyone who is religous,

Good, since, wouldn't you be bashing yourself, "Zen Master"?

[AdamLX]

Originally posted by MoonDog
Good for them. Glad they are here.

Outside the moon and the sun have you seen another planet? You have seen images in books and tv but who says they are real? Do you believe they exist just because scientists say so, we all know scientists never lie. What proof do we have that there are other planets out there? I say Heaven and Hell are just as real as the other planets that no one has ever been to.

Galileo must be turning over in his grave with that statement. Anyone can go to a toy store and buy an $80 telescope and see many different planets. I think seeing with your own eyes is proof enough.

[MoonDog]

Originally posted by AdamLX
Galileo must be turning over in his grave with that statement. Anyone can go to a toy store and buy an $80 telescope and see many different planets. I think seeing with your own eyes is proof enough.
Until he goes out and buys one of those $80 telescopes and has proof for himself then he is solely relying on what others are telling him and he has faith that what they are saying is true.

[AdamLX]

Originally posted by MoonDog
Until he goes out and buys one of those $80 telescopes and has proof for himself then he is solely relying on what others are telling him and he has faith that what they are saying is true.

Or on those night that you can see Venus or Mars with the naked eye. You can go buy a telescope and see the physical beings themselves or you can buy a bible and solely rely on what others are telling you.

[Monsoon X]

Originally posted by AdamLX
Or on those night that you can see Venus or Mars with the naked eye. You can go buy a telescope and see the physical beings themselves or you can buy a bible and solely rely on what others are telling you.

I'm not commenting on the telescope/planet thing but, about the second part; If you buy a bible you are solely relying on what your read, not what others tell you.........(and you are reading from a true book)

[AdamLX]

Originally posted by Monsoon X
I'm not commenting on the telescope/planet thing but, about the second part; If you buy a bible you are solely relying on what your read, not what others tell you.........(and you are reading from a true book)

True. I'm touching more on what Moon Dog said about taking what someone else is telling you for a fact without seeing it for yourself. Some what like the bible is based on a true story, but as man has tendency to do, has been embellished over time to push home certain ideals and what-not to fit someone's agenda of what they believe needs to be.

[Krysie]

Originally posted by MoonDog
Good for them. Glad they are here.

Outside the moon and the sun have you seen another planet? You have seen images in books and tv but who says they are real? Do you believe they exist just because scientists say so, we all know scientists never lie. What proof do we have that there are other planets out there? I say Heaven and Hell are just as real as the other planets that no one has ever been to.



Are you serious?? :confused:

I am on the fence about the whole subject, but I just can't believe that you actually believe that comment.

~K~

[Monsoon X]

Originally posted by AdamLX
True. I'm touching more on what Moon Dog said about taking what someone else is telling you for a fact without seeing it for yourself. Some what like the bible is based on a true story, but as man has tendency to do, has been embellished over time to push home certain ideals and what-not to fit someone's agenda of what they believe needs to be.

Yes, but, God ensures us that His word is everlasting and infallable. And it has proven to be so. (ie...no innacuracies or contradictions) And nothing new has been added for hundreds of years. I'm not the least bit concerned about malicious intent. God has protected it from that.

[JKD]

Grrrr, I've tried to type this out twice now and I take too long then it logs me out. One last try :)

First, I AM NOT bashing anyone, just adding to the conversation and including my opinions. This is a discussion and I'm not being aggressive, so slow your roll there tiger ;)

Secondly, please note I said "Sunday Christians" and not Christians in general. One thing that really turned me off from religion is the Church itself. All those "Sunday Christians/Catholics" who preach and judge everyone else around them, but then the rest of the week they are back to they're same regular routine because they know the next Sunday they will be forgiven.

mentioned in another post about the Dead Sea Scrolls. They were written somewhere around 250 BC. When they compared them with the biblical texts that we use today they were 95% accurate down to the letter. The 5% error was nothing more that spelling errors. There we also no doctrinal differences between the two. These were men being led by God, not little first graders in a circle. So much for your theory.

A maybe a bit drastic of a analogy on my part, but it was I thought of at the time. Too me, its a book with some actually neat stories, but still provides me no proof. I didnt need to read Dr.Seuss to know that I wouldnt like Green Eggs and Ham either. Take 100 people that witnessed a car wreck and you will get at least 50 different versions. The bible has been interpreted from several languages , over years and generations.

Here you are wrong son. Christians are obsessed with life. God gave His only Son to die for us so that we might live. It is the non-believers that are morbid. We tell them all the time that Christ is life but they would rather die eternally. That is what is odd.

A bit judgemental to tell me that my opinion is wrong. I'm very open minded all I'm asking for is some proof. Let's say that I'm a misguided sole, what proof can you give me? I was raised in a Catholic family and even went to a Catholic school when I was young. Never saw anything but hypocrites that would say one thing on Sunday but lead their lives another way. The Church turned me off from religion, thats the honest truth I can give you.

see you are a wannabe Zen Master.

It's sarcasm. No different then the same person judging me that has a war reference for an avatar, but I dont take it too seriously.

ZEN A school of Mahayana Buddhism that asserts that enlightenment can be attained through meditation, self-contemplation, and intuition rather than through faith and devotion.

Very true. But as with anything, its all in the interpretation of the individual. I'm not a Buddhist, I cant get pass the pacifist part. I'm work in progress, but its honest work. You can ask PWTRSS (Robert who started this thread) that I take personal devolpment very seriously. I'm open minded, teach me. But dont teach me something that you read out of a book and cant interpret for yourself. I'm a teacher myself, but I teach from first hand expierence not from what some book or preacher told me. Lets have an honest discussion.

[JKD]

Originally posted by cobrajet69
Sounds like bashing to me :confused:



When something happens people give credit to "God" instead of themselves for having strength to endure whatever happened, but thats just human instinct to survive and go on. Someone cant explain something that happened "must have been God's will" thats just ignorance.


You denying the "possibility" that it is God's will has/does intervene is ignorance on your part - yes or no? What if you're wrong?






Wasting the life they know they have to prepare to go to a "better" place just seems to be a sad wasteof precious time.

Opinion noted!
I tend to agree that many people give up too much of the "spice of life" to the fear that they won't get into heaven, but remember, it is their life and your opinion of a sad waist of time is your version of how they should be spending their time.



But it would be so much better if people would liberate themselves of the bonds of religion


Not bonds...........beliefs




......give where credit is due for the strength and courage to live their lives - themselves- you would find the true definition of life.



Do you believe that you have found the true defination of life, and do you believe that these Christians are wrong if they have a different opinion of the "true meaning of life"?

You've made a valiant effort in stating your views but I think you catagorize all Christians into one group of religious zealots and bible thumpers who have no "love for life" and come on here to repent and preach. I doubt anyone on here believes he/she is repenting by debating views of Christianity. As for preaching, some of that probably does go on in here but it's not my intent. ;)

You've made some interesting points.

Sounds like bashing to me :confused :

Not at all. Just having a discussion. Dont take it as heated or aggressive just because I dont agree with it.

You denying the "possibility" that it is God's will has/does intervene is ignorance on your part - yes or no? What if you're wrong?

Honestly, I just dont know. I do believe anything is possible, I just find it very difficult to believe. Am I ignorant? Of course, I've never claimed to know everything, but I do know myself very well. What if I am wrong? I better drink all the ice tea I can now. I dont want to go through life in fear of what could possibly happen on something that may not exist. All I can do is try and be the best person I can be. And if I am wrong, I do hope to meet this "God" person, Ive got alot to ask him about why he allows the things he does to happen - happen.

Not bonds...........beliefs

Another matter of perspective. Like I said, I'm all for people living their lives on what they truly believe. We have "free will" for a reason.

[MoonDog]

Originally posted by Krysie
Are you serious?? :confused:

I am on the fence about the whole subject, but I just can't believe that you actually believe that comment.

~K~

Look people, you are taking me literally. Yes, I believe there are other planets out there! My point is that in everyday life we read the paper we listen to the news we hear what this scientist or that scientist is saying and we all take it as gospel. But when it comes to the Bible everyone wants proof. :rolleyes: How come people are so quick to have faith in science and what man has to say and so slow to have faith in God? It makes absolutely no sense to me and is quite illogical. You can have faith in both.

[JKD]

Originally posted by MoonDog
Look people, you are taking me literally. Yes, I believe there are other planets out there! My point is that in everyday life we read the paper we listen to the news we hear what this scientist or that scientist is saying and we all take it as gospel. But when it comes to the Bible everyone wants proof. :rolleyes: How come people are so quick to have faith in science and what man has to say and so slow to have faith in God? It makes absolutely no sense to me and is quite illogical. You can have faith in both.

Science by defintion is an equation to a matter of definete conclusion. Religion is faith based, people just believe because they choose to. That's why usually you will see so many agnositcs/aethiests that are scientists. The two subjects together will never make sense. See : comparing apples to oranges.

[MoonDog]

Originally posted by JKD
Science by defintion is an equation to a matter of definete conclusion. Religion is faith based, people just believe because they choose to. That's why usually you will see so many agnositcs/aethiests that are scientists. The two subjects together will never make sense. See : comparing apples to oranges.
Actually science by definition is:

The observation, identification, description, experimental investigation, and theoretical explanation of phenomena.

In other words, it takes faith to believe everything that science claims. Science can not be definite since it changes all the time. On the other hand, the Bible is definite since it has never changed.

[JKD]

Originally posted by MoonDog
Actually science by definition is:

The observation, identification, description, experimental investigation, and theoretical explanation of phenomena.

In other words, it takes faith to believe everything that science claims. Science can not be definite since it changes all the time. On the other hand, the Bible is definite since it has never changed.

The reason the Bible never changes because the people who wrote it are dead. If anyone added to it the whole world would be in a uproar. Cant even have a simple conversation with some of them without someone gettin upset about it. Dont dare question thier beliefs ! :eek: Ask for explaination or proof and get nothing. Kinda makes one think.....

[cobrajet69]

My brain hurts!:(

[bwilli13]

just wanted to point out that the sun and the moon are not planets

[cobrajet69]

Originally posted by bwilli13
just wanted to point out that the sun and the moon are not planets


If you read that some where, it doesn't count! :p

[MoonDog]

Originally posted by bwilli13
just wanted to point out that the sun and the moon are not planets
Big woop, the sun is a star and the moon is a satalite. OK, we all know how smart you are now.

[bwilli13]

calm down, it was just an observation



I love you

[Krysie]

Originally posted by MoonDog
Look people, you are taking me literally. Yes, I believe there are other planets out there! My point is that in everyday life we read the paper we listen to the news we hear what this scientist or that scientist is saying and we all take it as gospel. But when it comes to the Bible everyone wants proof. :rolleyes: How come people are so quick to have faith in science and what man has to say and so slow to have faith in God? It makes absolutely no sense to me and is quite illogical. You can have faith in both.


Well I am fine with that. Like I said in my post I am really on the fence. I have certainly had things happen to me spiritually that I can't explain, yet science speaks to me as well. I certainly wouldn't imagine of getting married anywhere BUT a church. Just a little difficult you know. Sorry if I took you too literally ;) I just couldn't believe that you thought that way.

I don't think I am looking for proof. A lot of times when I am down, and things get bad, I pray and turn to God for help. He usually guides me in the right direction. However, there are scientific facts I believe as well. It's a real tough call. And I will NEVER knock someone for their beliefs. You can count on that.

~K~

[The Punisher]

Originally posted by Krysie


I don't think I am looking for proof. A lot of times when I am down, and things get bad, I pray and turn to God for help. He usually guides me in the right direction. However, there are scientific facts I believe as well. It's a real tough call. And I will NEVER knock someone for their beliefs. You can count on that.

~K~ Is there any scientific facts you believe in that counter your belief in God? iif so, what are they?:)